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Steiner gs3 and Leica ER 2.5-10x42

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/18/2014 at 19:05
graywolf.260 View Drop Down
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I just looked at these two demo scopes today in a box store under fluorescent lights and a little bit outside during bright daylight hours. The Leica had a very nice eyebox indeed but the Steiner also seemed very good. The GS3 coating tinted the lens noticibly but I liked the solid build and reticle and sight picture and clarity. The price on the Steiner was pretty good, about half the Leica, and I am tempted to pick it up. Any body have any experience with these? I'd rather have the Leica but it's more than I want to spend and it seems like the Steiner is very good. I just haven't seen any critical reviews..
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/18/2014 at 22:32
graywolf.260 View Drop Down
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Essentially this
http://www.samplelist.com/Steiner-2-10x42-GS3-Rifle-Scope-DEMO-B-P77689.aspx

vs this

http://www.samplelist.com/Leica-25-10x42-ER-Rifle-Scope-DEMO-B-P78486.aspx

I'm looking for opinions on whether the Steiner is not in the same league and I should just wait and save up for the Leica or whether they are pretty comparable....
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/20/2014 at 23:39
graywolf.260 View Drop Down
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Ok I will stop yelling in the echo chamber after this. I take it no has any knowledge of steiners hunting scopes. Or interest in discussing them
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 00:01
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I haven't seen these new Steiner scopes so I can't say how they compare to the Leica ER. I can say that I own the Leica ER 2.5-10 that I bought off the Sample List and optically, it is unreal. My previous favorite scopes were the Bushnell Elite 2.5-10x40's as I've owned 6 of them and still have 2 of them mounted on hunting rifles. They replaced all the Leupold VX-III's I owned and I never regretted replacing those Leupold's. The Leica, on the other hand, is not in the same league as the very good Elites. The Leica was like brand new even though it was listed as a "B" class scope. The eye relief on the Leica is much better also and that was important to me as the scope was going on my 300 WM.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 05:30
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Nice set up, Mr. Roy. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 11:24
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.

Thanks bro. Whenever someone asks the question......" What's your favorite rifle...." I have to choose between that rifle and my customized Husqvarna 30/06 that has the McMillan Remington Mountain Rifle stock pattern (which they will no longer do) and the 24" Hart barrel. Those two rifles are unbelievably accurate considering their sporter weight barrels. Here is a shot of the custom Husky wearing a B&L Elite in 2.5-10x40.




This is my all original unfired Swede Deluxe in 30/06.






The reticle in the Leica ER is near perfect. If I could change anything about it, I would extend the thicker outer bars closer to the center intersection so that it would be more visible in low light.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 11:40
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Once gain, exceptionally nice, Roy. 

I've noticed in my tenure here that whenever you post a picture of your gear, it's immaculately clean and practical in design and function. 




Edited by Roy Finn - December/21/2014 at 12:19
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 11:56
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Originally posted by Roy Finn Roy Finn wrote:

.





This is my all original unfired Swede Deluxe in 30/06.





Very nice! I wish McMillan still made that Mountain Rifle stock pattern!

Looks Like Buehler rings on both rifles. Don't see them very often anymore.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:05
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Originally posted by Roy Finn Roy Finn wrote:





First class rig all around. I've always thought the APR was one of Remington's nicest looking rifles. The stock lines are near perfect to my eyes. The shape/proportions of that stock looks a lot like a David Miller design. And, you already know what I think of the Leica ER 2.5-10X42. One of my all-time favorite hunting scopes!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:13
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Yup those are Buehler's Ted. I wanted something different and clean looking and they also had a reputation for being very strong as well. Back when I wanted to get a McMillan stock for the custom Husky, McMillan was much more of a "custom fit" company than they are today, probably because they've gotten so busy. I remember them saying that the mountain Rifle pattern might not be deep enough to accommodate the magazine box on the Husky, but they were able to make it work as I had them do the installation (pillar bedded and marine-Tex epoxy). They were ALOT less expensive on their price to do the work as well. Today, you can get either one of two Sako patterns, the Hunter or Classic stock, which are very nice too. Even with the Mountain Rifle pattern, you can still get four rounds in the belly and one in the chamber. I think McMillan charges something like $350 for a custom install today and I think they charged me around $225-250 for mine which I considered a pretty good deal considering that they didn't even know if it would work.    
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:20
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Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

Once gain, exceptionally nice, Roy. 

I've noticed in my tenure here that whenever you post a picture of your gear, it's immaculately clean and practical in design and function. 




