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Why are mil/mil scopes so hard to come by?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/04/2012 at 21:13
bigbadwolv View Drop Down
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Hi all, I am looking for my first scope (this link relates; http://www.opticstalk.com/help-with-first-scope-purchase_topic34896.html) and I am having trouble finding a mil/mil scope. I was hoping to find a mil/mil as I use the metric system and would find the conversions easier when needed. It's got me thinking now as to whether I just bite the bullet and go with some form of duplex or something. I was really hoping to learn how to make adjustments and such through a mildot or similar reticle, and would rather have a mil/mil rather than mil/moa. 

I just don't understand why mil/mil scopes aren't that popular with the manufacturers.

What are your thoughts? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 07:58
3_tens View Drop Down
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America is the worlds largest scope market, and always has been. America uses the English units of measurements. The market drives the manufacturing machine. There was a government mandate back in the early 70s to change America to the metric system. The people spoke and we are still primarily using inches feet and quarts and gallons. As manufacturing and the old manufacturing machinery in America is being retired the change is slowly creeping upon us. Metric is easier to add and subtract than fractions. Thus it is arguably better. As a practical test, If I ask you to visualize an inch, or 50 MM which would you be the quickest to image in your mind. It will depend on what system you were raised on.


Edited by 3_tens - December/05/2012 at 08:04
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 08:31
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My guess would be that most scope manufacturers still have a lot of stock in MOA adjustment mechanisms. So they simply slip in a mil reticle, and you have mil/moa (or is in a moa/mil) scope.
 
Over time the mil/mil will bleed into the shops as old stock becomes depleted.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 10:11
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A big majority of the manufacturers make mil/mil scopes these days.  So saying they are hard to come by is not really accurate.  Hunting scopes I dare bet are still the biggest seller in every manufacturers line up.  But many of them do have a tactical line and most of them have a mil/mil type offering.

Saying they are hard to come by for cheap is another story.  Most people who want a mil/mil scope want if for precision shooting.  That means they need a high quality scope that is repeatable and has good to great glass and is durable.  All those things are an absolute must for precision shooting.  Having all those things put in a scope for cheap and having them meet that criteria is hard.  There are a few cheap scopes like that, but they suck.  Take falcon scopes.  They meet that criteria, but they have crappy adjustments, sub par glass, not repeatable and don't hold up. 

The best option for a starter scope that is mil mil is the SWFA SS 3-9x.  It is very durable, adjustments are precise and repeatable, and the glass is very good.  Anything else under $1000 to $1200 is not going to get you anything more.  You can get more magnification with the others and maybe illumination, but mechanical wise it gives up nothing.  I woudl pick that scope.  If you have to have more magnification (which I don't think you need on a .223, but to each his own) then I woudl get the Weaver.  The one I got to use and play with was actually quite nice. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 11:49
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Part of it may be the market you're in since Australia may not have the same access to scopes that you'd find in the U.S.
 
BTW, I agree that the math is simpler working will metric distances and mils. But that's just because both happen to be decimal based systems. Otherwise, one measures linear distances, the other angles (expressed in thousandths of radians). One reason you still see a lot of mismatched scopes is that another measurement of angle, MOA (minutes of angle), has long been used. There's really nothing wrong with it either, especially when combined with a matching reticle with subtensions in MOA.
 
Still, if I was actually ranging with a reticle I'd prefer it to be in mils. But I pretty much find that all I do with mine is make corrections at the range on paper targets.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2012 at 20:15
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Thanks for the replies guys, I guess you are right, it's just the market talking. As for the mag range, 3-9x is alright, I was just hoping to get a bit more like up to 14x or so, just because I would like to be pushing out to medium range distances.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2012 at 20:19
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Keep in mind that they shoot open sights at 1000 yds in competition quite regularly.  A 3-9 will work nicely for you starting out. If you want more power it will cost you more money.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2012 at 15:49
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I am looking at spending $800-$1000. Surely there should be something that would suit my needs in this range.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2012 at 16:07
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Vortex Viper PST or WEaver tactical are probably you best choices if you want a little more mag.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2012 at 23:24
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Thanks mate
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