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Scope for AR in 6.5 Grendel

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 01:09
huff143 View Drop Down
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My brother asked for help and I said let me consult with my OT friends first.
So, he got my eight-year-old nephew a sweet li'l AR in 6.5mm Grendel because recoil is pretty much non-existent.  He'll be using it this fall to hunt deer from a nice blind with good 360 degree rests.  The max range will be around 150 yards.
Needs:  simple (non-busy) reticle, forgiving eye relief, good field of view so he can find his target fast, not too top heavy and anything else common sense dictates a kid would need.

He'd like to keep the price in the sub-$400 range.
ALSO, thoughts on proper mounts would be nice because the ones he has suck... a lot.

Thanks much for your help!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 01:55
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I've been using Leatherwood 14CMR on my 6.5 Grendel.  For your stated requirements it is an excellent scope.  Nice reticle, good adjustments, nice glass.  It is my AR 5.56 scope, as well.  I am going to move to a SS1-6 on the Grendel, my requirements are different than yours.  If I were staying at 400-600 yards, I would stay with the Leatherwood or a SS1-4.  The SS is a bit more expensive. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 10:34
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Hi, Huff --
Given your criteria -- relatively short range deer hunting, <$400 price tag, and simple reticle design, you have a choice of several good 2-7X, 3-9X, 2.5-10X etc magnification class hunting scopes with standard plex reticles.

Right off the top of my head, I recommend one of the following, all of which are within your budget:

Leupold VX-3 1.75-6X32
Vortex Viper 3-9X40
Vortex Viper 3.5-10X50
Nikon Monarch 3 2.5-10X42
Bushnell Elite 2-7X32
Bushnell Elite 3-9X40

All of the above will have similar image quality, though I personally think the Leupold VX-3 1.75-6X32 is perhaps a touch better than the others optically, with the rest essentially equal. The Bushnell Elite scopes come with "Rainguard" hydrophobic (sheds water, to help keep your view clear in wet weather) lens coatings, which I find to be a very useful feature on a hunting scope.

Personally, I'm a fan of the little Leupold 1.75-6X32 due to its combination of good optics in a very light, compact form factor, but the others are very good scopes for the money.

On the question of mounts, did you have extra money budgeted for them, or were you trying to keep both scope and mounts under $400? If the latter, that poses a bit of a problem. Assuming the AR in question is a flat-top with integral 1913 rail, you have many different mounts to choose from, but some mounts designed for ARs can get pretty expensive. About the least expensive rings for 1913 rail I can recommend would be the Warne Maxima series ring mounts for about $35. But if you want a quick-detach unit with both rings integral in the same mount, the price of the mounts can easily be half the cost of the scope or more. Let us know how much you're willing to spend on mounts and whether you want permanent, quick-detach, 1-pc integral, or 2-pc mounts and we can make recommendations from there.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 10:43
Kickboxer View Drop Down
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Discount all the writing and you'll see that the CMR reticle (circle-dot) is pretty clean and allows bfor growth.  I've also had this scope on my .375 H&H magnum with no ill effects.  Reticle comes in red or green... I like red because it causes no detriment to low light vision.  The reticle allows for quick acquisition and can be zeroed for a "battlesight zero" very easily.  Makes for VERY quick point and shoot...

Burris Extreme Tactical rings would be a very respectable choice at a reasonable price.



Edited by Kickboxer - March/25/2014 at 10:50
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 12:32
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That little 1.75-6VX3 is a great little scope. I had one with the heavy duplex which was a great hunting reticle. That's one that I wish I would have kept...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 12:35
koshkin View Drop Down
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I would go with something like this:



Another good alternative is this:

The 1.5-6x40 has a little less top end magnification, but larger objective for better low light performance.

Ultimately, you have to converge on a reticle choice.  What constitutes a simple reticle is different to different people.  The 2-8x32 scopes I mentioned above havea  nice and simple plex reticle.

The CMR scope that Kickboxer suggested is a nice scope (I have one), but that is probably not something I would give to a young shooter.  Besides, the numbered holdover marks are not a great match for the Grendel.

The reticle in the Burris MTAC is somewhere between the two in complexity, but I think it is simple enough for quick use with just enough holdover capability for the kid to have fun practicing with his rifle.

As far as the mounts go, I would consider this one: 

It is inexpensive and pretty sturdy.  The inserts allow you to use it with both 1" and 30mm tube scopes.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 12:50
Kickboxer View Drop Down
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That is a pretty clean, quick acquisition reticle.  Doesn't necessarily have to be CQB, though that is what it was designed for.  I don't see much difference between using a target dot or this. The 7.62 version seems to fit pretty close for me for the Grendel.  Not a lot of rounds with the combo yet, but so far with 123gr it is not bad. 

There are a lot of good scopes.  I just happen to like this one because it is relatively inexpensive, performs well, has some "nifty" features.  Probably any of those mention would work.  For me, this one works better.  I'm not even recommending it, just telling you what works for me. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 13:04
koshkin View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

That is a pretty clean, quick acquisition reticle.  Doesn't necessarily have to be CQB, though that is what it was designed for.  I don't see much difference between using a target dot or this. The 7.62 version seems to fit pretty close for me for the Grendel.  Not a lot of rounds with the combo yet, but so far with 123gr it is not bad. 

There are a lot of good scopes.  I just happen to like this one because it is relatively inexpensive, performs well, has some "nifty" features.  Probably any of those mention would work.  For me, this one works better.  I'm not even recommending it, just telling you what works for me. 


