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Zen Ray 7x36 ED, Zeiss 7x42 FL and Nikon 7x35 E co

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/21/2009 at 21:48
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I enjoyed another forum member’s four way binocular shootout so much that I decided to do one of my own. In my case I decided to do a three way shootout of the 7x glasses that I have on hand…the 7x36 Zen Ray ED II, the Nikon 7x35 E and the Zeiss 7x42 FL. I am going to break this down into most of the usual optical, mechanical and ergonomic characteristics so you can pull from it what you like.
 


The 7x35 E might seem like an unusual binocular to put into this comparison but I think it continues to provide some excellent optical performance despite the fact that the design is dated and has its drawbacks. I seem to remember a thread here on the forums questioning what the ‘best” 7x35 binocular ever made might have been. The 7x35 E received quite a few votes if I remember correctly. Optically the bin provides an extremely sharp, colorful view with very little noticeable chromatic aberration present. Edge sharpness is also one of its strong points. Physically the binocular is lightweight and the open hinge design is very ergonomic for my hands.

The 7x42 FL is often considered to be one of the best binoculars in the world for its overall optical performance. It has been on the market for a good five years now and has seen several revisions to its body though few, if any, changes to its optical design. It provides an image that is rivaled by few binoculars currently on the market. The image is exceptionally bright, sharp in the center of the field and very well corrected for chromatic aberration.

The new kid on the block is the Zen Ray 7x36 ED 2. It sports a bit of combination of the strong points of each of the two previous binoculars. It has the open-bridge design similar to the Nikon while also featuring the wide field of view of the Zeiss. It also shares a low level of chromatic aberration with both of the other models.

Now that you have an idea of each of the three models lets look at the comparisons for various optical, mechanical and ergonomic characteristics. All characteristics are “apparent” in nature and should not be misinterpreted as the result of strict scientific “testing”. I never professed to be anything other than an “average Joe” so please be kind enough not to read anything extra into this “sharing of comparative experiences”.

Optical Performance

Brightness:

It should be no surprise that the Zeiss shines here…pun intended. Even if it did not use Abbe-Koenig prisms the larger objective size and Zeiss’s coatings make this one bright binocular…brighter than most, if not all, of the other 7x42 and 8x42 binoculars on the market…not to mention 7x30-somethings. Still, both the Nikon and the Zen Ray hold there own, obviously throughout the day and well into “bird-able” twilight. Even now, at 8:00 pm with the sun down below the horizon all three models provide satisfactorily bright images at the typical 20-60 yard distances.

No, my real interest here is whether or not the Zen Ray performs at the same level, or slightly better, than the Nikon considering both the objective size similarity and the roof/porro prism designs. As I continue to use both bins as the night progresses I see an ever so slight difference. The Zen ED is just a hair brighter in these fading light conditions. Is it substantial? No, but it is noticeable. The Zeiss, of course, shows a markedly brighter image the deeper into night that we go.

Contrast:

Though the Zeiss is “above average” in its presentation of contrast the discussion of its particular representation of contrast has often been kicked around. It does not have quite the apparent contrast of the Leica Ultravid, known in particular for this characteristic, but I find it comparable to just about anything else out there. The little Nikon is also better than average but not quite at the level of either the Zeiss or the Zen Ray. This was particularly noticeable during the middle of the day but continues to be so as light fades.

I want to take the time to tie in color bias with this issue because I feel that the two are extremely related. Binoculars that have a cold “blue-green” tend to make objects of those colors jump out a bit more than those binoculars that are color neutral and/or that favor the warm side of the color spectrum. The Zeiss appears either slightly blue/green or entirely neutral depending on what you compare it to and under what conditions you do the comparing. The little Nikon seems entirely neutral. The Zen Ray shows the ever so slightest hint of a warm bias but only in direct comparison with the Zeiss and the Nikon. Consequently red/orange and yellow objects seem to show more apparent contrast in the image.

Chromatic Aberration:

As I mentioned in my introduction I think all three models show above average ability in suppressing chromatic aberration…color fringing on high contrast objects. The Zeiss is, arguably, the best at it. You can see very faint traces of it in a small outer percentage of the image but the rest of the field is gloriously free from it. The Zen comes very close to equaling this feat. Only under extremely high contrast conditions do I begin to notice a higher level of it and only in a slightly larger percentage of the image not necessarily to a more severe degree. The Nikon controls CA almost as well overall as the Zen Ray but I see a bit more of it filtering into the image under a variety of conditions.

