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Scope Ranking Chart

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/22/2008 at 15:34
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I ran across a scope ranking chart, for lack of a better word, on this forum, but cannot find it now.  Does anyone have a link?  thanks for the help.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/22/2008 at 16:03
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Not sure if this is what your looking for. Got this from a post by Roy Finn.
 
 

2007 Riflescope Rating Scale

 

10 - Swarovski Z6, Zeiss Victory

9 - Kahles C - CL & CSX, Schmidt & Bender

8 - Kahles KX, U.S. Optics, Swarovski PH & American, X.O.T.I.C.,  Zeiss Classic

7 - Leupold VX-7, Nightforce, IOR Valdada

6 - Bushnell Elite 4200, Nikon Monarch, Zeiss Conquest

5 - Leupold Mark 4 VX III & VX-L

4 - Burris Black Diamond Signature Select XTR & Euro Diamond, Meopta, Pentax Lightseeker, Sighton, Super Sniper, Trijicon, Weaver Grand Slam

3 - Bushnell Elite 3200, Leupold VX-II

2 -  Burris Fullfield II, Leupold Rifleman & VX-I, Millet, Mueller, Nikon Buckmaster, Simmons

1 - ATN, Barska, Leatherwood, Swift, Tasco

0 - BSA, Leapers, NcStar


 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/22/2008 at 16:21
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/22/2008 at 18:18
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The ranking is based on the following criteria....

1.  Optical Quality - How bright and clear the scope is.

2.  Specifications - Field of view, eye relief, weight, adjustment travel, etc.

3.  Durability - How do they with stand the test of time.

4.  Special Features & Options - Proprietary items (reticles, design, turrets), Zoom ratio.

5.  Warranty & Customer Service - How good are they.

6.  Value - Bang for your buck.




Edited by mike650 - July/22/2008 at 18:21
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2008 at 08:17
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2008 at 09:22
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Many of the scopes listed I haven't personally looked through.   The only glaring mistake I see is putting a Burris FF II in the same class as a Rifleman.  My FF II's are at least as bright and clear as the VX II.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2008 at 09:35
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Those damned lists have caused untold horrors as anyone and everyone disagees with something and takes it as a personal assault.

The rankings are subjective!  But they can be helpful in someone's choosing a scope that might not know as much about optics as some others.  It is a rough layout and not meant to slight someone's personal gear or experience.

And Nightforce is much better than VX-7 and IOR, and there is no way USO is inferior to Kahles or S&B!  (See how that works?)
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2008 at 09:42
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Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:



And Nightforce is much better than VX-7 and IOR,


Huh, that's debatable.  Wink Big%20Smile
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2008 at 14:17
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Many of the scopes listed I haven't personally looked through.   The only glaring mistake I see is putting a Burris FF II in the same class as a Rifleman.  My FF II's are at least as bright and clear as the VX II.



JG, please read the criteria listed on post # 4 of this thread. The list is based on more than how bright and clear a scope is.

I agree with what Rancid is saying on post # 7.


Edited by mike650 - July/23/2008 at 14:21
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/28/2008 at 14:01
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:



And Nightforce is much better than VX-7 and IOR,


Huh, that's debatable.  Wink Big%20Smile


I thought my statements were above debate and contesting.  It is true because I said it; however, I only said it because it is true.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/29/2008 at 16:32
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That rating is so skewed it makes me laugh out loud. It is simply one persons opinion. I have been trying to find a scientific rating that was running around on the net a year or so ago. Each scope was individually rated on half a dozen different catagories and then averaged. If anyone has seen this or knows where to find it please post.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/29/2008 at 16:45
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It's a group of people who sell and look through scopes every day that created the chart.  So an opinion?  Yes.  One persons opinion? No.  A good guide for those wanting help on where to start, absolutely.

Obviously you know more about them all so go ahead and fill us in.  Have you had the chance to use all those scopes on hunts and in the field?  I dare bet Chris has used a ton of them as well as his employees to create that rating chart.  So unless you have a bunch more info to add I would suggest not making such a fuss and just use as it is meant to be used, which is a guide.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/29/2008 at 16:46
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/29/2008 at 17:51
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Originally posted by rockblaster rockblaster wrote:

That rating is so skewed it makes me laugh out loud. It is simply one persons opinion. I have been trying to find a scientific rating that was running around on the net a year or so ago. Each scope was individually rated on half a dozen different catagories and then averaged. If anyone has seen this or knows where to find it please post.
 
Hi, rockblaster.  Since the scale is so skewed that it causes you to burst into laughter, you obviously have some insight that SWFA, who uses and sells all of these scopes, does not.  Therefore, please post your scale, using the same stated criteria that this one was compiled from, to include only those scopes you have personal, first hand experience with.  Your scientifically derived scale will be extremely valuable to prospective scope buyers and the forum in general!  I look forward to seeing it!Yippee
 
Most of us have at least some disagreements with certain scope rankings on this scale because we all have different opinions and all value different characteristics of different scopes.  Therefore, no matter what ranking system anyone devises, there will always be some disagreement with the results.  SWFA should be commended for even creating the scale in the first place, and I believe a good faith effort went into making the scale as reasonably accurate as possible.
 
It sounds like the scope rating test you're referring to is the Swedish test done a couple years ago that has been posted on this forum before.  If so, that test didn't use some of the same criteria (i.e. value, customer service/warranty, unique product features, etc.) this scale was based on.  In addition, the Swedish test wasn't completely scientific either, and involved several subjective judgements such as the method used to arrive at the low light performance ranking.  Even if an attempt was made to do a completely scientific test on scope performance, there will still be those who will question the testing criteria, and some ranking criteria such as value:$ and customer service will always be subjective.


