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SWFA SS 3-15 vs Vortex Viper PST 4-16

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 17:54
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Optics GrassHopper
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Hey folks thanks for taking the time to help me out. Im pretty much as new as it gets to shopping for scopes. My only scoped rifle was passed down to me and im looking to build my own setup. The scope will be mounted on a remington 700 .308 22" barrell. Its a dual purpose scope, hunting and target shooting. My goal is to eventually hit a 1000 yard target on the range. Right now most of my hunting shorts will be inside 200 yards and some could be in low light situations.

I understand the viper may have a few more options like zero stop and illumination but the SS has better glass (from what ive read). Make a case for me what makes one better than the other for my application? Thanks for your help.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 18:02
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Optics GrassHopper
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Also what does FFP do and is it worth 200$ id really like to keep it around <700
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 18:13
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Optics Master
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The 3-15 has my vote as having the lower bottom end and it has better reference of measurement than the PST.  It has lots of internal adjustment to get you to 1000yrds and has a reticle that will serve well at that range.

The PST glass to which I have owned the 4-16 and the 6-24 is good or decent glass and the turrets were repeatable but the reticle units were not as fine for measurement and I was raised on the Mil-Dot and EBR or MMD.  The SWFA has a greater ability to refine measurement with having more reference points in it. 

Just my .02.

I don't know if it would make a great hunting scope, like a Zeiss or Swaro.



Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 18:20
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Optics GrassHopper
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Would you have any other suggestions at that price point or lower?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 19:06
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First Focal Plane = The reticle is Milradian true or accurate across the scopes entire mag range i.e. 3x, 4x, 5x, 6x, 7x, 8x, 9x, 10x, 11x, 12x, 13x, 14x, 15x.

The reticle size maintains the same ratio to the target regardless of magnification setting and is always proportional  to mag setting. 

This is not true of SFP or Second Focal Plane scopes.

SFP= They are only milradian true or accurate or measurable easily without mathematical computation on 1 magnification setting which is usually right at or near 12x or the highest magnification setting not over 12x unless past say 18x than it is usually 24x kind of confusing so let me confuse you more.

a 3-9 would be 9x

a 3-10 would be 10x 

a 3-12 would be 12x 

a 4-12 would be 12x 

a 4-14 would be 12x 

a 4-16 would be 12x 

a 4-18 would likely be 12x

a 6-24 would likely be 24x 

a 8-32 would likely be 24x 

a 10-40 could be 24x or 40x 

these are likely to be true but will not on all scopes * and I am sure others are different and I am sure someone will correct my errors I have made.

Some say that a FFP reticle is too thin to hunt with at a lower mag setting as the reticle or cross hairs are hard to put on target as they can get  "lost" in low light situations.

Some also say that the FFP reticle at lower mag does not draw your eye to the target as it should and is to faint.

other side 

Some say the SFP crosshair is to big for precision work at 1000yrds due to the fact it covers up all or most of the target due to the plane in which the reticle sits and they say the dots are too big.

Both vary from manufacturer to manufacturer as they choose the thickness of the reticles.  

For instance the Vortex Razor has a slightly thicker Reticle for a FFP scope which allows it to be seen at the lower mag range better than say other scopes but some then complain it covers up to much of the target for precise work.

It is all a matter of opinion.


No one
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 19:20
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Optics Master
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Oh yeah WELCOME to OT.

red carpet roll >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I hope the experienced people chime in I have limited experience with hunting animals.

Now I resort to paper punching at unusually long distances.

Thoughts or suggestions 

FFP


SFP


OR I MIGHT SAY SPEND A LOT OF TIME LOOKING AT THESE !!!!


OR


Less $$$


lots less $$$




If you could pick up an older BRX SWARO PH Pro Hunter I think you would be in love.

I am thinking your main focus in hunting with these suggestions.

If it is getting to the longer distance and paper punching go to the FFP just my .02 thanks for listening.

The more I think about it the SWFA SS 3-9 might be the ideal scope.  I don't know about the hunting situation though...

Good luck..

