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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:10
Rich M View Drop Down
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First off - Great Forum!  I've learned more about scopes than I ever wanted to.
 
I have a Remington 700 ADL .243 and need to give her some glass.  Hunting is generally limited to FL whitetails (75-150 pounds whole) BUT I do have a mule deer trip to Montana planned for this November.  I will be using the .243, likely with 100 gr Nosler partitions - so please don't tell me to get a bigger gun.
 
Typical shot ranges will be in the 50 to 150 yard bracket and some at the range shooting to 300 (for the trip).  I typically shoot anywhere from 100 to 250 rounds per year out of my deer rifles - more like 500+ this year.  Hunting uses are limited to roughly 8-10 trips/year - mostly thicker woods but some open field type applications.  
 
My scope history - Redfields were my favorite until they went under - still have an "Ultimate Illuminator" 4-12x50 on a 30-06.  I have an older Leupo 4x x30 on a BLR .243 right now - it shows me the crosshairs when I can't see horns or ears so it works pretty well in the seeing where the bullet is going category.
 
I am close to buying the VX-II in 3x9x40 ($300 model)...  (I love the SWFA deal - buy the scope & get the rings/mounts with it.)  I did not care for the 4200 & Burris Fullfield II scopes as compared with the Signature Select, VX-II, and VX-III.  The VX-II had the most wow factor for clarity, focus, & crispness of the scopes I looked at (only slightly more $ than the 4200 - it was nice but not enough to sway me).  The Signature Select was #2 on my list but is a bit pricier than I can go.
 
Right now I'm wondering if I need a 40 mm lense - would a 36 - 32 mm be enough?  I'm also wondering if I need 3-9 power.  For most practical purposes, 2-7 or 2.5-8 isn't much different.  A 32 - 36 mm scope would fit the gun a little better.
 
The Leupo VX-II 2-7x33, VX-III 2.5-8x36 & the Zeiss Conquest 2.5-8x32 fit the bill - I'm very price sensitive and $400 (VX-III & Conquest) is over my budget but I can make it work - especially if the rings & mounts come as part of the deal.
 
There we have it - - what's everyone recommend?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:18
supertool73 View Drop Down
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I say get the Bushnell elite 4200 3-9x40.  It is a great scope and will be perfect for your .243 hunting rig.  It will be leaps and bounds better than the VX II or III
http://www.swfa.com/pc-7280-185-bushnell-3-9x40-elite-4200-rifle-scope.aspx
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:21
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                     Rich,out of those three options? Conquest. Any scope priced lower than these and I would go with  the 4200 3x9. Hope this is helpful!

                                                           til later

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:22
jonbravado View Drop Down
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are you sure you were looking at a 4200, and not a 3200??
 
a 4200 is NIGHT AND DAY better than a VX II - and many would say better than a VX III.
 
the 3-9x40 team primos nikon is the best bang for the buck, next to the 4200.
a VX II simply isn't in the same category for optics. my 2 cents.
 
and some folks out west won't let you hunt mulies with anything less than 30 cal, or at the LEAST .284, so check that out if it's a paid hunt.
 
conquest would absolutely make you happy if you can spring for it. its' the best one you've mentioned in your post. good luck!
 
and welcome to the OT.
 
J
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:30
helo18 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by jonbravado jonbravado wrote:

and some folks out west won't let you hunt mulies with anything less than 30 cal, or at the LEAST .284, so check that out if it's a paid hunt.
 
I guide in montana, and I have never heard that one before, at least not for deer.  Maybe elk.  You will be fine with a 243 even on the mulies.  What part of MT are you hunting in?
 
My vote for the optics goes to the conquest or the 4200.  Both are probably better than the Sig Sel, and the 4200 is a really good price.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 15:34
jonbravado View Drop Down
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Helo18 - it was an elk hunt, but you can shoot mulies too - but there was a .30 minimum for the trip. So technically you are spot on. 243 is a great round, kicks like a baby and nice and flat - perfect for whitetail deer here in the southeast.

J
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 16:24
Rich M View Drop Down
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I have gotten the responses I thought I would.  Whistling  Yes - the .243 is allowed.  The trip is with Hidden Valley Outfitters - Tracy Weyer.
 
I thought the 4200 was bright & clear but it wasn't as "crisp" and focused as the Sig Select and VX-II.   THe VX-II was very nice - it was amazing - and beat the VX-III I looked thru.  Now, this was all in Bass Pro - looking at a deer head on the wall 150 yards away.
 
I'm old enough to have prejudices against Bushnell & Nikon - blame it on my upbringing.  Dad's (and my uncles, too) are Leupo or nothing kind of people.   I don't know if I can break tradition with a Bushnell.  Whacker
 
Anyone have any comments on the 40 mm vs 32 mm scopes?   Will it make much of a difference?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 16:37
helo18 View Drop Down
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If you can, go back in the evening towards dark and see if they will let you take the scopes outside for a look around.  I think you see a difference in the scopes.  I am a big Burris fan, but I have to say that the 4200s are right there with the sig sel if not better.  I too had a bias against bushnell.  Had a scope (old Bushnell cheapy) come apart just from the recoil on my 270, but the 4200 is a good scope.  The 40 mm will only make a difference near the end or beginning of shooting light.  Bigger objective will allow you to use a higher power during those times.  You might want that power out in eastern montana.  It is open country out there.  Take a look at the scopes again outside if possible near dark and see what you think then.  If you still think the leupy is better, then buy it.

