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Rifle damaged in Fire

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 18:44
gun74 View Drop Down
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wanted to know if anybody had any ideas on how to tell if a firearm that has been in a fire is safe to shoot.A friend of mine has one from his grandfathers shop that burnt, the wood on the rifle is still there but is scorched black.I was going to reload a light load for it and then put it in gun vise and tie a string to the trigger and fire it that way.Would this be safe or not. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 18:56
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I would try the same thing  I think if the wood is not charcoal it will be fine. Good luck and let us know. I have seen and fired a colt single action that was really badly burned and all is good we have been shooting it for almost 40 years.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 18:59
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 It is a dangerous crap shoot. Trying a light load in it wouldn't tell you if it was safe to shoot with a factory load, so you've really learned nothing from the string test.
 I would weld the breech and muzzle shut, and sell it for scrap, as hard as that might be.
 Or better yet, turn it in for 50 bucks the next time some bloated big-city mayor initiates a gun buy-back "crime prevention measure"...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 19:06
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get it to a gunsmith and have it gone over --better safe than sorry
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 19:10
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Just what kind of rifle are you talking about Ruger, Sako ,Remington ..post a pic so we can see it?  the smith thing I should have mentioned #1 get two opinions some might tell you it's junk just to score a good deal!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 19:15
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Originally posted by martin3175 martin3175 wrote:

get it to a gunsmith and have it gone over --better safe than sorry
 
+1
Heat can really change the proprieties of steel.
Sam
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 20:59
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it is a pre 64 model 70,I will get a picture posted as soon as I can
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 21:02
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You know that gun is or maybe was worth some money ...all the more reason to have it checked out you might be surprised like my uncle was with his Colt! 1st gen 45.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 21:10
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the bluing looks fine it doesn't show any signs of heat damage and the action works great,I have to look up a gunsmith and get there opinion on it,I was a little hesitant to do that in case they would try to rip him off. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 21:11
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X = 180 Y = 90 (X+Pyro)+(Y-Pyro) = ?

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Originally posted by SamC SamC wrote:

Originally posted by martin3175 martin3175 wrote:

get it to a gunsmith and have it gone over --better safe than sorry
 
+1
Heat can really change the proprieties of steel.
Sam
 
That's no kidding. Work with enough of it, and you see how many things affect steel. I was working on parts today that got work hardened just from being drilled. I'd have it checked out by a good gunsmith.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 21:16
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Yes you do have to watch out especially with a gun of that nature, they are getting quite pricey,also my favorite. If there is a... worlds greatest outfitter.... this term used for editing..or a Bass shop these have gun smiths within sometimes ? and wont try to do you in.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 22:28
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If you don't see any discoloration of the bluing then it is unlikely that the steel got hot enough to do harm. If someone brought one like that to me, I would get a couple of 180gr. rounds and do like you said. If it fires two or more rounds and you see no splits, bulges or the bolt still works smooth. Then I would feel good about the rifle for lighter loads ie.150 or smaller. I know lighter rounds can still make high pressure, but the rifle should handle it. Be thourough, check the barrel with a straight edge, work the bolt and feel for tight spots, Take the stock off and look for color difference. Give it a good clean so you can see any variations. You need a gun smith you have a history with, if you don't then you are subject to their concern of liability. Most would say don't shoot it to play it safe. Utilmately the decision will be yours. You will have to bare the liability. Be safe! Good Luck!!

Edited by Sgt. D - March/30/2009 at 22:30
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/30/2009 at 22:51
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 It's a crying shame it was such a fine rifle, too.
 Why couldn't it have been a break-action single-barrel Brazilian-made shotgun?!
 
What cartridge is it chambered for?
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 02:59
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I hate it for you 74, but Ronk is right. Quench and tempering the action and barrel especially in an unknown or uneven state would render the weapon unsafe in any condition.  Only a metallurgist could give you good data and the testing would be destructive.   Sad   
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 06:04
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The barrel would have to reach a temperature of about 650degF + to cause damage and it would have to sustain that temperature for several minutes.  If the bluing is not discolored, I would be hard pressed to believe you reached that kind of temperature.  Rather than just a gunsmith, I would take it to someone who is a true gunmaker of high quality for evaluation.  I certainly would not fire it without some professional opinion of possible damage.  It is worth the assessment 1) for your safety, 2) possible save of a potentially good rifle.  I once purchased a number of guns... long and pistols, which had been in a fire and they ALL turned out to be in good shape, even though there was some damage to some of the stocks and grips.  It was a great investment.  They cleaned up nicely, I learned to do stock refinishing and enjoyed usage of a number of very fine shooters for a number of years.  Don't be too quick to write it off.

Edited by Kickboxer - March/31/2009 at 06:04
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 07:35
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Quote) Don't be too quick to write it off. Quote)

Exactly! If the wood had actually been burned then there would be cause for serious concern. 200F and water can turn wood finish black. If you know anytiing about it's location in the fire you can have some idea of what temps were in it's area. Was it in a case? Was it in a closet? What kind of damage was in it's surroundings. Was there melted plastic (450F+)? Is one side of the stock black the other ok? So many things will let you know what your dealing with.



Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 08:53
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it is chambered in 7mm [7x57] which I have been told are very hard to find.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 09:05
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its very rare! only the 300 savage 35 rem and 458 rem mag are more rare. less than 3000 of the 7mm's were made between 1937 and 1949. if it was in excellent condition it would be worth a substantial amount of money. damn shame if you ask me
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 09:25
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Gun,

 Take the rifle to a good gun smith and have him take everything apart and have a look at it. The barrel, receiver and most of the other parts are probably fine. What you need to look out for is the springs, clips, and pins as they will be hurt/damaged before anything else it takes very little heat for this to happen, and if the rifle was in a fire and hosed down when the fire was put out it could use a good cleaning inside and out. It’s a win win for you to have this done.

 

I do a ton of fire damaged guns.98% of the time they are okay on the out side but some inards need to be replaced.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 09:28
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I suspect it is fine.  I would get the opinion of a very good gunsmith or custom gun builder first. I might consider taking it to the woods and doing the string test with a factory load. A reduced light load can be too light and cause you trouble also. You do have the option to have it re-barreled which while destroying any collectable value would put a trustworthy barrel on it, as I doubt the action or the bolt would be an issue - failing due to metal fatigue.  Re-barreling could allow you to select caliber.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 10:11
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Hoo boy- now I'm really second-guessing my earlier advice to weld it shut!
 These guys all make good arguments for trying to save it.
 
Personally, I'd never feel quite right letting one of my kids use it, regardless of who checked it out and deemed it "probably okay."
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 10:24
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Originally posted by RONK RONK wrote:

 
Hoo boy- now I'm really second-guessing my earlier advice to weld it shut!
 These guys all make good arguments for trying to save it.
 
Personally, I'd never feel quite right letting one of my kids use it, regardless of who checked it out and deemed it "probably okay."
 
If you trust your smith you should look back in letting your kidds shoot it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 10:26
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i would suspect that if your smith double checked the inner parts and replaced springs and pins as bd suggested and they ran a bore scope down the tube and everything checked out it would be ok. i too would have some apprehensions about letting just anybody shoot it also.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 11:15
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the rifle was in the back part of the building were there was more smoke damage then fire damage.it was caused by a can of old gun powder self igniteing
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/31/2009 at 11:26
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mostly smoke damage, thats good, you said the stock was charred though?? how bad how deep?
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