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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 15:14
antleraddiction View Drop Down
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This was sent to me in an email, thought it made sense to post as, I totally agree.................Excellent  The Treasury Dept. cashed my tax check yesterday, I'm sure it will be put to its "HIGHEST and BEST USE"Roll%20Eyes.
 
 
THE JOB & THE URINE TEST

I HAVE TO PASS A URINE TEST FOR MY JOB.
So, like a lot of folks in the States, I have a job. I work, they pay me.
I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit.
In order to get that paycheck, I am required to pass a random urine test
with which I have no problem.

What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people
who don't have to pass a urine test. Shouldn't one have to pass a urine
test to get a welfare check because I have to pass one to earn it for
them? Please understand, I have no problem with helping people get
back on their feet. I do, on the other hand, have a problem with
helping someone sitting on their ASS, doing drugs, making babies, while I work. Can
you imagine how much money the States would save if people had to pass a
urine test to get a public assistance check?
Pass this along if you agree or simply delete if you don't. Hope you
all will pass it along, though. Something has to change in this Country
. . . and soon.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 15:37
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Yeah that should do it. I have no problem with folks that want to do drugs they have that right, up until it affects me. These wastoids that are on the dole can afford all manner of luxuries because of the under the table dealings and then on top of that they get my hard earned dollars too. When I have to help finance their drug habit then I have the right to say something about it. DAMN STRAIGHT!!!!!!!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 16:23
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Don't even get me started with the lazy, free loading people of this country, as far as I'm concerened they haven't even earned the time or space in this forum.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 17:20
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Excellent idea.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 18:11
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Antleraddiction (sounds like a drug problem to me) unless you are in one of those jobs that the SCOTUS says effects public safety (police, pilot, truck driver, etc.) I have a problem with drug testing. It takes a search warrent to search your house (4th amendment). Why shouldn't it take some level of probable cause to search the interior of your body.
While I agree there are slugs out there that don't deserve the services they recieve from the govt. I don't believe we should be giving up civil rights just to earn a living especially if you are not acting in a way that would cause concern.
I have heard of public schools systems that test kids for drugs in extra corricular activities are now considering testing the kids that just come to school. Whats next door to door random drug testing. Its a slippery slope.
 
I don't like drug use either, but we have a Bill of Rights and I am not willing to give them up to ensure that someone else does not do something stupid.
Thats my rant so I'll go now.Soap%20Box
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 18:24
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" well, the good news, Mr. Johnson, is you passed the drug test......The bad news is --you're pregnant!"   Roll%20on%20Floor%20Laughing
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 21:10
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Originally posted by BeltFed BeltFed wrote:

Antleraddiction (sounds like a drug problem to me) unless you are in one of those jobs that the SCOTUS says effects public safety (police, pilot, truck driver, etc.) I have a problem with drug testing. It takes a search warrent to search your house (4th amendment). Why shouldn't it take some level of probable cause to search the interior of your body.
While I agree there are slugs out there that don't deserve the services they recieve from the govt. I don't believe we should be giving up civil rights just to earn a living especially if you are not acting in a way that would cause concern.
I have heard of public schools systems that test kids for drugs in extra corricular activities are now considering testing the kids that just come to school. Whats next door to door random drug testing. Its a slippery slope.
 
I don't like drug use either, but we have a Bill of Rights and I am not willing to give them up to ensure that someone else does not do something stupid.
Thats my rant so I'll go now.Soap%20Box
 
No, BeltFed, you are in leftfield with your assumptions of me.............Get on your soap box and rant, as much as you feel like, just as I, and most "TAX PAYING AMERICANS" are doing these days.  I'll withold my thoughts of your occupation, if you even have one...........  I own my own business and my wife is a 4th grade public school teacher and you, not the kids, need to be tested if you think school systems are testing kids for drugs, LOL.  Teachers are leaving the profession in droves because of idiots like you.............Keep watching TV and maybe it will all come true.............  PS, enjoy your checkWink
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 21:14
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 21:48
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Antleraddiction let me get this straight, you own your own buisness but your complaining because you have to take a drug test. Take a look at your user name, what does it implie? I do not make assumptions about you, I don't know you. As for drug testing kids in extracarricular activities, that is a fact, and I recently heard on the local news that one of these school systems was considering testing all students.
You also missed my point, which happens to be about giving up freedom for security. If I need to explain that point I will be glad to. 
As for the personal attack thats OK in my occupation I'm used to it as I have to endure them by law. I have also passed all of my drug test.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2008 at 22:35
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Here is my opinion on drug testing.
 
