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Spirit Levels in Scopes

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 01:37
BlindGuy View Drop Down
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Has anyone got any experience with Scopes that have integral Spirit Levels (commonly referred to as Bubble Levels) to help reduce cant?
 
I am looking at a KONUS PRO 3-12X56 M30 SCOPE 7283 for a 1,000 yard 7mm Rem Mag to reduce my cant when bullet drop is around 30 feet. Ballistics tables indicate 20 feet, but that is in addition to the up angle needed to zero the gun. Actual drop is closer to 30 feet so 15 degree cant will throw a shot off about eight feet. Of course I think my cant is in the 5 degree variation range but two to three feet is still something to deal with.
 
I read in a post (one of the four reviews I was able to find for the M30 scopes) that their spirit level was not easy to use.
 
Does anyone know if they are viable?
 
Who else sells scopes with a spirit level integral to the scope?
 
 
Jim
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 03:13
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I have been looking at scopes off and on all day long for a good while now...have not seen another scope like that yet.  There are a few of this type though http://www.snipertools.com/marine_corp.htm

Nightforce and Horus have them and I think a few more. 


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 03:28
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I don't know why I was thinking angle indicator after reading your post...the Horus one does have a level though....and there are others out there.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 06:32
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I haven't seen a lot of internal levels, but U.S. Optics makes some rail and ring mounted anti-cant devices. They are about $70-$90 depending on what you get, but look to be well made. I don't have one(yet).
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 07:02
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Springfield Armory scopes had levels in them, but the glas was terrible and the reticles weren't great - so they faded fast.

I like rail-mounted level but internal levels never really caught on - and it seems no one demanded them.

Most hunters take shots at 100 yards or so, where cant isn't  a big deal.  If taking long shots (400+), cant becomes a factor and I recommend a rail-mounted level.  I have US Optics levels and they work well.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 10:40
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Originally posted by billyburl2 billyburl2 wrote:

I haven't seen a lot of internal levels, but U.S. Optics makes some rail and ring mounted anti-cant devices. They are about $70-$90 depending on what you get, but look to be well made. I don't have one(yet).
If I were to rail mount I could probably get a spirit vial and just caulk it to a notch with silicon sealant for about $3.00 total cost. Of course it would not be as well made as a custom rig.
 
How does one use the rail mounted devices? I am imagining it requiring me to move my eye from the retical to some view that required me to adorn eyeglasses and focus on a bubble five inches away then return to my diopter corrected retical view. I do not think that would work well for me.
 
Also I am persuaded that a 15 degree cant is not such a bad thing if it is canted the same way every time. Setting the scope with a 15 degree cant and the windage zeroed at 400 yards while elevation is zeroed at 200 yards would be a small price to pay for having the rifle fit my form rather than requiring a pure vertical alignment for each shot. Is my model seriously flawed?
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 10:48
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
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Yes, your model is flawed. Any dope change will throw rounds severely off target.

So long as you always shoot the same range, never make an adjustment to windage or elevation, and always cant the same amount, you can be spot-on at 400 yards.

I mount my levels so that my eye not on the scope can consult the level before my final firing routine.



[edited for poor wordsmanship]



Edited by Rancid Coolaid - September/05/2009 at 09:17
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 10:49
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You could try it but I don't think it will work out right my man....adding the cant (probably harder to be more consistent with a cant than regular correct hold) to the other stuff like angle to target, wind, altitude, temperature, etc. just don't seem like a win situation.

I started shooting rifles when I was about 5 years old and my dad would slap me if I used a cant....in the Marine Corps they would also slap you if you used a cant....and looking at charts at how much that crap can throw your bullet off I wouldn't want to try it.

If you shoot anything but targets the fatigue set in could make your body a little lazy and change your cant angle then you are definitely off whatever you ended up figuring out your placement would be. 

If your body can not sit behind the weapon properly you should probably trade it off brother.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/04/2009 at 10:55
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That sounds like a great idea Rancid, do it at the same time your getting your wind read.  I think I would be OCD with the anti-cant bubble and looking at the thing 5-10 times before I shot if I could see it with my open left eye. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2009 at 06:12
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Originally posted by danjojoUSMC danjojoUSMC wrote:


I started shooting rifles when I was about 5 years old and my dad would slap me if I used a cant....in the Marine Corps they would also slap you if you used a cant....
 
Wink
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