Make sure you check back as some do not get on until the weekends and yet others while they are working during the day!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:10
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Optics GrassHopper
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Wow thanks for all of the advice! I had read your comparison of illuminating scopes before but I wasn't able to see the pics on a govt computer. You've definitely provided some more for me to check out.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:18
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Optics GrassHopper
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I may end up spending time at bass pro looking through some FFP vs SFP great glass vs decent. Trying to find something dual purpose while staying @ or below 700 has been kinda difficult. Ideally I could just buy one for both but that's not feasible right now
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:20
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Optics GrassHopper
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I may go ahead and pull the trigger on that one I'm ready to be at the range already!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:21
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SWFA SS MRAD Scopes

SWFA SS 3-15x42 Tactical Rifle Scope
  •  
  •  
  •  
  •  

  • SWFA SS 3-15x42 Tactical Rifle Scope
Stock # - SS315X42MQ
  • Matte Finish
  • First Focal Plane
  • Patented Mil-Quad Reticle
  • 30mm Tube
  • Side Focus (6m-infinity)
  • OK for .50cal
  • .10 Mrad Turrets
  • IN STOCK

 For more information and updates, follow the discussion @

 


No one
Specifications
Exit Pupil: 2.8 - 11.8mm
Field of View @ 100yds: 7.21 - 34.78
Side Parallax Adjustment (m):  6m-Infinity
Eye Relief (in):4.2 - 3.8
Diopter Compensation: -2 ~ +1 dpr
Click Adjustment Value: 0.1 MRAD
Adjustment Per Revoultion: 5 Mils
Total Elevation Adjustment: 36 Mils
Total Windage Adjustment 

36 Mils

Type of Reticle: Mil-Quad
Focal Plane: 1st
Coating: Fully Multi Coated
Waterproof: Yes
Fogproof: Yes
Shockproof: Yes
Weight: 24
Objective Bell Diamater (A): 49.4mm / 1.94"
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:21
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Optics Master
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I doubt you would be disappointed.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:23
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Optics Master
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Scope Swapper

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Try to wait for weekend if possible this thread will get some attention I promise.

Edited by 338LAPUASLAP - September/25/2013 at 21:31
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 21:27
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 22:29
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Optics Apprentice
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Hi Dan, I was in your situation not to long ago looking for an all around scope. Even after i purchased my current scope i still lurk on here and drool over the new scopes coming out. My current scope is a Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x50 Z plex with target knobs. Currently offer under $700 from our gracious host. Im also keeping my eye on a scope for the wifes rifle to replace her current leupold rifleman. I agree with 338Lapua  on the conquest line (since i own one) and on the swaro z3 line, (4-12x50) if it were me. I have been considering building a target rifle and buying a swfa scope, (3-15x42 or 5-20x50) but funds are tight right now. If you want to shoot long distance i would recommend something with target knobs to dial in for drop compensation. I only recommend this for previous issues with a scope that had a ballistic plex reticle. My experience with scopes is limited but i have learned that a quality scope will win over a cheap scope every time. Right now the zeiss are  a steal at the price they are offered..... Also wait a few days for more knowledgeable members to chime in here.... Hope this helps
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/25/2013 at 22:32
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Originally posted by Danchase Danchase wrote:

I may end up spending time at bass pro looking through some FFP vs SFP great glass vs decent.


338 has given you some good advice. And if you are going to compare scopes try to look through them outside. Since the light is different. Indoor lighting is not the same as sun light. And so a scope that looks great indoors may very well not look so great outside.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 00:30
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Originally posted by Danchase Danchase wrote:

I may end up spending time at bxxx pxx looking through some FFP vs SFP great glass vs decent. Trying to find something dual purpose while staying @ or below 700 has been kinda difficult. Ideally I could just buy one for both but that's not feasible right now
Good luck with that they sure dont have them here. 
SWFA has a low price guarantee you wont beat their price.  You probably should determine yourself to step up to the  SS 5-20x50 and just figure out a way to pay the difference once done you will never regret having done so.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 05:30
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Optics Master
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Hunting and the 5-20x don't seem to be a good fit to me weight, size, high lower magnification range, not to mention the fact it is near double his budget.

One thought that crossed my mind was this:  buy a 
SWFA SS 12x42 Tactical Rifle Scope DEMO-C

Product Grading Information

DEMO A: Like New In Box
DEMO B: Shows Very Slight Wear From Use
DEMO C: Shows Obvious Signs of Use
 $249.95

SWFA SS 12x42 Tactical Rifle Scope DEMO-C

Stock # - SPL19373
Add to Wishlist

Manufacture Part#: SS12X42MQ
Finish: Matte
Reticle: Mil-Quad
Tube diameter: 30mm tube
1/10 Mrad target knobs
Fast focus eye piece
Rear parallax adjustment
DEMO-C
1 units available


and then a 

Riflescopes

Zeiss 3-9x42 Terra Rifle Scope DEMO-B

Product Grading Information

DEMO A: Like New In Box
DEMO B: Shows Very Slight Wear From Use
DEMO C: Shows Obvious Signs of Use
 $379.95

Zeiss 3-9x42 Terra Rifle Scope DEMO-B

Stock # - SPL19225
Add to Wishlist
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 05:45
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The SS 3-15 is my hunting scope. I can't think of anything better for even another $1000...and I have run other scopes for years that cost 2-4X as much. The eye relief and reticle are good, the glass is more than adequate. Being able to adjust parallax down to an amazingly short distance (6 m) means you can dry fire practice indoors. For the price, I'll still take care with the scope but will never worry like I did with high-priced optics about dings or scratches. I want to concentrate on hunting not white glove treatment.
 
