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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2011 at 19:42
EchoWhiskeyOne View Drop Down
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I have the opportunity to pick up a brand new Conquest 3-9x40mm with Z-Plex for right at $310 bucks.  

My thoughts are to replace the brand new Bushnell Elite 4200 on my .280 REM and give the 4200 to my father as kind of a second/late birthday present.

He has never owned a high quality optic and I guess my hopes are that by mounting a good scope with quality rings and bases for him on his 7mm Mag and really SHOW him what his rifle is capable of that I will open him up to what I have been trying to tell him for the past few years but have failed to get the point across.

He tries to compensate for poor glass by purchasing larger variable optics at very low prices.  He currently has what appears to be a 10+ year old 4-16x50mm Tasco something or another worth no more than the distance I could throw it on the rifle that struggles to hold better than 3-4" groups and the glass is literally the bottom of the barrel.  It reflects so much light that he often leaves the woods FAR earlier than he would have to with my 4200 and since his 7mm is his end all rifle, the Rainguard would please him on those sloppy days, too...I'm positive.  For the distances we hunt, 9x is PLENTY and the quality glass in the 4200 is so much better than his Tasco that I'm without doubt that he would never look back at a variable larger than a top end of 9x again.

I know that the Conquest is a small notch above the 4200, but does it have comparable coatings to compete with the Rainguard?  My only concerns are that I just dialed this rifle in VERY nicely with my 4200 and I'm sure the Conquest would be no different, but I don't want to step DOWN in ANY aspect (such as foul weather performance) just to get a slight upgrade in glass.  If that is the case, I will just buy him his own 4200 and leave the Conquest out of the equation all together.

Opinions?  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2011 at 20:32
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Why dont you buy the conquest and then decide which one to keep.  Compare them both together and see which one you like best.  I believe that you will prefer the Conquest.  I dont think it rains on me that much when Im hunting its more snow here that time of year.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2011 at 21:26
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Just get some Butler Creek covers for the Conquest.  I have used a Conquest in terribly wet conditions without issue.  Sounds like a nice gift scenario for you and him.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2011 at 21:33
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I agree go with the conquest you won't regrett it, i love mine
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2011 at 21:33
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I have both scopes. They are both nice but I think the Conquest is better in all respects except for Rainguard. If I could only keep one it would be the Conquest. If you can get a new one for $310 then it's a no-brainer. If you don't want it then please point me to it so I can buy it ;-).
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 04:26
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You know...I'm kind of an idiot!

Even though mentally I knew which of my rifles that this Conquest would be going on when I wrote and posted that novel above, I didn't really map everything out fully in my head before hitting the "Post Reply" button! Loco

I don't even take my .280 REM out in foul weather!  It's my Model 70 Classic Featherweight and she's my baby...the whole reason that I bought my Stevens 200 .270 in the first place which just so happens to have a 4200 on it...my foul weather rifle.

I was so focused on a way to get my dad on a good scope that I basically wasted everybody's time with that long read in the process...

I'm buying the Conquest without question!

Thanks folks and sorry for the brain fart!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 06:46
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NBD. We all have such.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 07:00
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Forgot to mention that when I pitched the idea of getting my dad a nice scope and mounts for a late birthday present to my wife that she was surprisingly ALL FOR IT!  Hell, she even called it "sweet"!  If I were to tell her it was for me, she would just roll her eyes and walk off mumbling and shaking her head like she always does.
 
No CLUE why I can't get her onboard with me buying MYSELF a nice optic like that, but either way, she is ok with me dropping a few hundred on an upgrade for myself while simultaneously upgrading my dad.  Women are so WEIRD.
 
Man, I'm stoked!
 
Edit:  Ted, I think that this may apply as a new excuse to the significant other thread...simply tell her a sob story about how badly your father needs a scope because his are crap.  May not work with wives who dislike their in-laws, but for those who love theirs like my wife, it's the perfect get-rich scheme!


Edited by EchoWhiskeyOne - March/16/2011 at 07:05
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 10:18
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Since I'm kind of a scardie-cat with recoil.... I would want something with more eye-relief than the 4200 on a 7mmMAG!  I have a 4200 on a .204 and it's great!  I'd put a 3-9X40 Conquest on a 7mmMag in a heartbeat!!!