An employer has the right to require drug testing.  He is the one paying you the money, so he can give the requirements he chooses.  He has the right to decide that he doesn't want a druggie working for him.  If you don't want to get drug tested, go somewhere else.
 
As a public employee, you are getting paid through tax money.  As tax payers, we are basically the employers, so we should have the right to demand that the people working for us aren't druggies, and therefore have the right to demand drug tests.  If you don't like it, go somewhere else.  BeltFed, as a law enforcement officer, I thank you for your service, but I am also glad that drug testing is required.  I don't want druggie making rules for me, or in a position of power.
 
As for welfare (I have my opinions on welfare that I won't go into here).  That is tax money as well.  We should know that our money as tax payers isn't going to a bunch of druggies.  If they don't like it, they can get a job.
 
My view on drugs?  Do them if you want.  But if it affects any other people other than yourself, then you are in the wrong.  If you start affecting your neighbors, or especially your family, that is even worse.  You are supposed to be an example for your family.  If you hurt anyone, emotionally, or physically, due to your drug use, then you are the SCUM of the earth in my opinion. 
 
Do your drugs if you want.  Fight for no drug tests if you want.  Call it the protection of your "civil liberties" if you want.  Nothing good is going to come from drug use and addiction.


Edited by helo18 - April/22/2008 at 22:36
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 01:53
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 Hey I have no complaint of drug testing .... but I agree ..... anyone wishing to receive public funds  contributed by the taxpayers should pass a drug test . Yet again the govt. is giving illegal aliens complete medical ... food and cash payments .... our economy is falling fast ... and that brain dead George Bush wanted to give them social security !!!  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 04:05
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Originally posted by BeltFed BeltFed wrote:

Antleraddiction (sounds like a drug problem to me) unless you are in one of those jobs that the SCOTUS says effects public safety (police, pilot, truck driver, etc.) I have a problem with drug testing. It takes a search warrent to search your house (4th amendment). Why shouldn't it take some level of probable cause to search the interior of your body.
While I agree there are slugs out there that don't deserve the services they recieve from the govt. I don't believe we should be giving up civil rights just to earn a living especially if you are not acting in a way that would cause concern.
I have heard of public schools systems that test kids for drugs in extra corricular activities are now considering testing the kids that just come to school. Whats next door to door random drug testing. Its a slippery slope.
 
I don't like drug use either, but we have a Bill of Rights and I am not willing to give them up to ensure that someone else does not do something stupid.
Thats my rant so I'll go now.Soap%20Box
 
If kids do drugs at school, it does not only effect those kids, but all the others who are not doing drugs. Those not doing drugs have a right to a carefree, good education. Those kids doing drugs gave up their rights to everything the minute they started doing drugs.
Kids doing drugs should be put in separate school where they can come and go as they like, without being searched if they so choose. In other words they should be permitted to stuff up their own lives without stuffing up the lives of those who do not do drugs.
As long as drugtakers, dealers and the like run around in an open society, it is the duty of the rest of us to protect our kids from scum like this. If it means stripping their rights (and that of a the innocent) then so be it. I can rant on some more, but my keyboard is overheating.....Soap%20Box
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 07:54
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Helo this is not about being able to use drugs. This is about the loss of civil rights. We complain about the liberals taking our 2nd amendment rights away. We complain because the DC police want to search homes for guns. We even complain about political correctness and how it violates free speech. But say the word drugs and all logic goes out the window.
You wouldn't let a police officer come to your door and say " your number came up so we're going to search your house for anything illegal, after all if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear". For now at least he needs a warrent based on probable cause. If they went to your neighbors house and said " your number came up and we're goimg to search your house for drugs" would you say to your neighbor "if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear", and he was such a good neighbor, never caused any problems. I know everyone is saying "It's not happening here", but we are headed that way.
There are school systems that drug test kids in extracurricular activities that now want to test all the kids that attend the school. While you may not see a problem with that because its drugs. I see a problem because it is a government agency searching a person's body for evidence without even probable cause. Why don't you just give the DEA your medical records and a blood sample or just let them take it. Now the BEM that started this thread wants to test people receiving government checks. I'm sure it was just in fun, but all this testing crap is getting out of hand.
It is one thing to test people who are responsible for the public safety, and yes an employer can legally test his employees. But I wonder how you really feel about someone else dictating to you how you live your life on your own time.
Helo I know you have to pee in a cup from time to time and you may not worry about it because you have nothing to hide and the people taking the test are probably competent, and you trust them. I sweat everytime I have to pee in a cup but not from drug use. I sweat because I don't trust the people taking or evaluating the sample, and I do not trust my employer. I know they use drug test as an intemidation tool, and I have good reasons not to trust them that I will not get into.
The point is we are loosing our civil rights little by little because to many of us are saying I have nothing to hide and nothing to fear, or it doesn't effect me so why should I care. The fact is there are some mean, vicious, decieptful and skeeming people out there with good intentions and they work for a government. I have seen them and worked with some
It should not be up to you to prove your inocense. It is up to them to prove that you committed an offense. That is what the 5th Amendment is about.
By just trying to defend this position I have had people imply that I use drugs. Thats funny, because from 1989 to 1994 I fought the assault weapons ban, and people then implied that I must be some sociopathic revolutionary that wanted blood to run in the streets. Just because I wanted to defend and preserve a God given right to have a right to choose and be left alone if I'm not causing harm.
I wonder how many rights YOU are going let slip away before you ask where did your freedom go?
One last point. if you haven't noticed it yet the people in power (congress, president,and the people who run the company) don't get drug tested.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 08:26
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I wish it was handled this way. I also think if your getting FREE health care you should pass a yearly physical and if you smoke, drink, drugs ect... you shouldn’t be aloud to use it. Think of how fast the people would get there act together when they found out it's not free if they can't pass all the above guide lines.

