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Sightron, Vortex, IOR. Which do I want?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/17/2012 at 15:41
zlman View Drop Down
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Looking to do a serious upgrade in optics for prairie dog shooting out to as far as 700yds. Current scope is a Vortex crossfire that has real glass issues past 100yds.
Sightrons come highly recommended but I'm torn on if I want 6-24 or 8-32 power.
I like the idea of the Vortex pst line up but I've read that once past 16 or so power, they start to darken and get some blurriness.
To add to the confusion I have a line on a used IOR 6-24 w/ illuminated ret. The IOR is almost $300 more than my other options but I'm wondering if the glass is significantly better to justify its cost. The IOR scope is $1600/new, I could grab it for about $1100. 
I feel like I'm going a little insane researching the different pros/cons of each scope, I think I want someone to say, "buy X, you won't regret it". The $800+ price on these scopes is some serious money for me and I want to be sure of my choice.
Any thoughts are appreciated.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/17/2012 at 16:03
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the sightron has real good glass, the 24X range should be plenty
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2012 at 03:05
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http://www.samplelist.com/Minox-4-20X50-ZA5-Rifle-Scope-DEMO-B-P55325.aspx
 
I'd try that if I were looking for something with that much power.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2012 at 09:27
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Zlman, very often weather conditions do not allow for that much magnification when shooting p-dogs.  I have a Sightron Big Sky II in 3-9x42 and like the scope.  Have not used the 6-24 model, but others have and posted reviews on them.   

Silver makes a good recommendation with the Minox.  I have a 3-15x50 and like it very much.  For me it is the right amount of magnification as I usually have the magnification set on 10 or 12. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 13:25
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Sightron Glass > Vortex PST Glass by a landslide ... at 24x the difference is pretty significant.  THe downside to Sightron, in my opinion, is there reticle selection.  I went with a 6-24 PST for the same thing, P Dog smokin.  I haven't had it long enough to really give much feedback other than next to my Sightron the SIII glass is a lot better at 24x.  At 12x the PST is pretty good ... seems above 18-20 it really drops off and gets cloudy.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 13:52
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The Sightron and the Minox both have better glass than the Vortex. I live in Texas and owned a Minox 4-20 and used it in the heat and and it performs better at high power than the Vortex. I would go ahead and Narrow your list down to the Minox or the Sightron. Especially with how the availability is on the PST right now. That Minox on the Samplelist is a good deal! However it is hard to go wrong with the Sighton also.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 13:54
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Vortex PST Glass by a landslide!!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 14:37
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Originally posted by military military wrote:

Vortex PST Glass by a landslide!!!!
Loco
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 15:36
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Originally posted by Chris Farris II Chris Farris II wrote:

Originally posted by military military wrote:

Vortex PST Glass by a landslide!!!!
Loco
 
 
I have been bitten by Voltex fever.  Forgive me for being so opinionated. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 15:52
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No need to ask for forgivness. Vortex makes a good scope, but the PST is not on par in the glass category with the Minox or the Sightron. We don't mind opinions but anyone who has set down with them both wouldn't say that. We don't mind you being so excited about Vortex, but don't just start throwing around it is better than this or that without actually using both please. Because a lot of people use this site as a threshold for stuff like this and yes I have used the Vortex side by side with my Minox. The Minox is way brighter especially in low light conditions.

Edited by Chris Farris II - May/11/2012 at 16:51
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 16:15
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Very well said Chris.  Its nice to see a leader with standards.  You set a good example.  I have always liked the idea of at least looking through a scope before providing an opinion.  Excellent

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 16:28
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Originally posted by Chris Farris II Chris Farris II wrote:

No need to ask for forgivance. Vortex makes a good scope but the PST is not on par in the glass category with the Minox or the Sightron. We don't mind opinions but anyone who has set down with them both wouldn't say that. We don't mind you being so excited about Vortex but don't just start throwing around it is better than this or that without actually using both please, because a lot of people use this site as a threshold for stuff like this and yes I have used the Vortex side by side with my Minox. The Minox is way brighter especially in low light conditions.
 
I will certainly give Minox and Sightron some looks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2012 at 18:24
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I just spent the day at the range with a 4.5-14X50 Mark 4, VIper 4-16X50 PST, and 4-12X50 Swaro z3.  I was primarily testing tracking utilizing the awesome Horus Vision calibration targets.  I will be publishing a full comparison review at a later date.
 
However, after spending a lot of time with these scopes, here is how I feel about the PST optical quality:
 
You hear a lot about "cloudiness" at the max magnification with these scopes.  I have found in the 4-16 it is actually a dip in the contrast of the image.  The resolution remains quite high, as I was reading fine print on a target at 100 yards.  Seeing details of the target is not a problem with this scope.  The image quality is not poor, but when viewed side-by-side with a scope that maintains high contrast (the Z3 is especially good in this area), it is quite noticeable.  The image contrast is good right up to around 13x-14x.  You can actually see it drop as you spin the mag ring past that point.  Still, even at max power, the image quality is good enough to send quality shots at long range.
 
