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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 07:38
baxsom View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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I know there are a lot of these what scope to buy threads but it is a huge choice and I don't want to buy something that I am going to regret later.  First intended use.  I work for a firearms training company in FL.  Up until now I have been the only working the handgun and carbine training but will soon start doing the long gun stuff.  I currently have a Remington 700 in 308 that is wearing a Bushnell 6-24 FFP.  It is a great scope but lacks turret stops.  My new scope is going on an AR10 and if I am going to get a new one I want something better than I already have.  We teach ranging and first round hits out to 1000 so I need a scope I can range with.  I don't want to break the bank though so around 2000 is about as much as I want to spend.  I've been looking at the SWFA 5-20 and it seems like a great scope.  I have the 12x on my 5.56 SPR and love it. Many people have suggested the Vortex line either the PST Viper or the Razor.  Then the Sightron S3 FFP, the Burris XTR2, and my local shop swears by the Tango6.  Clarity is my main criteria.  If I can't see it then I can't hit it.  So below are my criteria

Sub 2000 dollars
at least 20x
best glass possible
great warranty because we do a lot of training classes and push gear to the limit
zero stops
illuminated crosshairs

Thoughts?

Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 08:14
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Optics Jedi Master
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The SS 5-20 doesn't have a true zero stop, but there is a "work around" for that.

It has been my experience that >20X is not particularly field-friendly.  Unless sitting at a bench with a very steady gun, eye placement is too tricky to be useful.  I own several >20X scopes and almost never go above 15X on them.  It isn't a bad option to have if needed, but don't plan on staying up there and enjoying it much.

I have had a few SS 5-20s, and they all had at least a ride (if not a home) on an AR10, it is a good combination.  For class work, it is a nice setup; for real world, 5X is too much on the bottom end.

I have no experience with PST but do with the Razers, that would be a good option as well.  They do have a true zero stop.

For both Vortex and SS, the warranty is great, no worries there.

I have a similar rifle set up for field use, it wears a 2.5-10x42 Nightforce, great for close work and no problem on steel at 1000 yards (assuming I do my part.)  You aren't looking for groups at 1000 yards, you are looking for something that moves well in the field and gives enough clarity and magnification to hit the target.  I would include NIghtforce in your short list.


I have friends with AR10s that wear scopes with MUCH more magnification, and they work fine; I enjoy less mag, greater field of view, and an almost indestructible scope.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 09:03
baxsom View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Thanks,  the 5-20 from SWFA and the Razor are the main ones I am trying to decide on but I am hearing good things about that Weaver 6-30 as well. Tough call.  I read about the aftermarket zero stops for the SWFA and unless there has been an update I thought it said that for the 5-20 it could damage the turret?  If that has been fixed with a new design Id be ordering the SWFA immediately
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 09:33
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Optics Jedi Master
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I'll let someone chime in that has used the zero stop on an SS, I have not.

A 6-30 with 56mm objective? Wow.

If you are looking at the 5-20 gen1 razor, I would also look at the 3-18 gen2, it is not a light weight scope, but it is quite good, and much better in many respects than the gen1 razors.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 15:29
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Dark Lord of Optics

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I have not yet tested the Tango6, but I plan to do so shortly with the 3-18x44.  I like what I have seen so far.

In the meantime, my favourite sub-$2K scope is probably Steiner T5Xi.  They had an issue with the elevation turret that has been resolved.  It is very full featured design for the money and I am pretty impressed with the 3-15x50 I have been testing for a the last few months.

The reticle is pretty busy, but offers a lot of information for ranging. I would have likely preferred a reticle that allows for some limited holdover and wind compensation, but as is it is quite good.

