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Vortex Viper vs Sightron SIIB

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/21/2010 at 09:44
royta View Drop Down
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I originally started a thread HERE trying to determine which 3-9 scope I wanted on my AR-15 for a coyote/predator setup.  I'm not sure why I didn't include a Sightron, since I have a SII 4-16x42 w/ 1/8 target turrets on my Pac-Nor barreled 22-250.
 
So now let's compare the the SIIB 3-9x42 HHR against the Vortex Viper 3-9x40 BDC.
 
The Vortex has more MOA adjustment than the Sightron.  The Vortex has a slight edge in FOV.  The Sightron is almost an ounce lighter.  The Vortex is argon filled and the Sightron is nitrogen purged.  I'm guessing argon is better.
 
Vortex seems to have done a good job in helping the hunter determine bullet drop IF you want to sight in your 223 at 100 yards.  Their chart isn't perfect though.  Compare their chart with ballistics calculated with Point Blank v1.8a which I picked up from the Hunting Nut website.
    0 yds   -1.50 in
100 yds    0.00 in
200 yds   -2.85 in
300 yds  -11.45 in
400 yds  -27.69 in
500 yds  -54.90 in
I prefer a 200 yard sight in so their chart does me little use.  I would still need to figure it out on my own.  I would need to call Vortex and find out what the reticle MOA measurements are at different magnifications, as their reticle chart is for the highest magnification.
 
Sightron gives you a Ballistics For Reticle Drop PDF, but it doesn't say at what magnification you're supposed to be at.  At least Sightron gives you the reticle MOA measurements at Min and Max magnifications.
 
 
So, which of the two scopes has better optics?
 
Yeah, I know I can get the Sightron for about $225 after $75 rebate, but I'm trying to keep price out of it.
 
 
Thanks everybody!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/21/2010 at 11:59
grimreaper21 View Drop Down
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honestly i probably wouldn't be investing too much in the bullet drop markers, every cartridge is gonna have different properties.. 55grn, 68grn etc.  If you really want precision accuracy, maybe get a FFP mil-dot with a ballistics calculator.  then you're looking at over $600.  otherwise, just get which you have a preference to. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/22/2010 at 21:51
royta View Drop Down
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I certainly see your point on the bullet drop reticles.  However, if I can find one that works for 55 grainers, then I'm going to use it.  I don't really care about the 68 grainers.  If I decide to start shooting them, I'll rezero the scope, print out a ballistics table and hold over or crank up the elevation turret just like I'd do with a duplex reticle.

So, which of the two scopes has the better optics?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/22/2010 at 22:28
grimreaper21 View Drop Down
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this review should be very fitting.. http://opticsthoughts.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=22:vortex-viper-4-12x40-wbdc-reticle&catid=4:rifle-scope-reviews&Itemid=4 just keep in mind how expensive some of those scopes are that he is comparing to.
i personally can't say anything about sighton, but i love my viper and don't have a single regret about it.  the only one thing ilya mentions as a minor downside is the tunnel effect which, i only notice when i shove my face into the scope.. this is not a position i would ever be shooting from...nor can i see anything.  When i come back to maximum FOV, it isn't noticible to me in the slightest.  again this is just a minor thing that only the dark lord of optics would notice.  its like buying an HDTV, the only way you will ever notice most differences would be to buy both products take them home and watch both side by side.  otherwise you just buy one and you're oblivious to any differences because both are great.  with that being said, vortex wins based on customer service alone, arguably the best in the business.  This IS something that is noticibly different than the competitors.  and on top of all that i think the viper sits perfectly as the leader in its price range in terms of optics quality. 


Edited by grimreaper21 - November/22/2010 at 22:32
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2011 at 22:03
royta View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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The leaves are changing colors, which means I'm getting the itch to shoot again.  No, I still haven't put a scope on my AR-15, so I thought I'd wake this thread back up.

I'm looking at either the Vortex Viper 2-7x32 C3 reticle or a Sightron Big Sky 3-9x42.  Any advice?  I'll be using either the ADM Ad-Recon or Ad-Recon-X mount.  I really like the Bobro mounts too, but you can change ring sizes on the ADM...a nice touch in case I ever change to a 30mm tube.
 
