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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/24/2011 at 22:57
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i'm thinking about getting a zeiss conquest 4.5-14x50 w/ target turrets for my 7mm for long range hunting.  anyone have any other suggestions in this price and quality range i should look at?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/24/2011 at 23:08
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I really like all Zeiss's products.  That is an excellent choice.  What reticle are you getting?  I would probably go for the Rapid Z 1000.  
You certainly won't find any better for the same price...
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i was thinking about the zplex since i'm planning on using a rangefinder and adjusting my elevation w/ the turret. i looked through a rapid 1000 and just thought it was a little cluttered. a plex just seems simpler since i'm not planning on using the hold over marks. i thought about the mil-dot but the plex is $100 cheaper.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 00:09
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 I have a 7mm RUM and plan on using it to hunt elk next year in Montana.  Take a look at the
 Leupold VX-3 4.5-14X40 LR 30mm tube.  You can have turrents made from the Leupold custom shop to match your rifle and ammo specs.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 00:58
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this model claims 68'' elevation.  my max range i want to be able to reach is 1000 yards not saying i'm going to shoot a deer at that range but at targets just to see what i can do.  my ballistics program says w/ a 200 yrd zero my drop is 317'' at 1000. i think it should reach it if their elevation claims are right and i don't use up much elvation in zeroing.  would i be better off going w/ something w/ more adjustment or will this work.  any opinions? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 07:28
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I have that very scope with Z-Plex on a target 223 and love it.  Dialing in for correction is easily done and the Z-Plex is great.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 07:50
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Z-plex is definitely a less "cluttered" reticle.  I don't find the Zeiss ballistic drop reticles particularly cluttered, but that is a matter of choice.  Z-plex and that type has worked for a very large number of people for a very long time...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 09:43
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I don't think you will be sorry with that Zeiss.... I've never yet talked to an unhappy Zeiss owner.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 09:52
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Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

long range hunting 
 
There is no such thing as long range hunting. Here we go again. Another elk sniper wannabe?


Edited by anweis - February/25/2011 at 09:53
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 10:02
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really, according to them boys on best of the west and long range pursuit their isBucky
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 11:44
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I had a friend in Kalifornia who saved up and went on the "elk hunt of a lifetime".  On the last day of the hunt, in the waning hours of light, he and his two guides saw a reasonably sized bull.  It was across a canyon and had already seen them and while not running was walking rapidly away.  My friend had a BAR with BOSS in .300 WinMag shooting 200 grain soft points.   There was a light wind blowing in the same direction the bull was headed.  The guides told my friend to SHOOOT, SHOOOOT... lead him six and a half feet and shoot three feet high.  The elk dropped on the fifth shot, the guide was getting ready to shoot it with his rifle so my friend did not go home empty handed.  They measured the spot where blood hit the ground first at 521 yards.  My friend was congratulated for his "good shot"...  He actually hit the bull 3 times, last time went right through heart and lungs.  Should he have NOT taken the shot? should he have gone home empty handed or with a animal that someone else shot?  
Hunt of a lifetime, fairly long range for a guy who never really shot over 300 yards (but he did shoot quite a bit), "running"/fast moving elk... 
So where does "hunting range" end and "long range" begin?  If a guy spends a lot of time shooting at "long range", is comfortable in his ability to make a shot, has a rifle that is capable of taking the game "at range", what is the harm?  Every hunter I know will take his shot as "early" as he feels within his skill and weapon capability, especially if he paid a lot for a hunt.  
I am a firm believer in getting as close as possible.  If I could take every shot at 25 yards, I would.  Little doubt about one at that range...  However, that is just not practical.  Just because one person does not think himself adequate to shoot a game animal at a certain range, does not mean he should apply that philosophy to all other hunters.  I also agree that setting out to shoot an elk or some other game animal at 1000 yards does not seem very sporting to me.  However, given my friend's situation, given the rifle with the capability and given you have some reasonable amount of skill... what will you do?  We've seen the videos, we all know that 338 is pretty darned deadly on elk and deer at 1000 yards plus.  The guys doing it, have practiced it, know what to expect.  I have no problem with a guy getting a 1500 yard "rig" who then prepares himself to make a long shot... IF NECESSARY.  Just because he has the rig, doesn't mean he is setting out to try to make such a shot.  One of the biggest failures in hunting is lack of preparation. You certainly CANNOT make a long range shot if you are not prepared in equipment, skill and mental attitude.  
There is nothing I like better than "sneaking up" on game.  However, it is getting more and more difficult to find a place to be able to do that.  At one time I could range miles and miles and never worry about seeing another soul.  Now, there are fences, posted signs, "hunting properties" where you have to pay out the nose to go hunt and then get your hand held everywhere you go, no hunting areas, etc, etc.  Stalk hunting is becoming a thing of the past and "stand hunting" is becoming the new method.  I would challenge that there is no less "huntsman's-ship" to "long range hunting" than there is to sitting in a tree stand waiting on deer to come to your feeder ("but... my feeder is 100 yards away"... "Oh").  I've only in the last few years done much "stand hunting".  No doubt it is easier, not sure it is as satisfying.  I haven't hunted, really, at all the last two years.  
Just things to think about.  Yes, there is a lot of room for error in shooting game at long range (and long range means different things to different people).  However, stand hunting has opened up a whole new population of idiots in the woods.  They couldn't handle stalk hunting, but tree stands, tower stands, and "Taj Mahals" have given people who set up ten automatic corn feeders and Super Glue their scope to their rifle a whole new opportunity.  So, somebody explain to me... WHAT is the difference between hunting over a food plot and hunting over corn???  When you honestly analyze it, are they not both bait?  What is the difference, except one is still growing and the other is in a bag?  Some people do not plant food plots until very late August or early September.  Deer season starts in Oct (bow) here.  Food plots are planted with the sole intention of attracting deer while the "hunter" is sitting in a stand at the edge of the plot.  What does it hurt if he uses a corn feeder???   
Now, all that said, don't think I am knocking everyone who uses a deer stand or feeds corn (those who have never hunted, but only baited, I have a problem with).  I'm just providing things to think about when some are lambasting people who practice and become skillful at long range hunting. As long as man is at the trigger to complicate things, long range shooting will never be "easy", will never be something the dabblers should dabble in.  But if a person does all the "work" to become proficient at long range shooting and/or hunting, I won't begrudge him his use of his skills.  Just like you can't keep the idiots out of the woods, you can't keep those who shouldn't be allowed to even own a bullet from "long range hunting".  Those who "put in the time", have my respect, even if I don't really agree with them.  Now, the guy that spent time and effort getting ready for his "dream hunt", ends up having to take an extremely long shot... I have more sympathy for that.  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 12:21
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i didn't mean to start a long range hunting argument. in my earlier post the only thing i said i was planning on shooting at 1000 yrds was paper.  i was just asking that w/ the info i gave if i could expect to reach that distance.   btw i'm not planning on shooting elk or being a sniper.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 12:31
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  Don't concern yourself,j.  We may excitedly discuss things here but we don't argue.  Bucky
 
