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Zen-Ray 9x36

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/22/2010 at 22:14
mobowhunter View Drop Down
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Has anyone pre-ordered the new zen ray 9x36 ED2.  I looked through my first pair of ed2's today and i was blown away.  they are miles ahead of nikon and my vortex binos i have been looking for a new set of binos and as soon as i got home from the 3-d i ordered a set of the 9x36 ed2. now as long as i get them before sept 15 it will be great.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/23/2010 at 09:45
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I haven't looked through any of Zen Rays products, but I hear nothing but stellar reviews from the people that have actually handled them. I think your in good shape!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/23/2010 at 13:57
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9 power, 4mm exit pupil. FOV: 371' @ 1000 yards.  ED glass.  Water repellent coating.

Sounds like a great all-around binocular.

I'll be watching this one.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/23/2010 at 15:48
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I can't comment on the 9x36, but I just ordered the 8x43 ED2 and used them hunting for the first time last weekend.  Your eyes tell you it's way to dark to hunt, but the bins tell a different story...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/24/2010 at 15:54
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I like the spec of 371 ft FOV too. Seems to be a good all around bino between 8x and 10x

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 15:12
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I own the 7X36 ED2s and I like them; they're beright and clear; that said, the Minox HGs are brighter and the whites are whiter imho, but the ED2s let in more light than their predecessor Zen-Rs did.  It's the money thing...the Schott glass in Minox HG and
Zeiss Victory bins are brighter but they cost more; you'll have to pick up each in a 2 force choice comparison and see if they are worth the extra. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 16:14
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whitney sounds like a broken record.  Every time someone gives props to a particular bino he comes back with the same old Minox line........
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 16:44
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I understand that Schott has a subsidiary relationship with Zeiss, but I was unaware that Zeiss Victory Bins were using the same raw glass as the Minox HG series.  I don't see Zeiss advertising that.  I also didn't know that The ED2s "let in more light" than the ED1s.  I thought they had the same aperture.

whitneymouse,

Where did you get this information?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 17:44
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That is because it's true. It may be the same but it's true; I thought the purpose of this forum was to help people.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 17:52
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Cross referencing the information on the Zeiss and Minox websites and search the references that Wikepedia has for Zeiss and Minox and read between the linesl.  Zeiss and Minox use Schott produced glass that is the common thread between Zeiss and Minox's lenses.   I've noticed that their glass produces a whiter image than other bins in my experience.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 19:07
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Whitney:
It is very doubtful that anyone here would know the exact glass recipe that any binocular mfr. may use when making their optics.
These are proprietary secrets and Wiki, would not know either.
 
Even if the same glass type was used on one of the many lenses of each models mfr. the coatings and
binocular design are what is important.
 
This is an area where an internet search will not give you the full story.  I do agree with you that a quality
Schott, made glass would be better than a Chinese wannabe.
 
Jerry
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 19:41
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Originally posted by NDhunter NDhunter wrote:

Whitney:
It is very doubtful that anyone here would know the exact glass recipe that any binocular mfr. may use when making their optics.
These are proprietary secrets and Wiki, would not know either.
 
Even if the same glass type was used on one of the many lenses of each models mfr. the coatings and
binocular design are what is important.
 
This is an area where an internet search will not give you the full story.  I do agree with you that a quality
Schott, made glass would be better than a Chinese wannabe.
 
Jerry

Was just replying to the question; that said, there's something to the glass, I've noticed that Leica, Zeiss and Minox bins have that "White" calrity to their views; I'm no expert just observant and sharing here.  It was this forum and the bird ones that led me to Minox and the Chinese glasses in the first place.

Worth mentioning is that the center focus mechanism on the Zen-Rays are unequalled by any European or Japanese bin I've tried so far.    

An outstanding component of the Chinese
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 19:46
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Whitney,

I only ask because I don't want to "read between the lines."  Like many on here I am curious about the optics industry, and how these wonderful products move from raw materials to finished instrument.  It sounded like you had the lowdown on Zeiss and Minox.

I have also heard that Zeiss uses Meopta-sourced raw glass, and Meopta may even assemble some Zeiss products.  If we are speculating, then I would Guess that an optical giant like Zeiss sources glass from many different suppliers for different products and uses.

I agree with NDHunter that it seems the coatings and overall binocular design do more for performance than raw glass.  I would add that quality control is equally important.  I would even guess that that Chinese glass is pretty darn similar to the raw stuff coming into the Minox factory.  It is what they do with that raw glass that gives us the wide array of performance optics we have to choose from.