 
Thanks.
 
Roy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 06:52
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I have both Vortex Viper and Sightron Big Sky scopes. I can honestly say I like them both...a lot. These are hunting scopes and they work for the intended purposes very well. Additionally, the Sightron Big Sky does have a hydrophobic coating which is very useful...IMO. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 08:21
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I am not a big fan of circle reticles generally, but I do think they are most useful on an AR platform rifle.  The 2-7  VV has a nice compact form, which is also nice on an AR.  The Sightron you mention is better suited to a bolt gun, IMO.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 13:38
Skylar McMahon View Drop Down
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Instead of the regular Viper you might want to look at the Viper HS with side paralax adjustment. The standard Viper come from the factory with a fixed paralax adjustment at 100 yards.
With the HS you have the option for side paralax but not with the 1-4 and the 2.5-10. However it's not a 3-9, but it is available in a 2.5-10.
And I have to agree with Matt. Personally never been a fan of target do reticle either.


Edited by Skylar McMahon - September/27/2011 at 13:53
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 13:51
koshkin View Drop Down
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A few comments:

-I am not a big fan of holdover reticles in SFP scopes either.  I do not think it is a good idea, but YMMV.

- Between the two scope in question SIIB is a little better optically than the Viper

-Viper HS 2.5-10x44 does not have  parallax adjustment either and, to boot, it has shallower depth of field than either the regular Viper or the SIIB (personally, I would take either regular Viper or the SIIB over the 2.5-10x44 HS).

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 14:08
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  I was never a big fan of the circle reticles either but I was always open to advice from those who have used a reticle that is suppose to get you on target FAST for the type of hunting I do.  Pyro suggested I try the C3.  I like it and all those I've turned on to it like it.  So far it's the best one I've used for the purpose I've mentioned.  This is not a small turkey style circle by any means.  I know Minox is offering it in one of their Z5 scopes.  Anyone at SWFA know how they're selling?
  As far as the choice between the Vortex and Sightron goes I've never looked thru a B/S but do have two SII's.  They compare favorably with my Viper so I would imagine the B/S would be a step up optically over the Viper.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 14:10
Skylar McMahon View Drop Down
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300,
they are a great seller. Have proven to be very popular.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 14:18
300S&W View Drop Down
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   That's GOOD.  Hate to see a good reticle go to waste.  Bucky
 
   THANKS,Skylar.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 14:20
Skylar McMahon View Drop Down
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No problem.
I really like that reticle my self.
Would work very well for turkey on a shotgun, muzzle loaders, and dangerous game.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 14:43
koshkin View Drop Down
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I have the Viper 2-7x32 with C3 reticle and Minox 1.5-8x32 with Versa-Plex.

Both are great and both offer a very good deal these days with current discounts.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 17:46
300S&W View Drop Down
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 Thought I'd post the specs on the C3 reticle to give an idea of the size of it's circle.
 
            

Versa-Plex C3 Reticle Subtensions

Viper 2-7x32

 
 
  


Edited by 300S&W - September/27/2011 at 18:02
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 18:07
royta View Drop Down
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Originally posted by 300S&W 300S&W wrote:

 
 Thought I'd post the specs on the C3 reticle to give an idea of the size of it's circle.
 

Versa-Plex C3 Reticle Subtensions

Viper 2-7x32

 
 
 
 
Which reminds me...that's a pretty big circle.  The C3's circle is 27 MOA at the highest magnification of 7x and would be 94.5 MOA at the lowest magnification of 2x.  Seems rather large.  I'm wondering if it would be too large for a coyote rifle.
 
I have a Sightron SII4-16x42 on a .22-250 and here is it's reticle for comparison: 
Name SII416x42
Magnification 4-16x
Object Diameter 42
Eye Relief 3.0-3.4
Reticle Type Duplex
Click Value 1/8 MOA
Fov 24.5-7.0
Length 13.62
Tube Diameter 1
Windage Elevation Travel 50
Weight 16
Finish Matte Black
Minutes Per Revolution 7.5
Knob Type Target
Sunshade Included Yes
Scope Dimensions
* all measurements in inches (IN)
A 13.62
B 6.1
C 2.75
D 1.97
E 3.58
F 3.94
G 2.2
H 1.53
I 1