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 11:04
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BeltFed, I did not mean to imply that you do drugs.  If it came across that way, I am sorry.  I have no doubt you are a stand up guy.  And for what ever reason you don't trust the people that drug test you, I don't want to know.  That is between you and them.
 
I will agree that our civil liberties are getting tossed out the window.  And I would not allow the government to come into my house and search it without a warrant and probable cause.  And I wouldn't allow them to demand that I take a drug test just so they have a record of it.  That would be infringing on my freedoms.  In that respect I agree with you.
 
When it comes to someone asking for a job or a service (welfare), the person providing that job or service has every right to put stipulations on it.  Take a job for instance.  You apply.  They require you to be qualified for it.  They may require a drug test.  Then to get the benefits (retirement, health) you probably have a probation period, and to keep it all, more drug tests.  If you want the job, you have to be willing to go through all that.
 
As for welfare, they are asking for money from the government and the people paying the taxes that provide the money.  Why should we as tax payers not be able to pick the qualified candidates that ask for welfare?  I think that if someone wants free money, they should have to prove that they are going to be responsible with it.  To me that would include them not being a druggie, and getting wasted out of there mind all the time.
 
I work hard for my money.  I pay my taxes.  I have to be responsible with my money, and my belongings.  I think the government should too.  I don't think that the welfare system is being run responsibly.  I don't want some low life drug addict getting my money so he can go out and get wasted and not contribute to society.
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Interesting topic see both sides but potential loss of rights should not be discounted too easily.  Prospective employer asks for drug test, OK - how would you react if in doing that a DNA sample was also taken to keep on file, or fingerprints from the sample bottle you used?
 
Nothing to fear you say because I've nothing to hide?  1984 is here.
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What gets me the most is that people forget that WE the PEOPLE pay for the government WE hire the government. But the government screws the people and We let it happen. They spend the money they TAKE from us like it's going out of style on things that they shouldn’t be and WE the people sit by and let it happen. The government has got to big. We the people shouldn’t drug test but if you’re on welfare, government paid health care I feel you should be tested. This is one small way WE know where the money THEY take from US on each paycheck is going and not being wasted but actually helping someone that truly needs it. But as for an employer yes I drug test I also send all my employees to a defensive driving class. This saves me a lot of money that I in return are able to pay them more for the job they are doing for me.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2008 at 17:34
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 8shots ... I totally agree .... I live near what is considered a small town and the drug situation has become horrible . They have murders .... robberies  ... and gang activity at a 500 % increase all drug related . This does not come from me ... but many local law enforcenent guys right here . We never had multiple head shot murders here  ... now we do . People are so numb from them it does'nt raise the panic level anymore ! They're talked about so darn casually .... shocks me .... police say their hands are tied by lame judges and worrying about not violating the druggies rights . This whole country better wake up !!! We even have that latino gang 13 something .... the crypts .... and bloods .... and always some new york city gangs ..... christ you'd think it was LA - California !! Then the so called educated Maryland assembly says we can't carry firearms even in our vehicles unless
 we are going to a shooting match or hunting under lock and key . They should tell that to the families of those poor innocent college girls being raped and murdered I see in the news every week now it seems .  
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Big Daddy is the man....
 
(Thats an employer looking out for his employees)


Edited by TPS_Phil - April/23/2008 at 17:52
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Originally posted by BeltFed BeltFed wrote:

Helo this is not about being able to use drugs. This is about the loss of civil rights.
 