I am also confused about the "whiter" image.  Are you referring to lack of color bias?  As in:  The whites are whiter, the blacks are blacker, etc.?  If so, I can say with confidence that my 10X43 ZEN ED1s are extremely neutral.

I almost ordered one of those discounted Minox HG 8.5 X 42s but  a 6.1 deg. field of view is just too narrow for an 8.5 power binocular.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 19:57
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Matt:
 
Just to agree with you about the 8.5x power.  I have had experience with a large array, but have
settled on my Swaro. EL 8.5x42 as just my favorite.  This one has 7.4 deg. of pure viewing pleasure,
wide field of view, and easier to handhold than my 10x.  Also brighter at lowlight than the 10's.
 
I shouldn't steal the thread from the others.  They are also good at their price points.
 
Jerry
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 21:53
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Originally posted by NDhunter NDhunter wrote:

Whitney:
It is very doubtful that anyone here would know the exact glass recipe that any binocular mfr. may use when making their optics.
These are proprietary secrets and Wiki, would not know either.
 
Even if the same glass type was used on one of the many lenses of each models mfr. the coatings and
binocular design are what is important.
 
This is an area where an internet search will not give you the full story.  I do agree with you that a quality
Schott, made glass would be better than a Chinese wannabe.
 
Jerry

You are quite right about that Jerry.  You probably saw this post on the bird forums, but I thought it was most informative about HD glass.  I believe the poster is a optical engineer of some sort...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by tpcollins 
Is this Zeiss' version of HD glass or not? Thanks.
Keep in mind that "FL" and "HD" are meaningless marketing terms used mostly to conceal what kind of glass is really used.

Only Minox, to its credit, comes right out and tells us that SCHOTT N-PK52A is the ED glass used in its so-called APO binoculars. It's almost certain that Zeiss also uses SCHOTT glass since SCHOTT AG and Zeiss AG are two parts of the same company. If Leica and Swarovski are sourcing their glass in Europe they're probably buying from SCHOTT also.

The current SCHOTT catalogue lists three glass types that could be called "ED":

N-PK51 with a Vd number of about 77 on an Abbe diagram of glass types
N-PK52A with a Vd of about 81.5
N-FK51A with a Vd of about 84.5

None of these are very close to the "gold standards" of low dispersion materials, which are Fluorite (CaF2) and Ohara FPL53, both with Vd of about 95 (the higher the Vd, the lower the dispersion). The most likely candidate for "FL" glass is N-FK51A, since it's a fluoride containing glass with the highest Vd of anything in the current SCHOTT catalogue, except Fluorite.

BTW, the type of ED glass only tells us what potential CA correction is possible. The mating glass types and the total design will determine whether that potential is reached. That's one good reason for not revealing the ED glass type, so that consumers aren't tempted to rely solely on the Vd number as a shorthand predictor for quality.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/30/2010 at 23:04
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Matt,

I just jumped into this forum and it probably shows and the finer distinctions of glass and their optical terms is in the process of acquisition.  As I said, it was through this forum I got my initiation into the Zen-Ray bins and the MInox HG series gear.   My experimental psychology comes from the narrow area of acoustics; but, it has application to this discussion within optical topics, too. 

Apologize to playing loose with the definitions and descriptions; I primarily just like great optical gear and what it allows me to see with my vision corrected eye sight.

I learned a lot from this forum when I jumped into the pool about 6 months ago.  Enjoy the fund of knowledge here.   
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/31/2010 at 09:54
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Worry not, Whitney, like you, I am here to learn from the many people here more knowledgeable than me. That is why I asked for clarification.

I believe Zen Ray is putting out a product that supplies the best optical value going in binoculars. The 9x36 configuration has an impressive list of specs. It could be a real winner if optical aberrations are well controlled. I can't wait to read a good comparative review here on the OT!

    
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2010 at 19:19
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A note to the original post.  The Zen Ray ED 9x36 ED2 probably won't be out till November.  I would have pre ordered them if they would have had a chance for the hunting season.  I'll likely get my hands on a set when they are ready.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/13/2010 at 17:03
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Steve, we have been working very hard to pull in the schedule for the 9x36 ED2.  Looks like we should have them in our warehouse later this week. SWFA is on our priority list to receive the first shipment.
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