  Also never say never.  You never know where your future interests may take you.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 14:02
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Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

i'm thinking about getting a zeiss conquest 4.5-14x50 w/ target turrets for my 7mm for long range hunting.  anyone have any other suggestions in this price and quality range i should look at?


Pretty hard to beat a Conquest in that price range....

but what about:

SPL12616Swarovski 4-12x50 Z3 Rifle Scope DEMO-A
Click to view59021, Matte, Plex, 1"
$899.95

or

SPL13357Swarovski 3-10x42 American Rifle Scope DEMO-B
Click to view52030, Matte, Plex, 1"
$699.95


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 14:13
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If you are spinning turrets, the Zeiss is a great choice.  If you are looking at a ballistic reticle, the Swarovski z3 with BRH (not BRX) is also a great choice.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 14:44
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oops... forgot about target turrets.... sorry
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 15:05
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Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

i didn't mean to start a long range hunting argument. in my earlier post the only thing i said i was planning on shooting at 1000 yrds was paper.  i was just asking that w/ the info i gave if i could expect to reach that distance.   btw i'm not planning on shooting elk or being a sniper.

What, no elk???? I'm on your side...

Again, I think the Conquest is hard to beat.  Not crazy about the Zplex as a long range reticle, but it will certainly do the job.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 21:31
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if i'm not going to use the holdover marks on the z 1000 reticle what other advantages does it have over the zplex? just want to get all the knowledge i can before i purchase and then  say #@%$ i should have got the z 1000.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 21:40
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Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

if i'm not going to use the holdover marks on the z 1000 reticle what other advantages does it have over the zplex? just want to get all the knowledge i can before i purchase and then  say #@%$ i should have got the z 1000.



It is just for holdover.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 23:53
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Originally posted by Bitterroot Bulls Bitterroot Bulls wrote:

Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

if i'm not going to use the holdover marks on the z 1000 reticle what other advantages does it have over the zplex? just want to get all the knowledge i can before i purchase and then  say #@%$ i should have got the z 1000.



It is just for holdover.

Absolutely... if you are NOT going to use the BDC, there is no reason to get a Z-1000... or any other BDC reticle.  As I said, the Zplex is not my favorite reticle for variable range shooting, but it is "adequate". 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2011 at 00:03
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Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

if i'm not going to use the holdover marks on the z 1000 reticle what other advantages does it have over the zplex? just want to get all the knowledge i can before i purchase and then  say #@%$ i should have got the z 1000.



In that case I'd recommend getting the Mildot (#43) so you can learn to accurately hold off for wind.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2011 at 00:05
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Originally posted by Jon A Jon A wrote:

Originally posted by jsim jsim wrote:

if i'm not going to use the holdover marks on the z 1000 reticle what other advantages does it have over the zplex? just want to get all the knowledge i can before i purchase and then  say #@%$ i should have got the z 1000.



In that case I'd recommend getting the Mildot (#43) so you can learn to accurately hold off for wind.

That is a good recommendation...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2011 at 07:23
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+2 ON #43 

Edited by stickbow46 - February/26/2011 at 07:26
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2011 at 08:33
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If this scope is intended primarily for LR, definitely get the #43 with target turret.  Dial your drop solutions, dope wind with the horizontal mil dots.  Plex won't allow you to be as precise on wind compensation as a reticle with reference marks.

As nice as Conquests are, I don't think they are a great choice for a LR "dial for drops" scope.  Holdovers with Rapid Z 1000 are a different story.  I'd really want more internal elevation adjustment for 1K than they offer.  The target knobs aren't the best for serious knob-turning LR shooting, in addition to the fact it would be better if the knobs were in mils instead of MOA to match the reticle.  You can use a 20 MOA base to compensate for the somewhat limited elevation travel.

Unfortunately, you don't have many good choices without making a significant jump in price.  Still, within the same price range, I think this would be a better scope for the task if LR is your focus:
http://swfa.com/Vortex-4-16x50-Viper-PST-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P44561.aspx
Glass may not be quite as good, but it has more adj range, better knobs, and knobs & reticle are mil/mil. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2011 at 11:32
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I had the 4-14x44 Conquest on a 300WM, great scope.  I sold the setup and have regretted it ever since.  It is a great optic and will do what you want.

The Swaros have better glass (in my opinion) but lack the target turrets.

If you plan to dope shots, get the Conquest.
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