That said, the low contrast at max power is the only real weakness the scope has.  The tracking is impeccable.  The EBR reticle is very nice.  Illumination is well done, but not daylight visible.  The eye relief is long and constant.  The rotation stop is not a true zero stop, but functions well within its limits.  Turret feel is great!  This is a very good scope, and offers a lot of usefull features that other scopes (scopes that beat it in high-mag contrast) don't.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/12/2012 at 10:32
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Well after a ton of research and frustration with availabilty issues I found an in stock Zeiss Conquest 6.5-20 with the varmint recticle. The glass is beautiful and I'm learning where my drops are with the new recticle. So far I'm very happy with this scope. I scan the for sale boards of several different forums almost daily though looking for a 6-24 or 8-32 sightron but so far no luck.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/13/2012 at 01:08
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I am a bit late to this thread, but here are a couple of comments:
- PST is a nice scope with a very full feature set, but optically it is no match for Sightron S3, especially at high magnification.  Under $1k, Sightorn S3 is hard to beat.
- IOR 6-24x scope has gone through a number of iterations some good and some not so good.  The latest 6-24x56 is a nice scope, but you should be careful with the older models.
- If you are planning to extend your range, make sure the scope has plenty of adjustment range for it.  I always get a little leery of operating to close to the edges of the adjustment range, so I plan my scope choices accordingly.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/15/2012 at 08:04
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I have a Sightron II 4-16x44mm AO with the standard duplex on my .243 - I like it alot. I have a Sightron II Big Sky 6-24-44mm AO with the dot reticle on my .204 that I like even better. I went with these because of the AO adjustment was on the objective bell which supposedly allows for a bit more finer adjustment than a side focus (but I've never tried a side focus).
 
But with either scope, once the bell is adjusted to the correct yardage the target just "pops" into view - ymmv.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 13:07
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I haven't seen either a Sightron or Vortex but from what I have read, would take the Sightron III and would prefer the 8x32 but not the 56MM part. There is only about $50 difference. Actually I'd prefer a 40MM but can't have everything.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 08:57
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Have to agree, vortex pst glass is inferior to sightron and is a big disappointment because i know the factory that made it can make better scopes/glass  without the haze or cloud effect.  I fault the philippine kenko plant for using similar tech as the monarch line, my guess is it has something to do with the eyebox and how light bounces or reflects on the front objective bell innards despite having a matte or non reflective finish. In very low light situations, given certain light conditions, and when your eyes is at the right alignment, the cloudiness seems to be minimal and even absent at times. Maybe vortex should be blamed too for approving the pst design. I have a prototype of the updated vortex having the slightly different decals at sf and a plastic zoom ring instead of the rubber, sadly though the cloudiness is still there although it seems to be less but i might be just biased or i just want it to be better. I'm hoping that the new prototype though of a phil made 35mm 5-20x50 or 56 tactical vortex pushes thru. The rumor here is that it's meant to replace the razor hd line, or maybe it's just a cheaper alternative. As i've mentioned in another post, it's glass though is top notch and at least for my eyes is on par with top dollar scopes i've seen, even when on max power. The others too who have seen it said it is the best scope out of the kenko plant to date, for me though being more of a hunter, i fancy and think the better scope is the eliminator 3 although optics or image wise and most likely durability, it can't compare the tactical 35mm vortex. Smile
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 12:19
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The PST is a budget tactical rifle scope.  It has the optical quality it does because it would cost more to put better glass in it.  It would cost more to make the optical design more efficient.  I am sure they could make it better, but then it would cost us consumers more, as it would cost more to make. 

They put many bells and whistles on that scope, so other parts of it they had to go lesser quality.

I am sure Vortex had a budget they needed to keep.  They were shooting to capture a certain market and I think they hit it pretty well.  If you want better optical quality/overall quality, then all you gotta do is buy a better scope.  SWFA SS or Razor comes to mind. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 12:22
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Oh yeah, IOR glass smokes Viper glass.  I have never seen an S3, but my big sky has pretty nice glass as well.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 15:08
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I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that SII Big Sky glass is the same as S3 glass.  The difference in model nomenclature is based solely on the SII BS being marketed as a hunting scope and the SIII as a tactical scope.  Can someone confirm?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 15:34
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Originally posted by DCAMM94 DCAMM94 wrote:

I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that SII Big Sky glass is the same as S3 glass.  The difference in model nomenclature is based solely on the SII BS being marketed as a hunting scope and the SIII as a tactical scope.  Can someone confirm?

S3 has a more sophisticated optical system than the S2 Big Sky and outperforms it optically, although both are very good in their respective market segments.

Iya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 16:15
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Thanks for clearing that up Ilya.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2012 at 18:40
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The PST is a budget tactical rifle scope.  It has the optical quality it does because it would cost more to put better glass in it.  It would cost more to make the optical design more efficient.  I am sure they could make it better, but then it would cost us consumers more, as it would cost more to make.  

They put many bells and whistles on that scope, so other parts of it they had to go lesser quality.

I am sure Vortex had a budget they needed to keep.  They were shooting to capture a certain market and I think they hit it pretty well.  If you want better optical quality/overall quality, then all you gotta do is buy a better scope.  SWFA SS or Razor comes to mind.  
Yes, that is what my thought was about the budget,  the glass i believe is not the problem, it's most probably the design. The thing is the company has made and is making scopes which are way cheaper but would provide a better image, my very old kenko made simmons 44mag although not as bright provides a way better image which is clear and crisp at 20x. Same with the nikon monarch line, the image at max power is inferior to their older design scopes and other scopes made by the company at the same price level or cheaper. Anyway i am just nitpicking because despite it's single flaw on the haziness, the scopes i currently use are a nikon monarch for my centerfire and the vortex pst for my rimfire and right now here among the long range rimfire shooters, the vortex pst is the most popular and most used.   Smile 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2012 at 06:53
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Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

the sightron has real good glass, the 24X range should be plenty
 
 
The Sightrons get a good following from the varmint hunting forums which led me to get a Sightron II 4-16x44mm for my .243 and a Sightron II Big Sky 6-24x44mm on my .204. They both have the AO on the bell and it's amazing to see the picture pop into view once the correct yardage is acheived.  I have the standard plex on the 4-16 and the dot on 6-24.
 
If the varmint hunters like them, that's good enough for me . . .
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