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Re-barrelled and re-scoped

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/19/2007 at 12:40
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I am back in action! After 6 months my Sako has finally been returned safely to me. Or what is left of it. I have taken a Sako Finnbear and restocked it. I have now also rebarrelled it with a 26 inch and 0.68 inch  thick (17mm) barrel. I have bought the Leupold Quick Detach mounts and set it up with a Leupold 8,5x25 and a Leupold 3,5x10.

Unfortunately it is pouring buckets, so unless I don a wetsuit and flippers, there is no way I can shoot this combo today.

I intend shooting the QR mounts to test them for holding zero, test the barrel and test the loads. Shoot, shoot and more shoot!! Cannot wait and will keep everyone posted of the new barrel and set-up.

 

New rifle barrel

 

 

8,5X25

 

 

3,5x10

 

 

QR Mounts

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/19/2007 at 14:26
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What "flavor" did you get it rebarrel into? Who redid it?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/19/2007 at 14:40
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The barrel was done by a local South African company. He originally advertised as Craig Klintworth custom rifles. The barrel was actually stamped under his company name Mkonto Manufacturing. Those into politics will know Mkonto Isizwe was the armed wing of the ANC (Nelson Mandela) which stood for Spear of the Nation.

So I now have a spear for a barrel! Not to proud of that one.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2007 at 15:16
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Well, finally the weather has cleared and I managed to get to the range. During shooting in, Leupold mount disaster struck. With my scope setting maxed out, I was still shooting 5 inches low at 25m. That is 40 inches at 100m!! Upon closer inspection it became apparent that the rear mount is about 4mm (sorry we are metric) lower then the front mount. So I went to a nearby hardware store and bought a pair of scissors and a can of Coke. I cut shims from the Coke can. It took 14 layers to level it out!! After re-centering my scope setting, a test shot reveiled I now shot only 4 inches low. Another 2 shots and I was zeroed. My biggest fear was that I would be off-centre, as the mounts have no windage adjustments. But the scope was allmost dead centre on the vertical line.

I then shot 61greins of Somchem S365 behind a 180gr Hornady A-Max, which produced a 1,5 inch grouping. But another problem manifested itself. There was a disticnt hang-fire feeling. The firing pin sounded all mushy.

Despite this I fired 62g, 64g and 65g of powder. The shots progressively opened up with each increment of powder, with it ending on allmost 3 and 3/4 inch grouping. But the mushy firing pin was getting to me.

The heavier barrel I had fitted felt good, with recoil a lot less then I was used to.

Upon returning home I took the rifle to my gunsmith. We dismantled the bolt and found the firing pin and housing caked in a grease like substance, probably old gun-oil that has hardened. We cleaned it out and it breaks cleanly now.

I have also replaced the Coke shims with 4 layers of milk bottel plastic. I will see if I can get a brass shim made up.

Any ideas on the shims??

I will again shoot tomorrow with the cleaner firing pin and a slightly better shim job.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2007 at 18:35
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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www.brownells.com  a shim for any season
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2007 at 22:54
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Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

www.brownells.com  a shim for any season

 

Yea and a six month wait in RSA...

 

Your rings are not mounted "backwards" with the front on the rear?  Basic brass shim stock... A machinist supply house is your friend!!!  Next best is a big auto parts company.  If you do not have a set already, get a good pair of dial calipers.  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2007 at 02:00
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Thanks for the replies. Both the rings are the same height and can only fit one way into the QR base, so no apparent screw-up on my part.

Yes, Brownells is a longggg way from here!

I will have to have a shim made up by a machinist.

Will keep you posted.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2007 at 09:17
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Round two. The first round went to the rifle, the second round belongs to me! Firstly the scope seems to hold up with the milk bottel shims. Secondly the rifle barrel does not like being cleaned to often as the first 5 shots are a bit wild and then settles down for the next 5. Thirdly the barrel likes the lowest reloading charge. Unfortunately I have not been able to do any chronograph work. Just to much to do all at once.

 

On 61 gr I had one flyer and four shots all touching. On 63 gr things opened up a bit, but I am also fighting a trigger with a heavy pull. I have adjusted it for round three, but apparently the Sako cannot be adjusted below 1,2 lbs.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 



Edited by 8shots
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2007 at 20:19
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A big part of me says to run a couple hundred patchs with some J-B bore paste down the tube.  Get a brush for a .270 and have at it.  Every thing else in me says that there was not enough "vodoo" used in the making of the barrel. It sounds like thermal problems.which could be from lots of things... from the action, to the chambering, but most likely the tube itself.  If things start shifting in one direction then the blank could have been straightened.

 

Did the guy grind a reamer for the bullet you are using or did you just get some generic throat?  What twist is the barrel?

 

But hey this is mostly a target rifle so you do not need to be cranking in lots of powder.  All that does is eat the throat.

 

I think that switching powders might be interesting. Seating depth may be interesting too.   

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2007 at 05:34
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Silver, thanks for your comments. My local gunsmith was also leaning towards rubbing compound. I doubt if any gunshop would have bore-paste. I assume it is the same as fine rubbing compound?

From my experience with the barrel maker I would agree with you on the "voodoo" part. Allthough he came highly recommended he did not come through in my opinion. So I would say no love or craftmanship went into the making. He used a generic throat.

The rifle is intended for 50% hunting and 50% target shooting, so velocity is definately going to come into play.

