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red apples vs. green apples

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 14:32
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Alright, another which is better:  Rifle : Rem mountain rifle .30-06 (going back to the all arounder but really no choice, only caliber I could find for a walnut, blued mountain rifle DM but it suits me fine.   6.5 lbs rifle only, 22" pencil barrel.  Gonna go with Warne Maxima permanent rings and bases.  Hunting conditions, stand hunting and on the move everything up to 350 yd shots but usually shots 100 yd to 250 yds.  Now here's it is, the Zeiss 2.5-8x32 or Nikon 2.5-10x42.  Seems like Nikon is doing what Zeiss did to Leupold back in 2001.  Just as good a scope for less money.  Anyway I like the idea of smaller is better and went that way for many years even going with a fixed 4x for quite some time but the 2.5-10 power range seems very interesting to me.  42mm objective maybe will have to mount higher but I still think I can get away with low rings.  Thanks for your input.

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 14:43
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they are both good scopes, im thinking that you can still use low rings with the 42mm but dont quote me. i like my nikonsand zeiss makes a very nice line of optics as well.


Edited by pyro6999 - December/27/2008 at 14:44
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 14:43
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is there a question in there?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 15:32
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sorry, "The Nikon 2.5-10x42 Monarch or Zeiss Conquest 2.5-8x32 ?" is the question - with all that mumbo jumbo being said.  Whacko



Edited by bagderRed - December/27/2008 at 15:35
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 15:54
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These are not really comparable scopes due to different configurations.

If you are trying to compare similar scopes, you should be looking at

Nikon Monarch 2.5-10x42 vs Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40
or
Nikon Monarch 2-8x32 vs Zeiss Conquest 2.5-8x32

Depending on the configurations, Monarch is $50 to $100 cheaper.
Optically, Zeiss is a bit better, but not much. 
Mechanically, I would expect them to be pretty similar. 
Size and weight are about the same.
Beyond that, it comes down to which one you prefer esthetically and which one has the reticle selection you want.

Personally, if you are looking for a 32mm objective lens scope, I'd probably go for the Monarch.  It is substantially cheaper and has nice broad field of view at 2x.

If you are looking for a 40/42mm scope, I would go with the Conquest.  There, the price difference is comparatively smaller and I like the #4 reticle available in the Zeiss.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 16:01
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Thanks Koshkin and Pyro.  Yea, it's not really a fair comparison hence the title - red apples vs. green apples, but I thought I would throw it out there anyway.  Like I've said before, I have had great luck with a 3-9x40 Conquest that I have since sold and I have no reason to change from Zeiss other than a little bit of savings (up front anyways) and a curiousity to try out Nikon's new Monarch. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 16:50
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One thing I'll say about the new Nikon Monarch's compared to the Zeiss Conquest is the fit & finish is better on the Monarch.  The turret caps aren't plastic and the clicks are much more precise.  I've not been terribly impressed with the build quality of the Zeiss.  I agree with earlier posts the Zeiss will be slightly better optically, but the Monarch will be more than sufficient for anything I'd do with it.  I'd probably opt for the Monarch if I were scoping that rifle, but there's no wrong choice.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 17:23
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Thanks for the input Horsemany.  That's the one gripe I could say about the Conquest - the plastic turret caps and the flimsy looking dials.  I forgot to check the crispness of the clicks on the Monarch compared to the Zeiss so I can't comment there, but I'll take your word.  I don't know for sure but in the store, which don't mean jack, the monarch looked better to my eyes but who knows... I think I just might try out a Nikon.  Thanks again everyone.

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 22:17
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I know you said that is the only caliber you could find (I'm assuming one you located that's in stock or similar reason). However, I'd be a little (not a lot, but a little) concerned over the recoil from the .30-06 in that light a rifle. At the ranges you're talking, a .308 would do just as good a job with less recoil. The exception would be that at the extreme (350) you'd get more bullet drop, e.g. 11" vs. 8.5" for a Nosler 165 gr. Accubond (2800 fps vs. 2650). But 8.5" is already close to being a bad shot without compensation (holding high, BDC reticle or target turrets). Okay, I'm out of parentheses...must stop typing.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 22:40
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I don't know about all this talk of the plastic turret caps, and "flimsy" looking turrets, but I am becoming fond of the plastic caps. They are much easier to screw on, especially when in a hurry. Compare these to fine threaded aluminum caps sometime. Try it sometime after you have rushed through cross threading them once. I'll stick with cheap looking plastic, that doesn't scratch, or dent, and is every bit as tough as pain in the a$$ aluminum. Sorry that has been eating me for a while now. As far as the turrets, I'll just say this. My Conquest tracks ten times better after taking one hell of a hit than my Monarch did the day I took it out of the box. Call it plastic and flimsy, or what ever you want. When it kills deer the way it does, I won't waste my time arguing with you. I'll just go back to killing deer. The Monarch is a very nice scope. I would not choose it over a Conquest. Especially on account of the cheap cheezy junk plastic parts that make them junk. The reticle that stays very sharp and black, and visible in all light is a bonus also. I don't seem to have that luxery in my Nikon. Sorry to rant. I'm tired of the plastic turret cap talk.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 22:46
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Tell us how you really feel.Poker
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 22:47
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/27/2008 at 22:58
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Get some Jason!!!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 08:28
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You're right, the plastic turret caps and dials are not a deal breaker I will say - as long as they work and they have for me.  Sure didn't sell my old Conquest because of this, it just went with the rifle as a package deal.  +1 on the great Z-plex reticle.  The Nikoplex at a store glance looked real good, almost as good as a Conquest.  I'm just trying to convince myself somehow to pass over a proven winner in the Zeiss.  And if I do I am thinking it would be Nikon's new Monarch.  The Nikon just intrigues me for some reason.

