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Sako or Cooper

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 13:33
R H Clark View Drop Down
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Hello everyone.I'm new here.I just found this forum searching for scopes.I bought a Leupold from the sample list.
 
I own a Sako 75 Finnlite.I have mixed feelings about it because it is my second one.The first shot the most amazing 3 shot one hole groups ever.The problem was that with some factory rounds,the bolt would not close.Out of several brands there would be 2-6 out of 20 that would chamber but the bolt would not close.
 
I saw that there had been a recall,not my serial# but still a concern, and had my dealer send it back to be checked.When it came back the chamber area looked as though someone had clamped it in a vice with no padding.It was chewed all to $%&*.Upon calling the rep my dealer was told he had improperly packaged the rifle and the bolt had come loose during shipping and done the damage even though there was not a single mark on the bolt.
 
My dealer refunded my money and I purchased another Finnlite the same day.My second rifle had a problem with stringing.It simply needed an action screw adjustment which was done by my local GS.It shoots under 1" at 100 yards with factory ammo but not nearly as well as my first rifle.
 
I am now in the market for a new rifle.I am considering the Cooper 52 or an older Sako,possibly Finnbear,maby a nice wood stocked 75.I like the way a Sako handles but have no experience with the Cooper.Accuracy is a major factor.I shot competition years ago and I really like one hole groups.This is however a hunting rifle with seldom a shot over 200 yards.
 
Which do you like better and why? Sorry for such a long post but I wanted you to see why I have mixed feelings.I would go with Sako in a second if I thought it would be as accurate as my first.My second is nice but no better really than other production rifles I own,which is why I am considering a Cooper.
 
Thanks for any input.
Randy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 13:39
cheaptrick View Drop Down
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Welcome to The OT, my friend. 

Rifledude has one or more of the Coop's. I'm sure he can help you. 
As far as I'm concerned, the Cooper's are are ahead of the Sako's, and I'm a Sako fan.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 13:56
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I have a Sako 75, Sako 85 Finnlight and a Cooper model 52. Each has +'s and -'s. The 75 is an older 30-06, fits me perfectly and shoots GREAT! It's rather heavy though. I picked up a McMillen stock for it several years ago which I switch out and use for hunting. The wood stock (although not fancy) is kinda purdy ...so it lives in the safe mostly. My Cooper is the Jackson Hunter (synthetic stock) in 25-06. It too shoots very good, but just doesn't fit me quite as well  (ergonomic wise) as the 75. I'm not complaining though, it's been without issue. The Finnlight is a 7mm-08, new, and certainly lighter for the long trek. I'm still getting used to it and so far, it shoots pretty well (but not as good as the 75 LOL). I scoped it with a Trijicon 3-9 X 40 and it's a great pairing IMO.

My bottom line is (in order of love) 1) Sako 75 2) Cooper 3) Sako 85 Finnlight.

ANY of these are winners and keepers. I'll take them over most anything else.

BTW, welcome! Howdy


Edited by bugsNbows - July/31/2011 at 13:58
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 14:34
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Welcome to OT, Randy.

If you're looking for true "one hole groups," ditch the idea of getting a factory rifle altogether.  Build a custom rifle.  It's a very rare factory rifle that will group all shots into one hole, despite the b.s. you hear from shooters on the internet.  In fact, a true "1 MOA, all day long" factory rifle (with the obligatory "if I do my part" disclaimer) is really not as common as folks on the internet would have you believe.

Having said that, Coopers are probably some of the best shooting out of the box "factory" rifles you can buy, on average.  As with all factory rifles, though, there are always exceptions, and it's somewhat a roll of the dice.  I have 2 Cooper M21 varmint rifles, and they will flat out shoot.  Both will group below 1 MOA, and most of the time below 1/2 MOA very consistently.  Part of that has to do with what they're chambered in (.223 and 6PPC), and part of that has to do with the fact they're heavy barreled rifles with wide forends.  Coopers come with good barrels to begin with.  The fact they have pretty good triggers and I adjusted them down to less than 2 lbs also helps me shoot them more precisely.

A buddy of mine also has 2 Coopers, and both of his shoot like mine.  I've shot a few others as well, so I know those 4 rifles aren't isolated flukes.  Cooper has a well-earned reputation for accuracy.  They also have great fit and finish, and the wood stocked rifles usually come with pretty nice wood.  In short, you really get a lot for your money with a Cooper, in spite of the fact they are somewhat expensive. 