For now I have picked up a serious snag with the trigger. I have tried adjusting it but it pulls like a dog. This mornings session was a dissapointment, but I the rear mount over the shims were not tight, which I think caused an impact shift. And then the trigger is a BIG issue. The rifle is going to the gunsmith for him to file down the shear angles so that we can get a lower pull weight. Groupings, all with 61g, varied from 1inch to 3inches at 100m

The barrel seems to do its job, and with all the other issues I cannot say anything negative about the barrel as yet. Previously the same rifle, with a shot out barrel, was shooting all over (as in 12inch shotgun spray). So none of the other issues showed itself. At the time I used fixed steel mounts for the scope.

The jury is still out on the Leupold QR mounts, but so far I am leaning to say they are not "made with precision" as Leupold claims.

I appreciate all input on this thread, and hopefully some-one else going through or thinking of the same will learn something.

My next shoot will only be on Sat or Sunday, due to the trigger work that has to be done.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2007 at 10:36
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http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=6644&PN=1

sure to read these before too much lapping. when using the QR rings loosen and re-tighten about a 100 times before so as to "wear" down the high pts.,

most barrels show a "jumping" around when new up to a 100 rds or so then start to become more accurate until starting their spread at some point --so don't become to disappointed during the first few work ups.

is the trigger breaking clean?? or drag?? you mentioned problems with fireing pin, make sure the sear release drop to the firepin is not the problem-- before adjustment to the primary trigger sear.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2007 at 11:15
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Dale,Thanks for reply. I have read a fair amount about lapping and personally I would hesitate to do it. It would be one of the last things I would do if all else fails.

So far I have followed the following procedure:

Fired three rounds and cleaned reasonably well.

I repeated this three rounds four times.

Then I fired ten rounds and cleaned less intensly.

This I did twice.

Lastly I fired twenty rounds followed by a light clean. By this I mean that I am more trying to dissolve and remove carbon and powder fouling and less copper.

The trigger breaks cleanly, but one has to exert a lot of pressure to get it to break. So much that one becomes very conscious of pulling the trigger. No way one can be accurate/repetitive with this trigger.

I am taking the rifle to a proffesional gunsmith to do the trigger work as I realise it cannot be a half-assed job.

Thanks for the tip on the QR mounts. I will work at it

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/24/2007 at 16:08
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Hmmm... If you do not have J-B Bore paste (its is gun cleaning compound) I would think about useing some tooth paste. If need be chase it with some brake cleaner.  The main thing about any break in, is the getting ride of the smallest left over tool marks.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/25/2007 at 03:43
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Silver, one of the concerns I read about is that if done incorrectly, lapping or using paste in the bore can remove the sharp edges of the rifling. This would be my major concern and why I hesitate about doing this.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/27/2007 at 10:10
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Round 4 and I have now allready pushed 70 rounds through the barrel. This shoot was rounds 71 to 90. I would say the barrel shows promise. The trigger adjustment was a disappointment. Allthough better, it is still breaking at 3,08 lbs. I am not steady on the pull and anticipate the break. A nice recipe for flinching.

I am considering a replacement trigger. Timney is about all I think we will have in South Africa, but I will shop around.

The point of impact shift is due to scope adjustment.

 

 



Edited by 8shots
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/28/2007 at 09:32
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I have taken the rifle to a Sako gunsmith today. The trigger is pulling on 3 lbs. There are problems, with the backlash screw missing. He is going to install a new sear kit and will bring the pull down to 2lbs.

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/03/2007 at 09:29
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Ok, the gunsmith has had a go and could only bring the trigger down to 2,5lbs. The trigger did not hold this setting and feels like 60 grit sandpaper. It will have to be replaced.

I have also had the shims made up and now have a more solid scope set-up.

I sighted the scope in and could only get a resemblance of a grouping going, but I blame it all on trigger pull.

Lastly I removed the scope, and replaced it again to test return to zero.

I show the shim and the two targets. One was fired before removing the scope, and the second one after removing and replacing the scope. I also placed the two targets one on top of the other and used a pen to trace the 11 bullet holes. Did it return to zero? I would say so, but you be the judge.

I will also not post any more shooting targets untill I have the trigger replaced as I think the excercise has hit a serious snag.

 



Edited by 8shots
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/04/2007 at 10:40
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why didn't the smith just do base shims?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/04/2007 at 10:53
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These shims were in fact made by my brother who is a tool maker. The reason for the ring insert is that the Sako Action has dovetail mounts. In my humble opinion the mounts cannot be raised off the dovetail, or am i missing something? Secondly the rings are Quick Release and the ringbase cannot be raised either. The only option I saw was to shim the inside of the ring itself.



Edited by 8shots
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/04/2007 at 11:16
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why can't the bases be shimed? (raised)  guessing here that the pins into the bases would no longer be perpendicular.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/05/2007 at 03:24
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That may be an option, but I was concerned that the pins would no longer lock snugly into the base and thereby effect the repeatability of the mounts. The other concern is that the bell of the objective lens barely clears the barrel. I would have to raise the rear and drop the front. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/05/2007 at 10:17
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Shim bases on one and carefully recontour just one end of the rear (I think your trying to push, poi down) or get the gunsmith's Leo's and hand fit them.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/05/2007 at 11:05
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Thanks Dale, I'll talk to a a more engineer-minded person then myself and see if he can machine something that may work.

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