Actually BeltFed it's both. The people who use ,want the freedom to use and at the same time not be responsible if they screw up. Just like a drunk driver. If a judge was held accountable for his rulings you would see a different country. Any judge that puts a impaired driver back out side, if that driver hurts or kills someone the judge should serve equal time with the offender.
As far as loss of rights, in this case is the only option. For all the reasons mentioned before and especially for any enforcement. Civil and military. I've known guys who use and that is their business. They know the consiquences and if caught can't pass the blame to anybody  but themselves. But I don't want to be forced to rely on them to have my back under any circumstance. All military does random testing and if one comes up hot, I hate what he will face but he did it eyes wide open. I don't disagree with you because there are radicals who use every oppertunity to dictate their screwed up thinking on us. Unfortunatly it's the idots that use who are making it bad for everyone else.
 
[QUOTE= While you may not see a problem with that because its drugs. I see a problem because it is a government agency searching a person's body for evidence without even probable cause. 
 
Again it's the dead-beat users who will bury us all for a fix.
 
[QUOTE= Now the BEM that started this thread wants to test people receiving government checks. I'm sure it was just in fun, but all this testing crap is getting out of hand.
It is one thing to test people who are responsible for the public safety, and yes an employer can legally test his employees. But I wonder how you really feel about someone else dictating to you how you live your life on your own time.
 
No one who abides by the law is going to stand by and give away their rights. But we are in a up-side down era where the lawyers have made it easy to be a scum bag. Simply for the sake of lining their pockets. Because the drugies have the money from welfare and their drug sales, and even though all lawyers aren't that way. There are enough out there who are. I could support testing for welfare, but they can't do it because if the funds are cut crime will go off the charts. There would have to be marshal law and then there are no rights.
 
[QUOTE= I sweat everytime I have to pee in a cup but not from drug use. I sweat because I don't trust the people taking or evaluating the sample, and I do not trust my employer. I know they use drug test as an intemidation tool, and I have good reasons not to trust them that I will not get into.
 
Again you are right. Sometimes we will test several times in a short span. I have seen sloppy testing and was sure some were not labeled right. When I see that I make a report and hold it so if someone comes up hot that test will be void. Someone was hot but because of the report they can't rely on the accuracy.
 
[QUOTE= I have seen them and worked with some It should not be up to you to prove your inocense. It is up to them to prove that you committed an offense. That is what the 5th Amendment is about.
 
I understand your frustration, but it's not about proving your innocence but getting the 1 in 5 or 7 who shouldn't be there.
 
[QUOTE=I wonder how many rights YOU are going let slip away before you ask where did your freedom go?
 
Until criminals are severly punished to the point of not being worth it your rights will continue to be in jepordy. They got the money and money buys immunity.
 
[QUOTE=One last point. if you haven't noticed it yet the people in power (congress, president,and the people who run the company) don't get drug tested.
 
Because they got the money. They make the rules.
 
My comments don't offer much hope. But we don't give up. We continue to stand  and make our voices heard as much as posible and we will atleast slow it down awhile longer.
 
 


Edited by Sgt. D - April/24/2008 at 22:08
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Dang I was hoping this thread would die because tempors got so high, and it can go in so many different directions. I can't convinence everyone and I'm not going to try. All I can do is give you food for thought. If one Amendment in the Bill of Rights is important enough to fight for then aren't they all?
Would you accept the police randomly searching your house for anything illegal?
Would you accept your employer radomly searching your house at anytime for evidence of theft or lifestyles he does not like?
If your house caught fire would you stay in your house and fight the fire til death because your house is more important than your body?
Has an employer ever fired a good employee because his insurance co. told him to?
Do you like having someone else tell you how to live your personal life if your not bothering anyone else?
Do you like living by rules that were given to you by someone who does not have to live by the same rules?
Would you rather prove your innocense or have your accuser prove your guilt?
Would you trust your life to someone who has no stake in it?
Would you give up your freedom to have a secure life?
Think about these questions more than once if you choose to answer them.
 
Let me get this straight. I am not opposed to drug testing. I am opposed to random drug testing without any probable cause. Even though I don't like it the SCOTUS has said it is ok to test people in certain types of employment (not mandate it but permit it) and I have to live with it. The reason many employers drug test is so their insurance co.s will give them better rates. Have the insurance co.s become the underground government regulating your personal life for their profit?
While I know this thread was started concerning people recieving govt. benefits does anyone really think it would servive a test in the SCOTUS?
I know there are some of you that will argue against what I have said here; that is ok because that is your 1st Amendment Right. If I got you to think about your civil rights and what is happening to them then I have accomplished something.
 While I can go on and on, on this topic I'm not.
Have fun and remember, the right you kill could be your own!
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/25/2008 at 17:03
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