I also have a few Sakos -- 2 M75s, 1 M85, 1 L61, and 1 AV -- so you could say I'm a Sako fan as well.  To me, they are better hardcore hunting rifles than Coopers, even though experience tells me they aren't as accurate as Coopers on average (even though I have a M75 Varmint Stainless in .204 that will shoot with any Cooper I've ever seen).  Sakos have smoother bolt operation and stock designs better suited to big game hunting than Cooper.  Coopers are usually prettier rifles, and their varmint rifles are as good as it gets for long range varmint shooting without going to a full custom.  Both have equally good triggers when tuned properly. 

Despite the fact both are high end rifles, Sako and Cooper have different personalities, and are really intended to fill different roles.  Coopers aren't really "factory" rifles, though they aren't custom rifles either from the standpoint you can't choose the action and barrel.  They are "semi-custom, limited production" guns.

I'd say the choice between the two should be based on what's most important to you.  If you want a rifle with pretty wood and/or if accuracy isn't just the most important thing, it's everything, get a Cooper.  Ditto if you want a wide forend varmint rig that you'll shoot from a bench and prone more than you'll carry.  If you intend to hunt hard with the rifle in all weather (where you might opt for stainless metal/ synthetic stock), and you aren't so concerned about fancy wood, get a Sako.  I agree with B&B that the Sako 75 has a great stock design ergonomically.  I do like the straight classic stock style of the Coopers, though.  Most of the time, Sakos will shoot as well as any other factory bolt rifle, but as with all factory rifles, whether or not you get one that really shoots is luck of the draw.


Edited by RifleDude - July/31/2011 at 14:39
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 15:22
R H Clark View Drop Down
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Thanks everyone for the very well thought out answers.It's the kind of input I need rather than just one liners of get XXX rifle.
 
Just about what I expected to hear,though I'm still glad to have my thoughts confirmed. What I really need is to find someone who owns a Cooper that I can handle,especially the Jackson Hunter.I like a high cheek piece so I can get cheek weld with larger objective scopes.
 
Any opinion on the Jackson hunter stock or just the style in general? Also which low recoil caliber would you choose for deer hunting? I was thinking maby 7mm-08 but would like to hear if you have any suggestions that might offer more accuracy potential.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 16:55
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For a low recoil deer caliber, I'd get 7-08 or 6.5-284.  Both have good accuracy potential.

I've never handled the Jackson Hunter style stock, but it looks to be basically the same as their straight classic stocks except with the addition of a higher cheekpiece. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 17:07
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I haven't got to handle a Cooper without a straight comb stock.
I like the way Sakos with a Monte Carlo fit, I just drop into the scope and they are very ergonomic

I had a finnlight 85 270 that was finnicky, I think it as the barrel just being too thin and light

I have a few older Sakos and just picked up an AV 25-06 stainless synthetic
My experiences with Sakos and Tikkas have been that I can usually find a .5" load without a whole lot of effort.

I may replace the stock on the 25-06 with McMillan Sako Hunter model done in the Edge material to have a lighter setup with the same feel I like.

Coopers are very, very nice rifles, never owned one and haven't had a chance to try something with a different stock.  I got a Browning Xbolt recently, and just don't like the way my cheek hits the top edge of the stock.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 17:42
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Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

Welcome to The OT, my friend. 

Rifledude has one or more of the Coop's. I'm sure he can help you. 
As far as I'm concerned, the Cooper's are are ahead of the Sako's, and I'm a Sako fan.  

I just reread my lame ass response. Rifledude's post was spot on and so very well articulated, as usual. 

I merely meant the Cooper's I've handled seemed to me that they were exceptionally well made and exuded the quality and workmanship I've seen on top shelf custom rifles.    
Almost....too nice. I'd be very afraid for my Neanderthal hands to drop it or scruff it up. 


Mr. Dude too made mention that the Sako's were more "hard core hunting rifles" and I couldn't agree more. 
Nice work, Ted.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/31/2011 at 22:23
R H Clark View Drop Down
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Sorry man.I wasn't trying to take a shot at you for a short reply.I appreciate the welcome.Sometimes it's nice even for someone to acknowledge they are listening.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 05:13
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Originally posted by R H Clark R H Clark wrote:

Thanks everyone for the very well thought out answers.It's the kind of input I need rather than just one liners of get XXX rifle.
 
