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SWFA SS 20x Reticle Subtension?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 15:35
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I am thinking about buying one of these for my long range .338 Ultra. Talked to SWFA they said. they would e-mail me the subtensiion at the intersection of the crosshairs. Well a week came and went no e-mail. Called again today and was told they dont have that info ! WHAT? any manufactuter can tell u this. OK then here is what i get  maybe try Bushnell as they make them for us!!!!!! To say i am turning sour on this scope would be like saying katrina was a bit of wind! I wanna give the scope a try but for the ranges that this gun will be used at I just want to be sure that the crosshairs are fine enough.....does anyone here know the subtension???
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 15:43
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OK  jusy got off the phone with Bushnell and all they know is that the mil dots are .75 MOA and standard mil dot spacing THEY MAKE IT (or import it) AND THEY DONT KNOW WHAT THE RETICLE INTERSECTION SUBTENSION IS! WELL THAT WILL DO IT FOR ME BACK TO LEUPOLD WHERE U CAN FET THIS INFO IN SECONDS
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 16:02
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Thanks for sharing.
 
As bad as I hate the fact you seem dissatisfied with your Super Sniper, please be advised of the following rule of engagement.
 
6.  The Optics Talk forum is not to be used as a customer service tool for SWFA customers.  Tracking numbers, Order Status, Credit Card issues, etc. need to be directed to our Customer Service Professionals at 972-617-7056 from 8 a.m -5 p.m CDT or via e-mail at swfa@swfa.com.
 
Sorry your disappointed in the SS and/or SWFA.
Myself and MANY, MANY others love them BOTH!  Wink


Edited by cheaptrick - June/14/2010 at 16:16
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 16:14
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MANY!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 17:03
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Cheaptrick. If u read my post again . I AM NOT in any way dissatisfied with my super sniper I DONT HAVE ONE!!!!!! All I am try to do get get simple tech specs for the scope SO I CAN BUY ONE!!!!!......But the level of intel is pretty darn low wouldent u say???
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 17:05
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I wouldn't buy the 20X, get the 10X and live happily ever after.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 17:20
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Originally posted by slatereno slatereno wrote:

Cheaptrick. If u read my post again . I AM NOT in any way dissatisfied with my super sniper I DONT HAVE ONE!!!!!! All I am try to do get get simple tech specs for the scope SO I CAN BUY ONE!!!!!......But the level of intel is pretty darn low wouldent u say???
 
I stand corrected on that. Why are you screaming?
 
May I interest you in a free online spell checker??
Wink
 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 17:47
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Cheaptrick,
After reading my last post i can understand your comment about a spell checker! Perhaps you may want to look into a bit of remedial reading as well! However i choose not engage in a battle of wits with those who are not well armed. The question still begs: Does any one know the reticle subtension on the 20x SS????
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 18:37
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Knowing the dots are .25 mils, then looking through mine, I would guess that the cross is probably 1/10 of a mil.  It is pretty small.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 19:28
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Thank you so much supertool73  Bushnell told me the mil-dots are .75 mil but even so if its alot thinner say 1/10 of that that will be fine. I read as well as heard many good things about these scopes. I am going to utilize it fo ultra long range groundhog hunting here in PA and I was concerned that at 1200yards or further it would cover up too much of the target. Thank you again
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 19:28
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Well, this begs the question why a 338 ultra needs a fix 20 power?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 19:31
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never mind.  Laugh Above
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 20:05
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So does Bushnell really make these scopes for SWFA? So are they really better than similar priced Bushnell options? Or are they just so highly recommended because this forum is run by SWFA?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 20:18
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Wrong choice for 1200 yds the 20x Super Sniper is actually better suited for more moderate ranges at 1200 yds you will ultimately be dissatisfied.  If you must go with a 20x fixed power at that distance you would be better advised to select the Sightron SIII.
in fact  I would want a larger objective than the 42mm at least 50 mm and I beleive you will be ultimately dissatisfied with any 20x fixed power scope because they look grey in low light and you can not dial down the power to brighten the image, but then I have actually owned one.  I think you are way too hung up on the math but you should be able to find some helpful info on  this SWFA web site. 
 