Edited by RifleDude - July/29/2008 at 17:55
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/30/2008 at 20:00
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well i compared my PH 2.5-10x42 to a my VX-7 2.5-10x45 and cant understand why they arent rated the same...guess my eyes are wrong
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/30/2008 at 20:54
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+1 to RD and Supertool, it's just a guide for general benchmarking. I know of no other scales like it. It works for me.
Your observations are interesting and good to hear, SAKO75. Have you done any low light comparisons by any chance? I've only looked through them in the store next to a Zeiss Classic and Kahles C. It seemed pretty comparable in that environment.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/30/2008 at 22:04
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Many of the scopes listed I haven't personally looked through.   The only glaring mistake I see is putting a Burris FF II in the same class as a Rifleman.  My FF II's are at least as bright and clear as the VX II.

 
How old is you FFII, is it pre Beretta acquisition (Philippines)?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 05:04
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Yes i did a full test at morning, dusk, night, day, looking for detail, sharpness to the edge, relections/flare issues etc...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 08:52
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IMHO-This reference chart was put together by a group of people who took the time and effort to try and provide some information to us to use. THIS IS NOT THE GOLDEN RULE ON SCOPES. IN all due respect what makes you the EXPERT? Maybe we would LAUGH at your list. IN ALL FAIRNESS this was put together as information ONLY. I have purchased scopes in the price range of 100.00 to 1500.00, many GOOD, QUALITY SCOPES are available in different price ranges and reference charts like this can provide you with information that can help you make a decision on your next purchase. The last time this was started it got ugly and people even got BANNED from this forum over OPINIONS on this chart. ITS just information and that is how it should be used. WHY attack it?  QUESTION ROCKBLASTER...Maybe you could explain to me Bak7 Schott glass I am considering a scope that has this in it and would like to know more about it....

Edited by medic52 - July/31/2008 at 08:55
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 10:04
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Originally posted by Chris Farris Chris Farris wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Many of the scopes listed I haven't personally looked through.   The only glaring mistake I see is putting a Burris FF II in the same class as a Rifleman.  My FF II's are at least as bright and clear as the VX II.

 
How old is you FFII, is it pre Beretta acquisition (Philippines)?
 
Yes it is. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 13:39
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Originally posted by Chris Farris Chris Farris wrote:

Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Many of the scopes listed I haven't personally looked through.   The only glaring mistake I see is putting a Burris FF II in the same class as a Rifleman.  My FF II's are at least as bright and clear as the VX II.

 
How old is you FFII, is it pre Beretta acquisition (Philippines)?
 
Yes it is. 
 
Yes it is pre-Beretta or yes it is made in the Philippines?  I am sorry, I re-read my question and it is kinda confusing.  What I meant to ask is;
 
Is your FFII an older one that was purchased before Beretta purchased Burris and started making the FFII in the Philipines?  This happened about 2 years ago but it took a while for some of the modles to make the transition.
 
If yours is an older one then I would agree with you.
 
The scale is based on current production products and the current production Burris Fullfield II is not the same as its predecor.  And see, if it was not for this scale you would have never learned that and you might have possibly purchased another FFII with the expectation of it being the same as the one you already own.
 
Koshkin pointed out that some models really fall in between the numbers, so I was thinking about adding half numbers but another comment from Koshkin made me think that we can accomplish two things by just removing the numbers.
 
Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

The scale is relative, not absolute.  It does not really matter whether a scope is ranked as a 6 or a seven.  All that matters is which scopes are ranked higher and which are ranked lower.

ILya
 
I want to get this done asap, so if any one has a VALID disagreement with the placement of any brand or model, let's discuss it now.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 15:43
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Perhaps it is worth saying that numerals are used in three fundamentally different ways:

1. As a NAME. They are called nominal numerals. Numbers on the jersey of an athlete, for example.
2. To represent a POSITION in a SERIES. They are called ordinal numerals. The numbers on these scope rankings, or how horses finish in a race, are examples.
3. To represent QUANTITY.

All should recognize that Koshkin is correct. The scale is not an interval or ratio scale. It isn't absolute. Number 7 is not necessarily 7/6 = 1.167 better than 6. It might be 3 times better, or it might only be 5% better.

One can use an individual performance characteristic of a particular scope to make his/her case for this or that. The results of several functional tests and the experiences of well-informed members are clearly in general agreement with your rankings.

I believe that your rankings are reassuring to those who think they are well-informed, and a blessing to the remainder of us. Thank you for helping us to make informed decisions.

I doubt that removing the ordinal numerals from your list will change anything.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 15:43
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Chris, thanks for the info.  It is a Phillipino made scope.  Could you please answer a question I've asked on another thread.  Which scope  would you choose, a VX III 3.5-10x40 or an elite 4200 2.5-10x40 for a 30-06?  Thanks again.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 15:57
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Originally posted by JGRaider JGRaider wrote:

Chris, thanks for the info.  It is a Phillipino made scope.  Could you please answer a question I've asked on another thread.  Which scope  would you choose, a VX III 3.5-10x40 or an elite 4200 2.5-10x40 for a 30-06?  Thanks again.
 
4200 with out a doubt.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2008 at 15:59
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And on that same note, why not save yourself $120 and buy the 4200 3-9x40.  It has the same glass exact same quality build it is just a 3x erector instead of the 4x erector.  
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