Edited by helo18 - March/26/2008 at 16:37
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 16:40
helo18 View Drop Down
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I should add, I had the bias towards bushnell till I got my hands on a 4200, and I am very impressed with it.  I don't think you could go wrong by topping a 243 with a 3-9x40 4200.  One of the best deals out there right now.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 17:07
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Originally posted by Rich M Rich M wrote:

I have gotten the responses I thought I would.  Whistling  Yes - the .243 is allowed.  The trip is with Hidden Valley Outfitters - Tracy Weyer.
 
I thought the 4200 was bright & clear but it wasn't as "crisp" and focused as the Sig Select and VX-II.   THe VX-II was very nice - it was amazing - and beat the VX-III I looked thru.  Now, this was all in Bass Pro - looking at a deer head on the wall 150 yards away.
 
I'm old enough to have prejudices against Bushnell & Nikon - blame it on my upbringing.  Dad's (and my uncles, too) are Leupo or nothing kind of people.   I don't know if I can break tradition with a Bushnell.  Whacker
 
Anyone have any comments on the 40 mm vs 32 mm scopes?   Will it make much of a difference?
.........................Rich!!!...........First off!! You CANNOT properly compare or evaluate any scope INDOORS, looking at a deer head on the wall 150 yards away! They need to be taken outside under the store`s supervision of course and evaluated for clarity, resolution and brightness in all magnifications and at various targets and distances!!........In store comparisons under a roof DO NOT compare with in the field or outside comparisons!!!..............Secondly, there is absolutely no way a VX2`s optics are better than a 4200!! Sorry Charlie!!! Nor can a VX2`s optics compare with the VX3`s.............You need a RE-DO of your comparisons and start over!.... Believe me! That will be to your benefit!!!.............Forget the `ol predijuces. The 4200 is a far different ballgame than the Bushy days of old! Many here on this site including myself realize that!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 17:29
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I'm Just curious if the other previous mentioned scopes were 'infocus" for Riches eyes, this might explain why the vx-II seamed clearer than the other scopes that are far superior.  He may have gotten lucky, in-that the vx-II was aready infocus, while the others were not. 
Also wanted to add that 2-7, 2.5-8 power scope should be sufficient for the intended use,  though I think there are better deals in the 3-9 range, namely the 4200, 3-9.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 17:34
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Everybody has nailed it....For $199- the Nikon Primos is a solid value...For $249- The 4200 is the value leader right now,offers rainguard, and ideal for your rig,,, if you can go  $400, you could  snag a Conquest, but I think you'll be well served by the 4200.

 
Plus, very true about the focus issue ...


Edited by martin3175 - March/26/2008 at 17:35
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 17:42
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...about the Bushnell name---the 4200 and the 3200 are direct decendents of the former Bausch and Lomb scopes.  Even hard core Leupold fanatics should be reined in a little when they realize that those scopes were called Bausch and Lomb up until about 1999.....
 
...but this is just a tiny remark.......you get what makes you happy and go shoot a big one.
 
                                                    Wink            --Ed
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 17:48
Dogger View Drop Down
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Right on Ed.  In the end they will all work well.  Got to go with what you feel good about.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 18:38
Rich M View Drop Down
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Thanks, guys. 
 
I have to figure out why everyone is hammering the 4200 so much.  It appears in a lot of posts on here and in other places too.
 
I guess my best guess is to compare everything to cars - Leupos are like the Chevy truck - good, stand-by, a little more $ but you know what you are getting, then come the Jap models - Honda, Toyota, etc.  Both better than Chevy IMHO, then you can go "up" and get a european make and have a more expensive, and more thought-out vehicle.  (I'm leaving VW out of the equation.)
 
You just gotta know what to look at.  Night-time/evening comparisons in partially lit lots.  Sounds like I gotta get back out there.
 
I did like looking at the deer head thru the scopes!Semi%20Auto  Focus could have been an issue with the VX-III as it was very poor when compared to the VX-II, 4200, & Sig Select. 
 
I was impressed with the clarity and "crispness" on the VX-II, 4200, & Sig Select - I haven't looked thru a new scope in 15 years - they all look good (better) compared to what I had before - and the 4x Leupy on the BLR.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 18:57
lucytuma View Drop Down
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Rich, everyone here is suggesting the 4200, because we are trying to be helpfull and provide you with the best value for your money. 
 
Nothing wrong with the Luepolds you mentioned, I own several and they have provided steller service, however I think, like many others here, that the 4200 3-9x40 is a great value.   
 
In the end all the scopes you are considering are of good, reputable companies and all should provide you with years of hunting. 
 
Good luck, and enjoy your quest for that new scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2008 at 22:03
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I for one can comment on the toughness of the elite 4200, and in lowlight, it's amazing.
I have hunted in the cold pouring rain and the scope performed like a charm.
I had ALWAYS been told to stay away from bushnell for optics, but i can assure you - this isn't the bushnell you are used to.
 
The conquest's reticle is a bit sexier, being etched glass, and the glass is a little better.
But anything zeiss is top notch, imo.
 
Good luck, and knock em down.
 
J
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/27/2008 at 09:35
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I have tested several scopes on a slightly more scientific manner then looking at a deer head in a store. My conclusion thus far is that on all the mid-range scopes the glass is pretty much the same. I would therefore look at the overall ruggedness, reliability of tracking and just plain what looks nice to you. You have to feel good about the scope and trust it when you miss a shot.
Oh, and I would recommend the biggest objective lens you are comfortable with. A 50 is better the a 40 then a 36 for low light and general optical performance.


Edited by 8shots - March/27/2008 at 09:39
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