Reticle Dimensions
* all measurements in inches (IN).
Min Power Max Power
A 30
B .50
C 2.0
A 7.5
B 1.25
C .50
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 19:20
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  I don't know,royta.  I can tell you that the inexperienced shooters I've been with say the C3 makes it faster for them to get on target and then to hold steady on it when they do.  I know that when I pull up on a target my attention is immediately drawn to what's within that circle.  Maybe it's not the size target that matters so much as how the circle gets your attention away from what's around it.  Hard to explain.   
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 19:31
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Originally posted by 300S&W 300S&W wrote:

 
  I don't know,royta.  I can tell you that the inexperienced shooters I've been with say the C3 makes it faster for them to get on target and then to hold steady on it when they do.  I know that when I pull up on a target my attention is immediately drawn to what's within that circle.  Maybe it's not the size target that matters so much as how the circle gets your attention away from what's around it.  Hard to explain.   

That is the way our cognitive response works.  We automatically center the circle on whatever we are aiming at.  It helps speed up target acquisition.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 20:30
royta View Drop Down
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Originally posted by 300S&W 300S&W wrote:

 
  I don't know,royta.  I can tell you that the inexperienced shooters I've been with say the C3 makes it faster for them to get on target and then to hold steady on it when they do.  I know that when I pull up on a target my attention is immediately drawn to what's within that circle.  Maybe it's not the size target that matters so much as how the circle gets your attention away from what's around it.  Hard to explain.   
 
 
Well, I'm not saying the circle reticle wouldn't be beneficial to me, but I'm hardly an inexprienced shooter.  *insert experience and qualifications here*  I am only kidding around, and again, I'm not saying that a 27 to 95 inch circle at 100 yards wouldn't be beneficial to me.  It would be nice to find a local store that has one in stock.  I'd hate to order C3 from SWFA and determine that it's not what I'm after.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 22:18
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

Originally posted by 300S&W 300S&W wrote:

 
  I don't know,royta.  I can tell you that the inexperienced shooters I've been with say the C3 makes it faster for them to get on target and then to hold steady on it when they do.  I know that when I pull up on a target my attention is immediately drawn to what's within that circle.  Maybe it's not the size target that matters so much as how the circle gets your attention away from what's around it.  Hard to explain.   

That is the way our cognitive response works.  We automatically center the circle on whatever we are aiming at.  It helps speed up target acquisition.

ILya
 
   I'm sure GLAD my c/r still works after all these yrs!!   LOL
 
  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2011 at 22:24
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Originally posted by royta royta wrote:

Originally posted by 300S&W 300S&W wrote:

 
  I don't know,royta.  I can tell you that the inexperienced shooters I've been with say the C3 makes it faster for them to get on target and then to hold steady on it when they do.  I know that when I pull up on a target my attention is immediately drawn to what's within that circle.  Maybe it's not the size target that matters so much as how the circle gets your attention away from what's around it.  Hard to explain.   
 
 
Well, I'm not saying the circle reticle wouldn't be beneficial to me, but I'm hardly an inexprienced shooter.  *insert experience and qualifications here*  I am only kidding around, and again, I'm not saying that a 27 to 95 inch circle at 100 yards wouldn't be beneficial to me.  It would be nice to find a local store that has one in stock.  I'd hate to order C3 from SWFA and determine that it's not what I'm after.
 
 Like I said (and in TOO MANY words Bucky ) I don't know either.  But you could try this if you like:
 
      S.W.F.A Inc.'s Handshake Guarantee

We have been in business for over 35 years and counting.

We do business based on a very simple idea. If you are not 100% satisfied with our products or service, we'll refund your money! Just return any new unused item to us within 10 days from the date delivered. Include a copy of your receipt and we will issue a refund. Shipping charges are not refundable and we can not accept returns on special order items.

    http://swfa.com/Vortex-2-7x32-Viper-Rifle-Scope-P11227.aspx
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/28/2011 at 08:51
Skylar McMahon View Drop Down
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He said it.
You can order it, open it and look through it to see if you like it. Sometimes pictures do not reflect sight picture and you may not like it.
We only have a handful left if you like give me a call and I can get you all fixed up.
 
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