Apparent sharpness/Edge sharpness:

All three binoculars provide excellent apparent sharpness especially across the center of the field…the “sweet spot” if you will. The Nikon provides the best edge sharpness of the three with only a slight amount of apparent field curvature in the outer 5-10% of the image. Both the Zen Ray and the Zeiss suffer from a noticeably narrow sweet spot but consider that both offer a substantially wider field of view (450 feet on the Zeiss, 477 on the Zen Ray in comparison to the 383 feet of the Nikon). I have not done any side by side measurements yet between the three bins but I would be willing to bet that despite the better edge performance the physical width of the usable image is wider in the Zen Ray and Zeiss.

The Zeiss suffer from noticeable astigmatism around the outer edge of the image…I would say, conservatively, the outer 25%. The Zen Ray seem to have a similar percentage of the image distorted, maybe slightly greater, but in the case of the Zen Ray it is field curvature. This does give one the impression of greater depth of field under certain conditions.

Depth of field/depth of focus:

All three binoculars provide excellent apparent depth of field…the result of the 7x magnification and, to a lesser extent, the field curvature present. Depth of focus differences are more prominent. Depth of focus, for this discussion, will refer to how long the image stays in sharp focus as your rotate the focus knob into an out of “perfect focus”. The Zeiss and the Nikon have what I would refer to as above average depth of focus. I typically attribute this to a combination of the binoculars’ apparent depth of field, the focusing speed and a variety of other factors. Both the Zeiss and the Nikon have a relatively fast focus (between 1 and 1.25 turns from close focus to infinity) but both also have noticeably better depth of focus in comparison to the Zen Ray. It will be an interesting point of discussion as we continue to discuss the merits of the Zen Ray design.

Eye Relief:

I find eye relief on all three models to be acceptable. The Zeiss is the most generous followed by the Nikon and then the Zen Ray. I could easily use the Zeiss at its intermediate click stop setting. The Nikon ha
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/22/2009 at 11:06
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Really good and interesting review. Good work! I hope I will get my 7x36 soon, it sure takes time to ship it to Sweden and i believe that the customs grabbed my package. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/22/2009 at 11:35
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I hope you get them soon too kristoffer. I am sure you will enjoy their performance. I am glad you enjoyed my comments....and equally glad someone eventually replied.
 
;)
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Thanks for the great review!  I can't wait for my Zens to arrive.  Hopefully the glare thing won't be an issue for me.
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As usual, great info Frank.  I'm really enjoying my ED2 in 10x43.  I'll really look forward to reading your review of the 8x's.  I almost bought the 8x ED2, and may wind up with one yet.
Thanks for taking the time to do the testing, and putting it in terms we can all understand.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/23/2009 at 07:04
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I am glad that both of you gentlemen enjoyed them. I, too, am looking forward to the 8x review. I hope to complete it some time in the next week.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/23/2009 at 23:16
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Frank, very informative and interesting review. Do you think the warmer contrast in the Zens would lend them more to spotting big game animals than a cooler bias would? That would also be affected not only by the animals' coloration but also the landscape, which in this area in the fall will be yellow-brown and gray-green.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/24/2009 at 15:58
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Jono,
 
Good question. I have looked at many whitetails with the various Zen configurations while out spotting recently. Right now they are still pretty much in their "red" coat. We don't really see the color change to gray until the middle to the end of next month. In this scenario both of the Zen Ray configurations that I have on hand made the deer stand out quite dramatically. Contrast is definitely not a weak point of the Zen ED 2s.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/24/2009 at 16:22
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Nice review, Frank!Excellent
 
Bottom line, considering price, overall optical performance, ergonomics, everything, if you currently owned no other binoculars and could buy just one of those 3 bins to use for the rest of your life, which would you purchase?Wink
 
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Well, Frank can answer for himself, but my answer to the loaded question is the ZEN is plenty good optically and certainly looks well enough constructed, certainly the equal of the Razor.  But under the parameter of your question, I would probably get a Meostar. 
 
On the other hand if the $1,200 I saved made the difference in an extra day or two in the hunt of a lifetime, I'd have no qualm packing a ZEN ED. 
 
Which Rifle would you use if only one for the rest of your life.  Those questions really don't do a lot for me.
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Well, in a way, it's a hard question to answer because in reality, you could buy 5 pairs of the Zens for the price of the Zeiss. A guy could rationally think that for the rest of his life he could just go through a pair every few years or always have a backup pair around. On the other hand, if money is no object, then why not own the best? For most of us, the answer lies somewhere in between. And that's where we get to weigh the tradeoffs between one tool (or toy) and another.