ILya

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 19:13
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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Resident Redneck

Joined: June/20/2005
Location: Iowa
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U.S. Optics 3.2-17x44 LR-17 30mm Riflescope U.S. Optics 3.2-17x44 LR-17 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - USOLR17H59
  • Matte Black Type III Hard Anodizing
  • Illuminated Horus H-59 (Red)
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • EREK 1/10 MIL 110 Click Elevation Knob
  • US#1 1/10 MIL (Right) Windage Knob
  • Lo Profile - Rapid Focus Eyepiece Housing
  • USO Flip Open Covers
$2,798.70
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 19:14
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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U.S. Optics 3.2-17x44 LR-17 30mm Riflescope U.S. Optics 3.2-17x44 LR-17 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - USOLR17H102
  • Matte Black Type III Hard Anodizing
  • Illuminated Horus H-102 (Red)
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • EREK 1/10 MIL 110 Click Elevation Knob
  • US#1 1/10 MIL (Right) Windage Knob
  • Lo Profile - Rapid Focus Eyepiece Housing
  • USO Flip Open Covers
$2,798.70
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 19:15
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Resident Redneck

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U.S. Optics 1.8-10x37 MR-10 30mm Riflescope U.S. Optics 1.8-10x37 MR-10 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - USOMR10MIL
  • Matte Black Type III Hard Anodizing
  • Illuminated Mil-Scale GAP (Red)
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • EREK 1/10 MIL Elevation Knob
  • US#1 1/10 MIL (Right) Windage Knob
  • Lo Profile - Rapid Focus Eyepiece Housing
  • USO Flip Open Covers
$2,223.95
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 19:27
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There are a lot of directions I could point you, but the three scopes above would all be very solid choices.  The Nightforce scopes are nice but the low power range starts higher, and I truely believe that you are better off with 3.2 on the low end or a 1.8 on the low end and I think once you get to 17x the difference between a 17x and a 20x is insignificant.  I have come to believe that the Horus reticles can be a fine choice because it truely gives you one more tool. Yes you can dial in but when you see dust come up two mils left you can simply shift your point of aim.  My suggestion buy once cry once.   I would either want a  U.S. Optics or better yet a Heinsoldt.  The Vortex scopes are a possible the Nightforce scopes are a possible the IOR scopes are a possible.  Rancid Coolaid has probably owned all of them while my budget has been Leupold Mk4's which are relatively good at less money.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 20:17
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ROLL TIDE ROLL

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/07/2016 at 20:22
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ROLL TIDE ROLL

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The IOR 4-28X56 Recon is sweet too!

Spent some range time with a buddies!

http://www.swfa.com/IOR-4-28x50-RECON-Tactical-40mm-Rifle-Scope-P77583.aspx
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 09:01
baxsom View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: August/29/2012
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Thanks for all the advice. Lots of good choices offered. Most are over my 2k limit but I'm drooling now with an itchy credit card finger. All the reviews on the 5-20 swfa look like its a great scope that will do exactly what I need it to
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 09:08
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ROLL TIDE ROLL

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I shoot a 5-20 SS on my 308 and it lacks nothing at 1K. Can't go wrong with that pick either!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 11:00
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Optics Apprentice
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Interesting thing comes to mind here. For someone to instruct others in a subject, there should be a vetted and track record of extertiese in the area.
So if you are getting ready to begin instructing others in this discipline, then it stands to reason that you already know what you are doing as you have been doing this a long time to gain the experience and competence to correctly teach others. Yet, you are here on the interwebs asking questions you should have answered years ago.
What school did you say you teach for?
Also, i have used SWFA 10X42M scopes for 20 years to do what you are asking. Today i use the 5x20. Either way, you are in the right place!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 20:45
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Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


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So, what is this new zero stop for the HD?


It would make it almost the perfect scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/08/2016 at 21:06
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Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


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Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

I have not yet tested the Tango6, but I plan to do so shortly with the 3-18x44.  I like what I have seen so far.

In the meantime, my favourite sub-$2K scope is probably Steiner T5Xi.  They had an issue with the elevation turret that has been resolved.  It is very full featured design for the money and I am pretty impressed with the 3-15x50 I have been testing for a the last few months.

The reticle is pretty busy, but offers a lot of information for ranging. I would have likely preferred a reticle that allows for some limited holdover and wind compensation, but as is it is quite good.

ILya



Please forgive me if I am incorrect, but I think I read that the Tango6 only has 8 mil per rev.


I can't find the info.  Thanks.
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