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Rem 223 SPS Tactical-need scope

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2010 at 20:49
CardinalFan59 View Drop Down
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Long story, short. I don't hunt or shoot or own a hunting rifle. My 13 yr old son won a shooting competition and won a trip to South Texas and I am invited. I bot the above 223 to shoot varmints on the trip and to mainly plink when I get back.  He currently deer hunts with his matching 308 SPS Tactical and will taking it to ST for deer and the other critters.I bot it because he doesn't own a 223 and the bullets are relative inexpensive compared to other calibers.  His has Leupolds on his other rifles. He says that I should get a variable scope approx 6-18X. I think that I want a 40mm as opposed to a 50mm because of the smaller size but I'm open to suggestions. I'm torn between buying a cheaper priced scope or buying a more expensive one.
1) Swfa has the Sweet 233 6-18x40 for 69.99 and the Simmons Aetec 4-14x44 for 139.95 less 25% rebate.  I assume the Aetec would be the better buy, correct?
2) Although my pocketbook and my wife may not like it, I'm not entirely opposed to spending $500 on a scope since my son will probably keep this gun/scope forever.  It will probably "out-shoot" my skills but it may not for my son now and years to come.  Suggestions?
 
Thanx
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2010 at 21:15
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http://swfa.com/Vortex-Viper-Rifle-Scopes-C1410.aspx  Check out the 4-12x40 model with bdc...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2010 at 21:59
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I se3cond the vortex viper it is a great deal right now dont wait long to get one.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/16/2010 at 22:13
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Welcome to OT 59.The best buy for a hunting scope is Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 with a #4 ret,If you are looking to compete the Viper would probably be a better buy.The zeiss is on sale @ SWFA for $399.95.Just my 2cents,good luck.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 07:08
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For the varmint like you said you'd be hunting the viper mentioned above would be a slight advantage over a 3-9, youll appreciate a little extra magnification as a beginning shooter.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 08:26
CardinalFan59 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
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Originally posted by stickbow46 stickbow46 wrote:

Welcome to OT 59.The best buy for a hunting scope is Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 with a #4 ret,If you are looking to compete the Viper would probably be a better buy.The zeiss is on sale @ SWFA for $399.95.Just my 2cents,good luck.
 
I found the Conquest scope but it appears the regular price is $399.95. Maybe I was looking at the wrong one.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 08:51
CardinalFan59 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 08:57
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Chief Sackscratch

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The viper would be a lot better
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 11:16
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yeah i think the conquest is regularly 399 on SWFA but that's a sale price everywhere else. at least local to me anyways 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 11:25
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the nitrex is 10 oz heavier   and fov is about equal  I would go viper again there like 100 bucks off now on sale
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 12:51
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I'd not even consider that BSA you were originally considering. I've had decent luck with Simmons, but I think I'd skip over that one too. There are a lot of good suggestions that have already been mentioned here. If you are on a $200 budget the Burris Fullfield II is always a good choice. If you can spare $400 the Conquest is what I'd get.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 12:58
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The normal price on the Conquest is $499.95 but Zeiss is offering a discount till the end of the year.Even at $499.95 they are stll a best bang for the Buck[play on words]for hunting.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 13:21
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myself i been a Nikon guy so i would opt for the Monarch 2.5-10  since you can get it for under 400 and in mildot,bdc,plex  reticles  that's still were the pricing of the viper is still a better current deal
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 13:42
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My head is spinning with all this good info!!!!  :)
 
1)  Vortex 4-12x40 Viper Rifle Scope. I read all the good comments about the Viper and about more "glass" for the $$$.  I've never heard of a Vortex scope but that really doesn't mean a whole lot. I'm pretty ignorant. I have heard of Leupold.  What the exact comparable Leupold Scope.? ie. What I'm trying to determine is how much more would I have to pay to get an equivalent Viper scope in the Leupold line of scopes. I'm trying to compare apples and apples so to speak. 
 
2)  Leupold VX-3 4.5-14x40 Varmint Hunters Reticle......same question. It is approx $600 What would be the equivalent in the Vortex line of scopes.
 
ps: Locally, I've been talked out of the lower end scopes so no BSA, etc. so I've raised my limit on the scope. I'm 50 and my eyesight isnt what it once was and my son will keep this forever so I might as well splurge on a scope.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 13:49
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Chief Sackscratch

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If your gonna spend 600 on a scope get the Zeiss Conquest in your magnification range you wll use.  4-14 or similar.  Its hands down a great scope and it will be a lifetime scope as well.  If you spend that much you need to step up in glass quality and not many are fond of Leupolds.....(not that they aren't good they just arent' teh best for their cost)
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/17/2010 at 14:06
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Originally posted by SVT_Tactical SVT_Tactical wrote:

If your gonna spend 600 on a scope get the Zeiss Conquest in your magnification range you wll use.  4-14 or similar.  Its hands down a great scope and it will be a lifetime scope as well.  If you spend that much you need to step up in glass quality and not many are fond of Leupolds.....(not that they aren't good they just arent' teh best for their cost)
   +1
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 10:41
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Optics GrassHopper
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After much angst, I ended up buying a new Leupold 4.5-14x40 AO with Varmint Reticle.  It was just under $600 including 2 day shipping.  I just couldn't get past the long history of the Leupold as compared to the some of the others. I liked the features of the Leupold over the Zeiss.  Thanks for all your comments and help. Excellent
 