As for a rifle, that's actually easier for me: a Remington 700 or Savage in .308. The bullet selection is vast, it's a common cartridge, more accurate than a .30-06 and reasonably powerful out to the distances that most hunters can handle.
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Originally posted by Klamath Klamath wrote:

Well, Frank can answer for himself, but my answer to the loaded question is the ZEN is plenty good optically and certainly looks well enough constructed, certainly the equal of the Razor.  But under the parameter of your question, I would probably get a Meostar. 
 
On the other hand if the $1,200 I saved made the difference in an extra day or two in the hunt of a lifetime, I'd have no qualm packing a ZEN ED. 
 
Which Rifle would you use if only one for the rest of your life.  Those questions really don't do a lot for me.
 
I totally understand, and I couldn't answer the rifle question.  My question was designed to see if he thought the Zen was close enough to the performance of the Zeiss FL that he would say "to heck with paying the extra $1200," and pick the Zen over the Zeiss.  That's why I inserted the "buy" caveat in there, and why I stipulated that the decision be based only on those 3.  Just playing devil's advocate.Wink
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I do get the devil's advocate part. Wink Let's put it this way, after having the Promaster ELX ED for over a year, and hunting the devil out of it through a very abnormally cold, wet season, and after having it ride around in my truck as the truck bino, it has taken the lickin' and it is still tickn'.  I find that if a bino is going to have issues, especially poor quality issues, they are going to manifest pretty quickly, more often than not, straight out of the box.  I see no reason to think the ZEN ED (or the Hawke Frontier ED or Atlas Intrepid ED for that matter) is any less well built.
 
The Promaster has been purposely left outside overnight in the winter for several wet-freeze-thaw-wet-freeze-thaw cycles.  No problem with fogging or internal condensation.
  
So, taking that into consideration, if your question was rephrased; "Would you consider using one of these as your only binocular for everything?", the answer would be yes, I would.  I would of course harbor some trepidation about using a pretty well unproved design, but sometimes you have to go with your gut when it comes to your outdoor gear.  I get no negative "gut feeling" about these.  Now, our outdoor gear changes it composition as we gain experience with it, and it is possible that the thing would not stand up to a couple years worth of scrutiny.  I seems that it really does take that long to give an optic a thorough evaluation.


Edited by Klamath - August/25/2009 at 11:18
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I will certainly not try to answer Frank's question for him, but I've had the opportunity to look through my 10x Ed2's next to my trinovid (edge to Zen), my neighbor's 10x SLC (slight edge to Zen), and my hunting budddie's 10x EL (slight edge to EL).  I can absolutely be sure that you will not be able to see something with the EL (or anything else for that matter) that you can't see with the Zen, and vice versa.  I'm going to start using them hard scouting mule deer country and really put them through the paces. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/25/2009 at 19:36
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RD,
 
Why the Zeiss ofcourse. If money were no object.
 
But then that isn't the real world now is it?
 
;)
 
Yes, the Zen's are a fantastic binocular. The optical performance is superb and is certainly only bettered "overall" by a very small handful of binoculars that sell at 2-5x the cost.
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Stated another way... knowing what you know now, if you didn't have the Zeiss, given the performance of the ZR ED, would you still purchase it?  I know in an absolute sense the Zeiss is better, but do you believe it is $1200 better?  Having read many of your posts on birdforum, I know that you are an optics looney like I am, and you enjoy owning many binoculars... but I thought I'd ask anyway out of curiosity!Wink

Personally... as good as some of the mid to upper mid range roofs have become, it is getting harder for me to recommend to anyone to buy an alpha class binocular anymore, despite how much I love my Leica Ultra HD.  I just don't know that the alphas are worth the extra premium vs. the remarkable performance of the Zen, Promaster, Hawke ED, Vortex Razor, Meopta, Kowa Genesis, etc.
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Ted, there is absolutely no question whatsoever in my mind that I'd get the ZEN ED.  I have spent most of my life gagging at the price charged for the top end binoculars.  For quite awhile, up to maybe 10-12 years ago, they were visibly better.  But now the list price for a Zeiss FL in some places is $2,400.  Are you kidding me!  Yeah I know you can look around and get one cheaper.  I'd feel a lot better using a $400 glass than a $2,400.  Besides if I was going for a top end glass, I'd check in with a Steiner Peregrine XP.  I  actually reviewed the Steiner XP and had the money at that time to buy it.  It simply could not step far enough away fro the ZEN for me to pull the trigger.
 
People tout the alpha ruggedness, but quite frankly I have seen a couple of pretty expensive glass give it completely up over some pretty minor stuff, so in truth, nothing is going to be "fail-safe" on a hunt.
 