One does not get extra brownie points here for being rude so play nicely or be banned.
 
Sightron 6-24x50 SIII 30mm Riflescope Mil-Dot Sightron 6-24x50 SIII 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - SIIISS624X50LRMD
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$804.95
http://www.unionsportsmen.org/index.php/hunting/category/riflescope_magic


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - June/14/2010 at 20:19
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 20:28
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Definition for "reticle subtension" : Most commonly expressed in inches per 100 yards, reticle subtension is the amount of the target covered by the reticle. This known amount of coverage by the reticle can be compared against the size of an object in the scope's image, and be used to estimate the range of the object.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 20:31
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Originally posted by slatereno slatereno wrote:

Cheaptrick,
However i choose not engage in a battle of wits with those who are not well armed.
 
Your probably right.    Big Grin
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 20:33
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me thinks somebody needs to be taken out back for an attitude adjustment.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 21:17
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I agree with Urimaginary a fixed 20x would not be a good choice.  You will need to be able to turn it down if you have mirage problems.  Plus the exit pupil will be pretty low.

You said in the first post that Bushnell said .75 MOA.  That is .25 Mil.  .75 mil would be a pretty big mildot.




Edited by supertool73 - June/14/2010 at 21:20
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 21:30
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I just find it ironic that a vicious vermin as terrible as a Groundhog needs a 338 ultra mag from 1200 yards away.   They must really grow'em bigger up north.    Roll on Floor Laughing
You sure you ain't in Texas?   LOL!
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 22:36
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Pyro, had a fella with the same idea awhile back....here though he is back on solid food as of april!!! All kidding aside I asked a simple question....got admonished incorrectly for using the wrong forum...then for my typing and/or spelling skills. I have served my country for 24 yrs and fellas been scared lots of times.....only got out of some tight spots cause the almighty had my butt off the ground by the belt carrying me to a better spot....so i take NOTHING sitting down gents when i am right. If i offended any one sure am sorry but cant see what i did wrong here. Bushnell said .75 Minutes not .75 mil. Ya the .338 is big but we use it for 2 reasons first it minimizes wind correction and god knows I can use all the help I can get in that dept. secondly as far as we are shooting its been hard to see the bullet splash here if the hay is up a bit and or its rained a few days before and we cant get a dust plume. I had a leupold 6.5x20-40mm on this gun  and it was fine at 20x....we are shooting in good light so exit pupil is not really a factor. mirage has been ok  even at 20x for us. All i was tryin to figure was the crosshais thickness....just did not want to obscure too much of the hog when we are way out there....once again if I offended any one i sure did not mean to
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 22:53
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Originally posted by slowr1der slowr1der wrote:

So does Bushnell really make these scopes for SWFA? So are they really better than similar priced Bushnell options? Or are they just so highly recommended because this forum is run by SWFA?
They are made in Japan in a large optics factory and they have their own specifications.  There is an arrangement with Bushnell to do warranty work in spite of the fact that even the new 6x that I recieved a couple of days ago has TASCO literature.  It cost money to print up nice literature and since most of the info you would want is on mil-dot.com you dont really need it.  Mil dots are always one milradian apart center to center which would measure 3.6 inches at 100 yds or 36 inches at 1000 yds.   One of the reasons these scopes are so well liked is the ease of use of the tactical target knobs combined with how tough they are. There are two basic styles of 10x the rear focus and the side focus as for the 10x Bushnell it has no parallax adjustment where these do which is important at long range. The SS has about 120 moa of internal adjustment where most Bushnell products have about 50 moa.  Yes there are differences however these are not the perfect optic for all users as a lot of guys want higher power variables and building one is being considered. The 3-9x42 variable and the 10x HD are entirely different products and while also made in Japan they are quite unique and have very high quality glass.  I tend to really like a Bushnell 4200 and have a couple of them but the dont have alot of internal adjustment.
 