Oh yeah, the first Rem mountain rifle I bought in 94 or so I was presuaded by the dealer to go with a .270 because of the heavy recoil reported with the .30-06 mountain rifles and it made sense.  At the time the dealer didn't have any .280's but that would of worked too, I think the .280 really took off around then but I could be wrong.  Anyway that .270 shot great, killed quite a few whitetails with her and it didn't break your shoulder.  Sold that one awhile ago, regretted it almost immediately. So I finally got the funds to look to replace that original .270.  They did make a 7mm-08, in the mountain rifle, nice round, and I have used a Model 7 .308.  This was a great little rifle.  The model 7 is nice but I like the fit and feel of the mountain rifle for me anyway.  Don't like the LSS, although very practical, I wanted a walnut,blued version.  All I could come up with was a very nice, .30-06 sitting on the rack just down the road and I made all kinds of calls, everyone saying they didn't have anymore and they couldn't get one from their distributors.. I even called Remington and they said maybe in the future they'll make another batch, but they don't show up in the catalog for 2008, maybe 2009 the lady told me... blah, blah, blah but I've had a few .30-06's and they did good, nothing special, but nothing to complain about.  So that's how that went.  Will either of these two scopes hold up, I don't see why not, I would hope so anyway.
 
Great forum.
 
BadgerRed
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 11:35
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I'd take a Zeiss over the Monarch all day long.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 13:19
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Originally posted by lucytuma lucytuma wrote:

I'd take a Zeiss over the Monarch all day long.
 
So would I.  I was just pointing out the Zeiss is not better in EVERY way IMO.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 13:26
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Originally posted by lucytuma lucytuma wrote:

I'd take a Zeiss over the Monarch all day long.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 13:30
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 14:25
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Originally posted by Horsemany Horsemany wrote:

Tell us how you really feel.Poker
 
Sorry, was fighting with the Mrs. when I wrote that. My apologies to out to Horsemany, as this looked like a personnal attack on you. I assure you I didn't intend it to be so. I may have let some agression move from one discussion to the next.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 14:32
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Originally posted by trigger29 trigger29 wrote:

Originally posted by Horsemany Horsemany wrote:

Tell us how you really feel.Poker
 
Sorry, was fighting with the Mrs. when I wrote that. My apologies to out to Horsemany, as this looked like a personnal attack on you. I assure you I didn't intend it to be so. I may have let some agression move from one discussion to the next.


Shame on you, trigger!

Now drop and give me twenty! (if you do not feel like doing twenty pushups, I respond well to monetary motivation, i.e. bribesBig Smile).

On a more serious note, I could be wrong of course, but I got an impression that Horsemany has sufficiently thick skin and good enough sense of humor to get through this horrifying experience without too much damageCool)

ILya


Edited by koshkin - December/28/2008 at 14:32
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 14:33
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its the plastic turrets not the caps!!!!!!!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 14:43
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Originally posted by trigger29 trigger29 wrote:

Originally posted by Horsemany Horsemany wrote:

Tell us how you really feel.Poker
 
Sorry, was fighting with the Mrs. when I wrote that. My apologies to out to Horsemany, as this looked like a personnal attack on you. I assure you I didn't intend it to be so. I may have let some agression move from one discussion to the next.
 
No worries, we've all been there.  Hopefully we can put it behind us by turning prairie dogs into red clouds of mist in July.Sharp Shooter


Edited by Horsemany - December/28/2008 at 14:45
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 14:50
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Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

its the plastic turrets not the caps!!!!!!!

 
I had to go check and I'd never noticed before.  I did notice mine have very tight clicks.  It's almost so stiff you wrench on it to move, and then it'll go 3 or 4 clicks at once.  Are others that way too or just my 2?  Mine are probably the crappiest clicks of any scope I have that has clicks.  Don't get me wrong I like the scopes they're just not perfect.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 15:04
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Why do you ever need to put the caps back on in a hurry?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2008 at 18:51
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cap bandit.
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