I believe in simplicity and function for hunting rigs. I try to take care of my stuff as well, but if I pulled the bolt you'd see that the rifle has some rounds down the barrel (second barrel) as you can see the signs of wear on the Black-T finish. Not that long ago, I sent the bolts on that rifle and the one on my Remington CS African Plains Rifle to Birdsong for a re-finish which they did at no charge. Sounds anal right.........grin
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:26
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Speaking of which... to the OP's question, I too have never seen the Steiner.

However, I would buy the Leica ER 2.5-10X42 in a heartbeat. I have two of them. It's a superb scope, and now that Leica introduced the ERI series, there's no better time to get an ER scope than right now! The current prices you see on them is a steal! My only minor criticisms of the ER series is the W/E adjustments don't have as much rotation resistance as I'd prefer, and as Roy said, I'd prefer the bars on the duplex and 4A reticles extended a little further toward the center. Apart from that, they're about as close to perfect as hunting scopes get to my way of thinking. They've been rock solid at holding zero for me. I've never heard of anyone having any mechanical failures on an ER scope. They're optically outstanding with very good resolution. They have very generous eye relief, high contrast, and fantastic low light performance. On top of all that, they have "Aqua-Dura" hydrophobic lens coatings, and from my experience, that is a very useful feature. The short ocular housing gives you more free main tube length for mounting flexibility on a wide range of rifles without needing extension rings. At the same time, it still has a relatively compact OAL for its mag range despite having a generous main tube length, again due to the unusually short eyepiece housing.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:38
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I haven't seen the steiner, but the leica scopes are nice.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 12:48
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Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

Originally posted by Roy Finn Roy Finn wrote:





First class rig all around. I've always thought the APR was one of Remington's nicest looking rifles. The stock lines are near perfect to my eyes. The shape/proportions of that stock looks a lot like a David Miller design. And, you already know what I think of the Leica ER 2.5-10X42. One of my all-time favorite hunting scopes!


Thanks Ted. My favorites from the custom shop are the APR, the KS SS Mountain Rifle and the original Alaskan Wilderness Rifle. When first introduced, the KS and AWR came with McMillan stocks whereas today (you can't even get those rifles today) now wear B&C stocks, which while good stocks, are no where's near as good as the McMillan's. Today, I think they make a rifle called the North American or something to that effect. I'm sure they are nice, but they have doubled the price and are using a cheaper stock. I wouldn't pay the $3000 asking price. Back when I had the APR built, I asked the custom shop guys if they would use one of their match grade, hand lapped button rifled 40X barrels instead of the standard hammer forged barrels and I also had them install a 40X externally adjustable trigger (1.5 lbs-3.5 lbs). There wasn't any pricing structure for a 40X barrel on a non 40X rifle and the shop manager said they've never had anyone request that before. I said how much extra would that cost me after I had them give me a big selling job on how different the "custom shop hammer forged barrels" were from the production HF barrels. After his big selling job, he didn't have much room to charge me a whole lot extra for the 40X barrel (yeah, I know it was alittle dishonest of me to suck him in and I knew he would have to justify the cost of the hammer forged barrels used in the CS so I had him in a position where he couldn't go much above and beyond on pricing at that point). He asked if $150 extra for the barrel and trigger sounded fair. I paused for a half second and said ok. On top of that when the rifle was going to be put together, I got a call from this gentleman saying that because I had asked for their black Teflon finish on the stainless barrel and the rifle came with the CM action, he asked me if I would mind if they used a stainless action instead of the CM because they weren't sure how the color would match up using SS and CM together. He said he wouldn't charge me extra. With a big (fake) sigh, I gave him the go ahead. That rifle today, with those options would list out near 4 grand. I paid $1450.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 13:39
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You did indeed get a great deal on that rifle, Roy!

The other Rem Custom Shop offering I really like is the M7 MS with the Mannlicher style stock. I have one in 7-08, and really love it. It just feels "right," to my eyes the full length stock looks great on this rifle, and it balances and points so nicely.





Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 13:52
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I forgot about that one Ted and that is another BIG favorite and I was looking for one of those in 7-08 as well. Love that little rifle. That rifle looks so sweet in that laminate stock and the ones I've handled had very smooth actions. You topped it with THE perfect scope too, the Kahles 2-7. Talk about similar good taste ! ! ! How does it shoot Ted ?



Is it for sale... BUDDY ?

Edited by Roy Finn - December/21/2014 at 13:57
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 14:26
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Roy, it's not for sale, but if I ever do decide to sell it, I'll make sure you get first dibs, as I know you would really appreciate it!