So, put the Conquest on your father's rifle - just to show him what he's missing and then let him buy one....  You could pay half as a present!  Just a thought!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 10:39
EchoWhiskeyOne View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

Since I'm kind of a scardie-cat with recoil.... I would want something with more eye-relief than the 4200 on a 7mmMAG!  I have a 4200 on a .204 and it's great!  I'd put a 3-9X40 Conquest on a 7mmMag in a heartbeat!!!

So, put the Conquest on your father's rifle - just to show him what he's missing and then let him buy one....  You could pay half as a present!  Just a thought!
 
His 7mm doesn't kick too bad...besides, that 4200 will offer about an additional half inch or so of eye-relief on that rifle of his compared to the Tasco that's on it now and he's never been bit by it up to this point.
 
Should be fine...oh and for the record that sentence in bold up there = you are RUTHLESS! LOL
 
My dad would never consent to throwing $150+ at a scope, that's the whole reason I am scoping his rifle FOR him.
 
I don't think he's ever spent over $75 on an optic.  I can't wait to see his face when his gun "magically" starts shooting approximate MOA groupings rather than what he has been tolerating out of that Tasco over the years.
 
Lucky he hasn't had to make a shot over 100yds up to this point.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 11:08
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I put a 3-9x 40mm 4200 on one my dad's rifles. He's basically the same; never spends money on scopes, even for nice rifles.

I've got mixed views on the 3-9x Conquest. The glass is great, but I don't like the unmarked sporting turrets, or their feel when adjusting them.
For the price,even considering the nice glass and the fact that it's the cheapest Conquest model made, they should do a better job with the turrets.
I'm odd in that I'd take a Vortex Viper (old style) over the low end 3-9x 40mm Conquest, based on the price difference and features. At around the level of Vipers and 4200 Elites, my eyesight ceases to be able to the discern most of the optical differences between 3-9x scopes.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 12:02
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Originally posted by Poodleshooter1 Poodleshooter1 wrote:

I'm odd in that I'd take a Vortex Viper (old style) over the low end 3-9x 40mm Conquest, based on the price difference and features. At around the level of Vipers and 4200 Elites, my eyesight ceases to be able to the discern most of the optical differences between 3-9x scopes.
 
This is a really good point and I'm glad that you brought it up before I committed to making a purchase as I have never looked through a Conquest before.  Just like I can't tell much of a difference between Nikon Monarch glass and my 4200 Elites, glass alone wasn't what sold me with the 4200; it was the much cheaper pricetag and the Rainguard.
 
On a general concensus basis, how many of you reading this thread would rate the Conquest's glass (both clarity and light transmission capability) so much better than a 4200 Elite, that you would spend the extra $150+ dollars between the two and be willing to trade off the foul weather performance of the Rainguard? 
 
I read all the time about how durable they both are and I read about how clear they both are with the slight edge going to the Conquest...but are the Conquests really worth the extra money when you consider that you're giving up performance elsewhere and a considerable amount of loot as well?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 12:14
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I have a 3-9X40 4200 on my .204 and bought two Conquest 3-9X40 and put on my Son's rifles.  Could have gotten the 4200 for them at cheaper prices too.  I really like the Conquest for deer hunting rifles!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 12:23
EchoWhiskeyOne View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

I have a 3-9X40 4200 on my .204 and bought two Conquest 3-9X40 and put on my Son's rifles.  Could have gotten the 4200 for them at cheaper prices too.  I really like the Conquest for deer hunting rifles!
 
But when you bought them, how much cheaper were the 4200s?  Because right now, they are roughly HALF the price of the Conquests.
 
Also, had you had the opportunity to glance through a Conquest before deciding, or did you just buy them, mount them and love them because they are everything that everybody says that they are?
 
The most important question is this:  Do you, after looking through them, feel that they stand that far above the 4200 optically, both in clear and low-light conditions, that paying nearly double price for them justifies them over the 4200 which is nearly in the same exact class as the Conquest?
 
Sorry for the 25 questions, but money is money and there's not a lot of it in my house!  I know that they are both good products, especially the 4200 since I own two of them.  But are the Conquests simply that much better?
 
Would you buy your baby Pampers at nearly DOUBLE the price of Huggies simply because he can pee in them one more time than he can in the Huggies?  Sorry, as a young father with two little rugrats running around that was the quickest analogy I could come up with!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 12:30
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Originally posted by EchoWhiskeyOne EchoWhiskeyOne wrote:

Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

I have a 3-9X40 4200 on my .204 and bought two Conquest 3-9X40 and put on my Son's rifles.  Could have gotten the 4200 for them at cheaper prices too.  I really like the Conquest for deer hunting rifles!
 