Just about what I expected to hear,though I'm still glad to have my thoughts confirmed. What I really need is to find someone who owns a Cooper that I can handle,especially the Jackson Hunter.I like a high cheek piece so I can get cheek weld with larger objective scopes.
 
Any opinion on the Jackson hunter stock or just the style in general? Also which low recoil caliber would you choose for deer hunting? I was thinking maby 7mm-08 but would like to hear if you have any suggestions that might offer more accuracy potential.


If you ever get down my way you'd be welcome to check my 25-06 out. It's scoped with a Swaro AV with the T.D.S. reticle which is sweet.

I really do like the Jackson Hunter stock (it's just as good, if not better, than the McMillen I have for the 75).

Yippee
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 05:34
cheaptrick View Drop Down
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Originally posted by R H Clark R H Clark wrote:

Sorry man.I wasn't trying to take a shot at you for a short reply.I appreciate the welcome.Sometimes it's nice even for someone to acknowledge they are listening.

Man, we are glad your here! Howdy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 09:54
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Have both coopers and sakos, but personally prefer the older sako actions above all (except for the trg models). And would get one put in something like a mcmillian stock with a good barrel for what a new cooper costs. One point not brought up yet is the limitation of rings and bases for the sako. Something like leo sakos are usually the only alternative away from sako options, Most coopers come with a set of turn in bases you may want to replace with a weaver slot type, of which there are not alot of choices. To me the combs on most of the coopers are not high enough for the higher rings and larger objectives.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 11:23
cheaptrick View Drop Down
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I had Talley mounts on my M75 too. Leupold were good also. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 12:01
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I have the Optilocks on my 75, Talleys on the 85 and Cooper.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2011 at 16:11
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I have a couple Sako AVs in left hand and use only Optilocks on them.  Have a set of Talley 1", but haven't really warmed up to them.  They keep the scope too far forward.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/02/2011 at 07:51
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If ya want to be little different, you can get picatinny (alloy or steel) rails for the 75 and 85 Sakos. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/02/2011 at 10:49
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I had a Cooper...nothing wrong with the rifle other than it was supposed to be my coyote gun of choice.  In that capacity, the gun was way too pretty to take into the woods and get banged around.   I had mine in .223 and also didnt like the 1:12 twist rate, but thats just personal preference.
Beautiful, well made gun though.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/02/2011 at 17:42
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Originally posted by Sgtshultzy266 Sgtshultzy266 wrote:

the gun was way too pretty to take into the woods and get banged around. 
Beautiful, well made gun though.

That's what I'm saying. Sheesh...I'm such a clutz! That beautiful wood would look like hell after a few trips with me.   
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/02/2011 at 17:43
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Originally posted by bugsNbows bugsNbows wrote:

If ya want to be little different, you can get picatinny (alloy or steel) rails for the 75 and 85 Sakos. 

That would be cool. Does Near Man. makes a rail for Sako's? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 09:27
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Not to my knowledge. I'm thinking Roedale does and, I think, it's 20 MOA.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 10:00
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its Roedale, but the rail is way to high to be useful, unless your using the action for a tactical build with an adjustable cheek.  whats needed is something like the old Redfield bases that tap on with slots cut in them instead of set up for turn rings.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 12:43
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I stand corrected. Thanks, Gents. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 15:07
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With my recent trouble with mounts for Sako I'll probably go with Cooper. I don't mind paying for quality but hate to pay extra just because of limited options and still not be able to get an optimal solution.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 15:33
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i'm not sure how the 75 and 85 differ from the a7 i just bought... but talley 1 piece lightweight's worked no problem.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/03/2011 at 16:52
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Originally posted by Dyelynn Dyelynn wrote:

i'm not sure how the 75 and 85 differ from the a7 i just bought... but talley 1 piece lightweight's worked no problem.
The SWFA specs list them to fit the A7 but there is no mention of the 75 or 85.
 
If anyone knows a good place to buy rings and bases,please let me know. I want something other than the Optilocks. All I can find is Leupold and Burris.From what I gather Talley are better but I can't find any.
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