(now my son wants to put this new scope on his 308 and give me his 4x12 VXI....kids think up the grandest things)
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:11
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Congratulations on the new scope. I have a Leupold VXIII 4.5-14x50 that I like very much. I will say that the boys are right the Zeiss is better glass but the Leupold in a VX3 is really quite nice.  Let me mention a couple of things - first a balistic reticle only holds true at the maximum magnification of the scope and at all lower powers the center of the crosshair is all that is true. I would suggest you put the new VX3 on the .223 and I would suggest you consider trading in his used 4-12 VX1 onto a 3-9x42 Super Sniper which will challenge his abilities because it has tactical knobs to allow him to dial in correction for trajectory and wind drift at long range.  Also as a shooter progresses in skill the ability to use mil dots to range find distance or to use as known hold over marks becomes important and since this particular scope is FFP (first focal plane) the hold over marks work at every power unlike your second focal plane VX3.
SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope Mil-Dot SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope
Stock # - SS39X42
  • Matte
  • First Focal Plane Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • OK for .50 cal
  • 0.1 MRAD
$599.95
Here is the form you can use to request info about trading in your used VX1 :
You will find that the glass in both your new VX3 and the Super Sniper will absolutely smoke the VX1.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:20
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Also worth consideration is the Sightron SIII line of scopes:
Sightron 6-24x50 SIII 30mm Riflescope Mil-Dot Sightron 6-24x50 SIII 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - SIIISS624X50LRMD
  • Matte
  • Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • Target Knobs
$804.95
While not an FFP this does have target knobs and the mildot reticle.
Also there is a little gadget like a slide rule called  Mil Dot master that is quiet helpful for rangefinding.
Mil-Dot Master Mil-Dot Master
Stock # - MD1
  • Estimating Target Size
  • Determining Range to Target
  • Correcting for Bullet Drop
  • Correcting for Wind Drift
  • Correcting for Uphill/Downhill
  • Correcting Correction to Mil (holdover)
  • Correcting Correction to MOA (sight adjustment)
$29.95
http://www.kentonindustries.com/pics/ttctypes/  Kenton Ind will engrave target or tactical knobs to match your choice of bullet and caliber.

Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - August/18/2010 at 11:20
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:33
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Urimaginaryfrnd.....Thanx for the suggestion.
 
As most boys do, he enjoys trying to shoot long range shot. He can consistently hit the pie pan(?) at the 300 yd mark at the shooting range with his 308. He killed a buck last year at 263 yds. He does not know how to judge wind, etc. though.  (and of course, I don't either)  His competitions are with 22's and muzzleloaders at 25-75 yds, bows (10-30 yds) and skeet shooting so wind is not that big of an issue, normally. I could see him one day getting into reloading his own bullets and practicing different loads, weights, etc. He is good at math and that would be right up his alley.
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:47
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300 yds really isnt that far for a tactical scope and I would suggest that he is at the limit imposed by the equipment he has not anywhere near the limit of his ability so its time to have a scope with tactical  knobs even if it's a fixed power Super Sniper or sending the scope he has back to Leupold Custom shop for M1 or target knobs, but the down side of that is the VX1 glass is not that good which makes me suggest you trade into better glass.
Some day he will likely be at the level where he needs a Nightforce or Heinsoldt (tactical Zeiss) but the Super Sniper or a Sightron SIII would challenge his ability now and help him to learn how to correct for trajectory and wind drift.


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - August/18/2010 at 11:47
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:51
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Leupold does make these also.
Leupold 4.5-14x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope Mil-Dot Leupold 4.5-14x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - LEU56130
  • Matte
  • Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • Long Range
  • Side Focus
  • Target Knobs
$879.95
Leupold 4.5-14x50 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope TMR Leupold 4.5-14x50 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - LEU60005
  • Matte
  • Tactical Milling Reticle
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • M1 Target Knobs
  • Free Leupold Flip-Open Lens Covers w/ Purchase
$1,199.95


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - August/18/2010 at 11:51
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 11:54
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I have both of these and I find the Super Sniper to be more user friendly:
Leupold 3.5-10x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope TMR Leupold 3.5-10x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - LEU60030
  • Matte
  • Tactical Milling Reticle
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • M1 Target Knobs
  • First Focal Plane Reticle
  • Free Leupold Flip-Open Lens Covers
$1,499.95
SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope Mil-Dot SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope
Stock # - SS39X42
  • Matte
  • First Focal Plane Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • OK for .50 cal
  • 0.1 MRAD
$599.95


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - August/18/2010 at 11:55
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/18/2010 at 20:24
stickbow46 View Drop Down
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Would also add MinoxZA5 3-15x42 @ SWFA for $528.95 with BDC ret. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/19/2010 at 08:07
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urimaginaryfrnd " and since this particular scope is FFP (first focal plane) the hold over marks work at every power unlike your second focal plane VX3."
 
Although the description is mentioned in the SS scope, the phrase didn't mean anything to me when I read it. You're the first one to define it. I will keep that in mind for future scopes.   Although I don't see how a 13 yr old could need another gun (besides a competition shotgun", I imagine something will happen while he's under my roof to "require" a purchase. 
 
He is going bonkers over the fact that I don't shoot and my scope is going to be better than anything he has!!! 
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