In some locations/situations an illuminated reticle might be nice. But I never had occasion to use it on the NF I had for four seasons. Also, unless you use a reticle for ranging (and it's not easy), SFP is just as good for scopes up to 10X (that would be the ranging power). And it might be better to have the reticle always the same size. Personally, at lower mag, I use the reticle like a traditional duplex. Speaking of mag, 3-15 is a fantastic range.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 05:51
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If you were going to use 1 scope like a SWFA SS that has lots of internal adjustment I would you use


Howa

Talley Lightweight Aluminum 30mm Scopemount
Stock # - 740700
  • Howa 1500
  • Remington 40X
  • Remington 700
  • Remington 721
  • Remington 722
  • Remington 725
  • Matte
  • Medium
  • 30mm

For:

  • Howa 1500
  • Remington 40X
  • Remington 700
  • Remington 721
  • Remington 722
  • Remington 725


Remington

EGW Picatinny Rail 1 Piece Scope Mount
Stock # - EGW40102
  • Remington 700 Long Action
  • Remington 721 Long Action
  • Remington 725 Long Action
  • Matte
  • 20 MOA

For:

  • Remington 700 Long Action
  • Remington 721 Long Action
  • Remington 725 Long Action

For quicker easy on and off bases

maybe 


SWFA SS Aluminum Mounting 30mm Rings

SWFA SS Aluminum Mounting 30mm Rings

Displaying items 1 - 5 of 5Sort:  < name="ctl00$wpm$CategoryGrid$ctl04$SortResults" id="ctl00_wpm_CategoryGrid_ctl04_SortResults" ="sorting">  < ed="ed" value="Name ASC">By Name (A -> Z)  < value="Name DESC">By Name (Z -> A)  < value="IsFeatured DESC, Name ASC">Featured  < value="Price ASC">By Price (Low to High)  < value="Price DESC">By Price (High to Low)  < value="Manufacturer ASC">By Manufacturer (A -> Z)  < value="Manufacturer DESC">By Manufacturer (Z -> A) 
SWFA SS-Tac 30mm / 1
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 05:56
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jonoMT was one of the posters I was talking about he actually hunts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now just a few more to concur and you are good to go!

Howdy

Whistling




Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 06:27
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Not to pressure you, but I wouldn't drag my feet very long on Sample List products. 

The 2 SS 3-15's are only STILL there because they haven't been seen by Sniper's Hide guys and the fact that I currently find myself adrift in financial horse latitudes.  


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 07:43
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Optics GrassHopper
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What range are you going to be hunting at? 100yards-300yards? below 100yards? above 200 yards maybe out to say 300+ that matters when it comes to adjustment range especially when the goal is 1000yrds of drop (which translates to lots of MOA or mil adjustment or a reticle to do your

The real problem with having a multipurpose scope is the bottom end and the adjustment type or elevation and wind and parallax adjustment turrets being exposed or capped and then the increments matching the reticle or the coarseness or fineness of the measurements.


Right now im in Louisiana most of it will be inside 100 yards but there are some pipelines that go for a long ways. However im trying to move to colorado where im hoping to get game past 300 yards

I had already picked out the Talley mounts.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/26/2013 at 09:27
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Originally posted by jonoMT jonoMT wrote:

The SS 3-15 is my hunting scope. I can't think of anything better for even another $1000...and I have run other scopes for years that cost 2-4X as much. The eye relief and reticle are good, the glass is more than adequate. Being able to adjust parallax down to an amazingly short distance (6 m) means you can dry fire practice indoors. For the price, I'll still take care with the scope but will never worry like I did with high-priced optics about dings or scratches. I want to concentrate on hunting not white glove treatment.
 
In some locations/situations an illuminated reticle might be nice. But I never had occasion to use it on the NF I had for four seasons. Also, unless you use a reticle for ranging (and it's not easy), SFP is just as good for scopes up to 10X (that would be the ranging power). And it might be better to have the reticle always the same size. Personally, at lower mag, I use the reticle like a traditional duplex. Speaking of mag, 3-15 is a fantastic range.
 
Hand delivered.
 
Actually I went to meet with JonoMT and Rifledude in Southern to Central Texas, and they really great job on slaying some ferrel swine.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2013 at 15:28
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Optics GrassHopper
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Broke down and got the SS. I went ahead and bought new because they gave me a 10% discount cant wait to get it mounted and zerod. Ill try to get some pics as soon as they come in
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