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Scope rating scale

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 12:22
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We keep on having various discussions about scope rating scales.  T-bone had the original version.  Chris has put a lot of time and effort into making his own scale.

I generally agree with Chris' version, although there are always points of contention.  The biggest arguments stem from the fact that we all look for different things.

I think I will try to come up with a more complicated version of the scale that will assign several ratings to each scope in different categories.

Here are the categories I am thinking of:

  • Optical quality (resolution, color accuracy, contrast, stray light suppression, etc.)
  • Mechanical quality (W/E adjustments, toughness, etc)
  • Usability (eye relief, field of view, mounting ease, reticle selection, etc)
  • Customer Support
Any other categories you can suggest?

To ward off the arguments before they start: I am looking for input on the categories, not scopes. 

This table will only contain the scopes I am reasonably well familiar with, and will only be a reflection of my opinion.  I would like to avoid the bickering that Chris has to go through when everyone complaints about his scale being wrong.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 13:24
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I like this idea, although I'm wondering how much bickering you'llm have to listen to.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 13:45
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Koshkin -

 

I think this is a good idea/concept also, and I have one recommendation.  Often times, all of the above characteristics are lumped together adn evaluated when making a decision on the scope's VALUE.  Perhaps you could sum up as to the best value under $300, $500, $1000, etc.   Clearly value is subjective, but also is the importance of resolution vs. contrast, as an example.

 

Just a thought...good luck with this!

 

ND2000

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 14:16
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some type of weighted average would work better, or---- use a neural net fuzzy logic routine and assignment a membership function to each catagory with some type of scaling with a one to one mapping from product to property, this would remove the "hard" set classification between catagories (when does a river become long) problem inherent in these types of comparison and give it more of a Venn diagram, union or intersection set function. Thus hard set values such as glass would be soften or moderated as by ND2000 suggestion of value.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 16:56
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What would be helpful is that next to each scope we could put a MSRP and a street value, so that members could pick the best scope for their budget.

I think we also need to differentiate the lines of scope rather than lump them into one category.  What comes to mind are brands like Sightron, Nikon, Pentax, Bushnell.  I know that some are already there, but others like Sightron or Nightforce are all one rating.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 17:56
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Thanks for the comments.

While I can note the street prices (I do not think MSRP has much informational value), I was hoping to not address value proposition.  It is a deeply personal thing that depends on what is important to you and how much money you have.  I will certainly talk about what I consider a good deal for my needs, same as I will only address the scopes I have familiarity with and rank them in accordance with my preferences.  I have no wish to try to come up with a universal value scale.  That would be an exercise in futility.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 18:50
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

I would like to avoid the bickering that Chris has to go through when everyone complaints about his scale being wrong.

ILya

 

As my aussie friends say, "Good on ya, mate" 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 18:53
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Chris, is there a way to post a table (other than as a picture)?

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 20:11
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ILya,

 

I think you have it pretty well covered.  I can't wait to see the results.  It will be most interesting.

 

Have you enough information to do the same sort of list, with appropriate criteria, for binoculars?

 

I appreciate the information you share with us.

 

Steve

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 20:36
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Originally posted by ND2000 ND2000 wrote:

Koshkin -

 

I think this is a good idea/concept also, and I have one recommendation.  Often times, all of the above characteristics are lumped together adn evaluated when making a decision on the scope's VALUE.  Perhaps you could sum up as to the best value under $300, $500, $1000, etc.   Clearly value is subjective, but also is the importance of resolution vs. contrast, as an example.

 

Just a thought...good luck with this!

 

ND2000

 

value good call i agree but as you say its subjective.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 20:48
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I have played with quite a few binoculars, so I can put together something, but the topic has been covered fairly well by birders.  Besides, I tend to prefer lower magnification binoculars, while most other people tend to gravitate toward higher magnifications.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 20:53
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let me clairify something here, when i say value i guess what i want to know in your opinion is the glass worth the price, or is it a great deal or is it a rip off.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 22:22
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I think once we see the scale with the notation of a street price, we'll be able to make that call for ourselves.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 22:28
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I will probably note street price on a few scopes of configurations that are of interest to me.  If I try to catalogue the price of every model in every line, I'll be at it until I turn old and grey.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 22:32
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Perhaps some of us could help with that.  I was just thinking about how much the ATN scope go for and then hearing others experiences with them.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/29/2007 at 22:40
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ATN scopes' value proposition is very simple to describe: whatever they go for is way to much.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/30/2007 at 03:23
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Tagged for responses.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/30/2007 at 03:42
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

ATN scopes' value proposition is very simple to describe: whatever they go for is way to much.

ILya

I love waking up to a belly laugh!

Thanks ILya

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/30/2007 at 08:40
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i've looked thru an ATN at a gun show, not at all impressed, and then the price, yikes what are they thinking ?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/30/2007 at 10:29
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I look forward to seeing your conclusions, ILya!  I think what you've outlined so far is a pretty formidable task as-is, especially evaluating mechanical quality/durability, since unless you had an obvious tracking problem, you'd almost have to try to make a scope fail to really determine this.  So, I'd stick to the criteria you already have if I were you.  As you said, "value" is such a subjective measure that will vary widely depending on individual preferences. 

Edited by RifleDude
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