But when you bought them, how much cheaper were the 4200s?  Because right now, they are roughly HALF the price of the Conquests.
 
Also, had you had the opportunity to glance through a Conquest before deciding, or did you just buy them, mount them and love them because they are everything that everybody says that they are?
 
The most important question is this:  Do you, after looking through them, feel that they stand that far above the 4200 optically, both in clear and low-light conditions, that paying nearly double price for them justifies them over the 4200 which is nearly in the same exact class as the Conquest?
 
Sorry for the 25 questions, but money is money and there's not a lot of it in my house!  I know that they are both good products, especially the 4200 since I own two of them.  But are the Conquests simply that much better?
 
Would you buy your baby Pampers at nearly DOUBLE the price of Huggies simply because he can pee in them one more time than he can in the Huggies?  Sorry, as a young father with two little rugrats running around that was the quickest analogy I could come up with!

they both have trade offs, zeiss has excellent cs and 4" of eye relief. i feel the conquest's glass is a smidge better than the 4200's. the 4200 has rainguard.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 12:31
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I got my 4200 for $199.99.  Not sure if I had ever looked thru one or not.  I had looked thru the Conquest many times before I got one.  For the record, I paided less than $399.99 for both my Conquests. 

I understand your point and I'm not sure if I can give you what you want.  It was worth it to me to spend the extra coin and get the Conquest's.  I would do it again even if it meant saving up for a while.  I also put a lot of value in the 4 inches of eye relief and not that much value in the Rainguard as I've never been impacted from "wet" lenses that I couldn't see thru.

As we say a lot around this forum,  it's best to do a side-by-side comparison in the kind of conditions you'll use them in and then you may or may not be able to tell a difference.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 17:30
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I got rid of a 4200 to get a Conquest.  Do not regret the decision either.  When looking through the 4200 I always felt as if I were looking through a cardboard paper towel roll.  I don't like how the turrets are marked on the Conquest either but mine have positive clicks to them when turned.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 19:14
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This is the second time that I have been a point and a click away from buying a Conquest in the past couple months and the second time that I am sitting here having a VERY hard time in justifying all the extra cost for the Conquest compared to the 4200 when I hear SO often about how close they are in optical clarity, etc.  Their field of view, roughly the same.  Their exit pupil, roughly the same.  The weight goes to the 4200 because it's lighter.  Eye relief to the Conquest, but I've never come close to getting hit with a 4200.  Elites come with a mail in coupon for a free $130 rain suit for those of you who DO sit in daily rain storms Wink.

The additional features of the 4200 that aren't needed every day, such as the Rainguard are still there, regardless, and the Conquest is lacking in that department.  And I have never felt like I was looking down a paper towel tube looking through my 4200...I've always thought that it was a very nice view, especially for the money invested in it and I had thought that the general audience agreed that it's a good piece; far better than looking through a paper towel tube?

I guess I'm just torn and even worse this time than the last.

I really like the concept of owning a Conquest, I just am having a hard time believing that it is really worth $150+ more than a 4200.  If the comparison were the Fulfield II (which is roughly the same price as a 4200 with the current sales, odd as that is) vs. a Conquest, I would go Conquest hands down, mainly because I have looked through Fulfield IIs and they aren't comparable to a 4200 optically...but the 4200, from everything I hear is so close to the Conquest that I just end up feeling like I burnt a lot of brain cells comparing the two.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 19:28
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Well I ordered a Burris Euro Diamond from the samplelist 2.5x10x50 Thanks for the help Mr Koshkin, can hardly wait for it to get here.....
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 20:38
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It is a tough call, I have them both and most all the advice has been spot on.
If $$$ is fairly tight get the Elite and feel good about it, because the Conquest isn't a whole lot better, as Pyro stated there are trade offs.
Another option may be to get them both, compare them side by side, make your choice and sell the other. Both are very desirable in like new condition and hold resale value well. You probably won't take too bad a beating and have the scope you like best for sure.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 21:28
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Echo - have you looked thru a Conquest?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/16/2011 at 23:32
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Originally posted by EchoWhiskeyOne EchoWhiskeyOne wrote:

This is the second time that I have been a point and a click away from buying a Conquest in the past couple months and the second time that I am sitting here having a VERY hard time in justifying all the extra cost for the Conquest compared to the 4200 when I hear SO often about how close they are in optical clarity, etc.  Their field of view, roughly the same.  Their exit pupil, roughly the same.  The weight goes to the 4200 because it's lighter.  Eye relief to the Conquest, but I've never come close to getting hit with a 4200.  Elites come with a mail in coupon for a free $130 rain suit for those of you who DO sit in daily rain storms Wink.