So, in my estimation, what the ZEN ED is, is a more than satisfactory alternative for somebody who can't (or even won't) pony up alpha cash.  Is the alpha better? On most levels it probably is.  Is the ZEN ED good enough?  On what I see the answer is probably yes.  Is there some evidence of a couple minor bumps causing problems? Yeah there is.  But do we really know what the next bump is going to do to any binocular.  I guess if you really value extreme use ability, then the alpha is your deal.


Edited by Klamath - August/25/2009 at 23:28
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I hear ya, Steve.  The better $500 - $900 class roofs nowadays are so good that it's becoming harder to justify the price of the alphas anymore... especially after the price increases we've recently seen from the "big 3" as a result of the declining value of the dollar.
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Ted, I was in that boat up until August 5, 2009.  I had looked and looked and researched until I could do no more.  Side by side comparisons of the Zeiss and Leica and Swaro (all 8x40'ish) and Vortex 8.5x50.  I decided to give the Zen ED II's a try.  I am not disappointed.  The 750 bucks saved over the Leica Ultravids on sale and the 300 bucks saved on the Vortex thus far is money in the bank!  On Aug 14, 2009 a friend with 2 yr old Zeiss 10x42 (I think, or 40 or 43) compared my new out of the box Zens at dusk.  Hands down, the owner couldn't figure out what was wrong with his Zeiss.  Brightness and clarity were excellent.  Durability?  Don't know--but after the opening of the Aug 15 whitetail season here and hours of glassing at a time with no headache or eye strain, I am glad I made the purchase.  Hopefully John B will have good things to say about durability following his Alaska hunt about the Zen's.  Only time will tell!  And a big thanks goes to Chris and SWFA for getting them to me in a great timely fashion!
sam
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There is now, and probably always will be, a part of me that will want a high class glass.  I will never forget the "WOW" I got when I looked at the first of the Leica Trinovids that had phase corrected.  But then, there was nothing that could compare to those, or to the Zeiss.
 
Today, it is different.  Like you point out, when you get close to $500 and over, it is hard to imagine the need for "better",  however that is defined.  If you make your living with the glass and/or hunt everywhere whenever or wherever you can, then I agree some extra peace of mind has a price as well.  Better and best value can be defined in various ways.
 
But make no mistake, If you can't see it with a ZEN ED, you can't see it with your favorite flavor of alpha either.  And, yes I have had them side by side to just about everything except maybe a Minox HG or a Swarovski SLC.
 
Now specifically to the Zeiss ET AL, I rank them as follows:  Steiner XP, Leica Ultravid, Swarovski EL. Nikon EDG, Swaro SLC, and Zeiss FL.
 
If I thought I had to "improve" the ZEN it would be with a Meopta Meostar.  I can see where they are worth it and they do have a stellar durability reputation
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I can't praise my 8X32 Ultravid HD's enough.  I love them; they are an absolute joy to use and carry!  I don't feel like I'm sacrificing much optical performance for their remarkably compact size and light weight.  I don't at all regret owning them.

However, I don't think I will ever buy an alpha bin again unless I just happen on a deal too good to pass up.  As good as they are, they aren't twice as good as my Vortex Razor or the Hawke Frontier ED I recently tested.  Those bins produce image quality that so closely approaches the Leica that I think the extra money is better used elsewhere. 
 
Sorry for the detour, Frank.  Again, I enjoyed your review.  I think these comparisons reinforce the fact that some of the mid range bins are really giving the alphas a run for their money!
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Well, Ted since we seem to be more or less in agreement, I too apologize to Frank for the thread hijack.  And Frank, thanks for the review.  Wink 
 
That saves me having to find a 7x42 FL to compare my 7x36 ZEN to.
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Not a problem guys. It is nice to see both sides of the discussion for a change instead of just one side or the other.
 
As for you earlier question Ted, yes, I would probably buy the Zens and be happy with the fact that I was getting superb optical performance for the price that they sell for. I would not feel as if I was "missing out" by not purchasing an Alpha for my intended applications.
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I own a pair of the Zeiss Victory T*FL in 7x42 and now the 10x43 Zen ED.  I only had to pay about $1300 for the Zeiss as a new show special.  I can't imagine paying another $1000 for them at 2300-2400.  I am happy with the ZR and will put them to the test for my elk trip this Sept.  It has always been a "you get what you pay for optics world"  times have changed.  We now have optics that are near alpha class for maybe 20% of the price of some of the alpha glass.  I am just waiting for that nice compact light, mountain hiking 6x32.  I would get the Vortex Viper, but I just got to think that we are going to see a pair from ZR soon.  I hope.
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Sorry carjunhunter, I didnt understand well: you enjoyed the Zen-Ray or not?
Sorry asking it but I have just bought it and I am so anxious to receive it that I want to hear all the details ha ha ha!
Thanks!
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