It shoots absolutely FANTASTIC, which is what really surprised me about this rifle! I expected the full stock to cause issues with barrel pressure changing over time. The laminated wood was a good choice for this style stock, being more resistant to warpage over time, which would pose problems for a Mannlicher style stock. I've been able to get a little less than .75 MOA with this rifle using 140 Accubonds, which I'm tickled with, especially for a little carbine like this! I love carrying this little rifle around! The forend is so slim and just feels lively in the hands. I really like the forend taper proportions to the steel muzzle cap.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 14:34
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I'd give you $800 just because we're friend's......and with the scope, I could go as high as $1000.......grin Seriously though, there was a gun shop in my area that was selling them for about $1200 IIRC though it might have been used, but in perfect condition. A 243 would be fantastic in that little rifle as well.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 14:49
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I have a Steiner 4-16x50 Predator Extreme. It has the S-1 reticle and it is a bit thin for low light usage. The glass is fine and I will be able to  compare it with the Leica in question in a few days.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 20:17
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Well, the Leica ER 2.5-10 gets enthusiastic recommendations from everyone that owns one as far as I see. And there are some great deals now that they are discontinued. The only review I found on the Steiner 2.5-10x42 is very positive (http://www.outdoorhub.com/reviews/2014/09/18/steiner-gs3-2-10x42-riflescope/ ) but I'm not sure how critical and objective the reviewer is. I'm tempted to try out the Steiner but I can't justify getting both and I need a great scope for a new custom rifle (a Tikka chambered in 6.5 SAUM by GAP). In fact I better sell a scope before I get the next one, or at least promise my wife I'm selling one. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/21/2014 at 20:36
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Originally posted by graywolf.260 graywolf.260 wrote:

but I'm not sure how critical and objective the reviewer is.


When was the last time you read a review from some publication that said the product was poor?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/22/2014 at 10:43
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Graywolf:

I did a search on this forum and  no one has previously discussed "Steiner" rifle scopes. That would explain why your only getting feedback on the "Leica" which you mentioned.

"Steiner" is a  respected name in optics, and it may very well be an excellent product, but I would not assume that. More than one respected name has been compromised for the sake of corporate profit. The fact that your not getting feedback on the GS3 would make me nervous. It may be (new) good, but it sounds like it's not a proven product.

The better questions to ask here is; I need a scope for ______ purpose, that is being mounted on my _____, and my budget is _____, what are your recommendations?  If your going to spend $800+ on glass, you want to get the best/proven product out there. For that kind of money you'll have plenty of choices.

Good Luck

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/22/2014 at 11:31
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Originally posted by Roy Finn Roy Finn wrote:

I'd give you $800 just because we're friend's......and with the scope, I could go as high as $1000.......grin 



Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/22/2014 at 12:41
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Originally posted by Skytrash Skytrash wrote:

Graywolf:

I did a search on this forum and  no one has previously discussed "Steiner" rifle scopes. That would explain why your only getting feedback on the "Leica" which you mentioned.

"Steiner" is a  respected name in optics, and it may very well be an excellent product, but I would not assume that. More than one respected name has been compromised for the sake of corporate profit. The fact that your not getting feedback on the GS3 would make me nervous. It may be (new) good, but it sounds like it's not a proven product.

The better questions to ask here is; I need a scope for ______ purpose, that is being mounted on my _____, and my budget is _____, what are your recommendations?  If your going to spend $800+ on glass, you want to get the best/proven product out there. For that kind of money you'll have plenty of choices.

Good Luck


I have not tested the GS3, but I have seen it.  Leica is a better scope.  Which one is better for the money is a tough call though.

Personally, I am a huge fan of Leica scopes and if budget allows it, I would go that way.

Steiner is no slouch, but it is in a different price range and that is where it competes.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/22/2014 at 15:55
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To a small extent, I have to agree with the comments regarding the "new " Steiner scopes, however, they are really new in the sense that it is a new design with no track record. As I said earlier, these scopes are made by Burris using Steiner's glass and reticle. Aswe all know, Burris has been making durable riflescopes for a long long time and I con't say which Burris model these new Steiner scopes are built around. Maybe someone here, who is more familiar with Burris scopes can say which base model or series that these new Steiner scopes are being built around. With that said, I would have very little concern about these new Steiner scopes from a durability and tracking standpoint. Personally, I don't really care for the Steiner ranging reticle as it appears to be on the light side for really low light hunting.
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