I have a CMR4 with a 7.62 reticle and it works pretty well for 123gr 300Blackout and 7.62x39.

The 5.56 reticle is actually closer to the 6.5 Grendel.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 13:20
RifleDude View Drop Down
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Originally posted by biggreen747 biggreen747 wrote:

That little 1.75-6VX3 is a great little scope. I had one with the heavy duplex which was a great hunting reticle. That's one that I wish I would have kept...


I've had multiple copies of the old, shorter tubed Vari-X III version and have always had a soft spot in my heart for that scope on a hunting rifle due to its "hardly there" form factor. Though the old scope was pretty good already, the new VX-3 version is better optically and is threaded for their cool Alumina lens caps.

I forgot about the Nikon 2-8X32 Monarch and Vortex 2-8X32 Diamondback Koshkin recommended. Those are nice little scopes as well, though I thought the 2-8X32 Monarch was discontinued. Perhaps not.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 23:30
huff143 View Drop Down
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Thanks for the help, those are solid choices and I agree with leaning toward the Leupy out of those. The smaller size will be a bonus.
As for rings, he won't need quick detach at all. I've not owned an AR so I don't know whether to go with one or two-piece mounts; your thoughts on that?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 23:37
huff143 View Drop Down
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Kickboxer, is that the reticle from the Leatherwood?  I'll show this picture to my brother and nephew and see what they think.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/25/2014 at 23:41
huff143 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

I would go with something like this:



Another good alternative is this:

The 1.5-6x40 has a little less top end magnification, but larger objective for better low light performance.

Ultimately, you have to converge on a reticle choice.  What constitutes a simple reticle is different to different people.  The 2-8x32 scopes I mentioned above havea  nice and simple plex reticle.

The CMR scope that Kickboxer suggested is a nice scope (I have one), but that is probably not something I would give to a young shooter.  Besides, the numbered holdover marks are not a great match for the Grendel.

The reticle in the Burris MTAC is somewhere between the two in complexity, but I think it is simple enough for quick use with just enough holdover capability for the kid to have fun practicing with his rifle.

As far as the mounts go, I would consider this one: 

It is inexpensive and pretty sturdy.  The inserts allow you to use it with both 1" and 30mm tube scopes.

ILya

ILya, which of these, in your opinion, has the best glass and most durable?  And, thank you for your help!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 01:09
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Originally posted by huff143 huff143 wrote:

Kickboxer, is that the reticle from the Leatherwood?  I'll show this picture to my brother and nephew and see what they think.

It is the Leatherwood reticle. 

To be fair... I got some "translation" data for ballistics for the Grendel for both the 5.56 reticle and the 7.62.  It has been pretty close for me. 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 08:53
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Its hard for me not to recommend the 3-9x40 Conquest when dealing with a kid and a deer hunting rifle... but I'm not sure how it would work on an AR.
 
No-one else has recommended it either.   are you thinking its too heavy?  too big? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 09:23
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Originally posted by Tip69 Tip69 wrote:

Its hard for me not to recommend the 3-9x40 Conquest when dealing with a kid and a deer hunting rifle... but I'm not sure how it would work on an AR.
 
No-one else has recommended it either.   are you thinking its too heavy?  too big? 


+1 And especially since they have one on the sample list for $350. To me that would be a scope you could keep for a life time.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 13:52
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I had that exact same thought about the Conquest. I'm adding it to the list to present to my bro. Thanks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 13:56
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Anyone else have thoughts on the Conquest with my nephew's needs in mind? Would it allow for quick target acquisition (good FOV inside 50 yards if opportunity presents) like a scope at 2X, won't make it top heavy, etc?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 14:41
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One can never go wrong with a Conquest IMO, especially at the $350 price tag for the one currently on the Sample List. I started to recommend that, huff143, but didn't since you said you wanted a simple uncluttered reticle, which usually means a standard plex, 4a, and the like.  The Conquest on the Sample List has the Rapid-Z reticle, which can certainly still be used like a standard plex, but it does include the extra BDC holdover lines. For a short range deer rifle as you describe, I'm of the "K.I.S.S. principle" mindset as regards to gear in general. The more info you have in your sight picture, the more likely you are to hesitate at a shot opportunity and possibly aim with the wrong cross-bar when your adrenaline is high and you've got buck fever, which usually describes most young hunters. Not to say this can't be overcome with familiarity with the rifle, but it's worth mentioning. I also don't think the Rapid-Z is the best reticle for really low light shooting either, as it's got pretty thin lines overall. But, I don't think it's any worse than some of the thinner plex reticle designs out there.

The downside to the 3-9X40 Conquest is it's a bit long and heavy for a 3-9X40 class scope, but it's optically excellent.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 14:47
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actually...  they have 4 of the Z-plex 3-9s!
 
 
 
I looked and its like 3 ozs more than the Monarch 2-8 that ILya mentioned.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 14:56
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New additions since I looked last!

Then, I would definitely go for the Conquest, no question! THE END!

Zeiss's Z-Plex is one of the best plex style reticles I've ever seen. Thanks, Tip!

Look no further, huff! Your search is over!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 15:44
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I concur with the others, that's a killer buy on the Conquest!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 15:54
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+1 on the conquest. Had one on my ar until decided to go 50mm obj and it worked great... Plus the price is right!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2014 at 23:10
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Then the Conquest wins!  It's too late to call him so I'll order it myself right now and he can payback later.  Thanks so much to my forum friends!
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