Most of the guys on this forum have no connection to SWFA and are giving honest opinions based on their personal experience.  If you have not tried a Super Sniper buy the 3-9x42 you wont be sorry you did it is an amazing scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/14/2010 at 23:15
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I would  use the 10x HD long before I would use the 20x SS at 1000+   If you said you were shooting gofers at 300 yds I would say buy the 20x SS but anything out around 1200 yds I think you will be unhappy with the 20xSS and it wont be because the width of the crosshairs it will be the image quality and physics of using a scope that is 20x with a 42mm objective you really need a 50 or 56 mm objective and top quality glass at that distance.  A Nightforce 5.5-22x56 would be the ideal choice for you but you could get away with a Sightron SIII for half the price.   Can you drop back to a $300 optic and get $2200. performance - dont think so.  While you are at it you really should consider the Leupold VX3 6.5-20x50  30mm scope it just wont have the internal adjustment the Sightron SIII will.
Learn the hard way though if you must.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/15/2010 at 05:23
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Originally posted by slatereno slatereno wrote:

All kidding aside I asked a simple question....got admonished incorrectly for using the wrong forum...then for my typing and/or spelling skills.
 
No, you didn't get incorrectly admonished. You bagged on SWFA and the rules state that this forum isn't to be used for that. (Check your remedial reading skills.)
That's the "etc" part of Rule 6 which is to be determined at a moderators discretion.
Using SWFA's website to disparage them or there staff is discouraged.   
 
Your mad spelling skills on your first few posts were....lacking. "Wouldent u say?"
 
So, thank you for your service and lets start over. I misread your initial post and admitted it.  
K?


Edited by cheaptrick - June/15/2010 at 05:23
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/15/2010 at 06:51
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Originally posted by slowr1der slowr1der wrote:

So does Bushnell really make these scopes for SWFA? So are they really better than similar priced Bushnell options? Or are they just so highly recommended because this forum is run by SWFA?
 
Not technically.   (Elders correct me if I am wrong) 
Tasco started the SS for a military contract.  When they dropped interest in production of it, SWFA bought/obtained the patents and rights to make the SS once again.  They revamped it to say and made it tougher and more durable.  Since then they have expanded beyond the 10X and to say its been well recieved is an understatement.  The reason so many of us recommend them is not because this is a SWFA site, but because they are arguably the best for the price in the industry.  We would be the first to tell Chris and the guys that a scope was crap, but they will not allow that to happen because they are putting there name, and livelyhood, on the line with each one they make/design.  Now, Bushnell bought tasco years ago, they handle the warranty work for them, to say that Bushnell makes the scope is like saying the Ford dealership in town makes the vehicle.  Bushnell is just a mother company they don't make anything, except money, i dont' think.  They send the designs out and a factory overseas builds scopes to their specs and sends them back to Bushnell to market.  I'm not sure if SS stops at Bushnell on their way to SWFA or not, but they are not Bushnell products IMO, they are SWFA SS's.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/15/2010 at 09:01
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U bet cheaptrick Thats fine with me. OK  think i am gonna go to different scope. Cant use a 10x as my eyes a groundhog just appears too little even @ 700 yards with that amount of power. As a side note I dont care who makes the scope....i have seen a few guys in AFG who got them and they were happy with them. Everybody seems to like them so i thought i would give  one a shot. Does not matter if Light Optical or another Pacific rim house puts them together...they are doing it to someones specs.....Tasco never built a scope period! as alot of big brands dont (think nikon owns a plant that they build scopes in?) no they dont. SWFA told me to contact Bushnell for the specs....thats all i know ....and again if they are good who cares ?
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