The additional features of the 4200 that aren't needed every day, such as the Rainguard are still there, regardless, and the Conquest is lacking in that department.  And I have never felt like I was looking down a paper towel tube looking through my 4200...I've always thought that it was a very nice view, especially for the money invested in it and I had thought that the general audience agreed that it's a good piece; far better than looking through a paper towel tube?

I guess I'm just torn and even worse this time than the last.

I really like the concept of owning a Conquest, I just am having a hard time believing that it is really worth $150+ more than a 4200.  If the comparison were the Fulfield II (which is roughly the same price as a 4200 with the current sales, odd as that is) vs. a Conquest, I would go Conquest hands down, mainly because I have looked through Fulfield IIs and they aren't comparable to a 4200 optically...but the 4200, from everything I hear is so close to the Conquest that I just end up feeling like I burnt a lot of brain cells comparing the two.

It is hard to describe what I mean by looking down a cardboard paper towel roll.  If you and I were physically looking at one I could show you what I mean.....once I pointed this out to a couple friends they agreed with me.  For me it was more distracting than anything else.  The actual image through a 4200 is great...but for me I could not get used to it.  Maybe I got one that was defective.
At the price the 3-9x40 4200's are going for, I must admit I have been tempted to pick one up for a future rifle.  

For me though, the Conquest was worth the extra $$$.  To me the Conquest has a better reticle...especially in low and bright light.  IMO the eye relief on the Conquest is less critical than the 4200.  For me that is important on a big game hunting rifle that I may be forced to shoot at odd angles with, shoot quickly with, and even shoot weak handed with.  I could not have done this as easy with the 4200.  Is it worth the extra money??? For me it was, however YMMV. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/17/2011 at 01:19
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I love my Conquest, but if money was tight I would get the 4200 (or maybe try to stash a dollar a day until deer season and then get the Conquest).

I think the Conquest plex reticle is noticeably better than the 4200 plex reticle, especially for low light. The reticle is probably the main thing that would seal the deal for me.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/17/2011 at 04:38
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Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

Echo - have you looked thru a Conquest?

No, that's why I'm so messed up right now!

I hate buying something that I haven't had any time to look over, even if it's only a $350-400 investment, and none of the shops/venders in my area carry Zeiss products...none that I have been able to find anyway.

With the 4200, the choice was easy.  I had OT testimonies, but my local gun shop carries them and I was also able to compare it to everything that they had and it was a no-brainer to order one...and a second, too.

Funny...some of the local places carry your traditional optics, such as Nikons and Bushnells of all kinds, Burris, Weavers, Tasco, etc...then they jump ALLLL the way up to Swarovski Z3, 5 and 6 and have NOTHING in between to satisfy the mid-range customers.

I would have obviously bought a Z3, but my budget isn't $900 for a hunting scope...it's about $400ish, mainly because I have no need for a scope of that caliber (though I sure would love one!).
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/17/2011 at 04:45
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Originally posted by Vermin93 Vermin93 wrote:

I love my Conquest, but if money was tight I would get the 4200 (or maybe try to stash a dollar a day until deer season and then get the Conquest).

I think the Conquest plex reticle is noticeably better than the 4200 plex reticle, especially for low light. The reticle is probably the main thing that would seal the deal for me.

Money isn't really the issue.  I already have it budgeted to spend.  I just wish that there was a place around here that sold them so that I could fumble around with one a little bit...that is what put me over the top with my 4200s. 

I also don't care for the plex on the 4200, though it hasn't ever given me any issues.

In another thread, I describe the Hunter Wicked Optics scope that I have recently put on my .300 WSM.  I got that scope for $190 and it, too, has a far better plex reticle on it than my 4200.  Oh and it's standing up to that magnum recoil just fine, for any of you that have read my review of the scope and might be wondering if it's the real deal.
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