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Help me decide between SS and XTR II or ??

Printed From: OpticsTalk by SWFA, Inc.
Category: Scopes
Forum Name: Target
Forum Description: Paper punchin' scopes
Printed Date: January/23/2019 at 09:55

Topic: Help me decide between SS and XTR II or ??
Posted By: g3gtsboy
Subject: Help me decide between SS and XTR II or ??
Date Posted: September/13/2014 at 11:14
Hello OT

I'm new to the forum, enjoying it so far. I've done some reading but not finding exactly the answers I'm looking for.  I'd like to try to work my way out to 1000yds with a 700 sps .308.  Currently I have a Burris Fullfield E1 3-9x 40 on one of my 5.56 AR's and in my opinion the optics are very clear, turrets are a little mushy but they get the job done. I've only shot it a few times at 100yds but it's kept zero, for the price and weight it's hard to beat.  Magnification is good, the reticle is a little thick, but this thing has great clarity and decent eye relief.  I'm 43 and my eyes are not what they used to be so I like the extra magnification.  

From most of the SS 3-15x and 10x reviews I've seen everyone loves the durability and tracking but it always has the caveat that they are not the best glass in the world.  Unfortunately I have not seen a clarity comparison to other optics, so I don't know where this glass falls in.  Essentially, the overall opinion is that they are pretty good glass for a 'budget' scope.  So question is.. more or less clarity than Burris glass?  Typical use will probably be bench and field shooting and I take care of my equipment so I'm not sure I need milspec durability in exchange for less than optimal glass clarity.  However I will need top notch tracking for my project and I'd like to keep thanks simple.  

So my requirements are, mil/mil or moa/moa reticle and turrets, substantial magnification, reliable tracking, ample adjustment for long range shooting, bright clear glass even at max magnification.

$299 SS 10X 30mm, 21oz, mil/mil adj, FFP 100+MOA adjustment, no zero stop 4" ER (fixed I assume)
 Lifetime Warranty??  It's a bargain, I could keep some money in my bank account and for this price I could afford to buy twice if it's not quite the right scope for me.

$699 SS 3-15x 30mm, 24oz, mil/mil adj, FFP 100+MOA adjustment, no zero stop 3.8 - 4.2 ER  Lifetime Warranty??

$999 Burris 3-15x 34mm, 31oz, mil/mil adj, FFP 110 MOA, zero stop, illuminated. 3.5 - 4.25 ER, slightly ore FOV but negligible.  I'm familiar with Burris brightness / clarity.  Forever Warranty.

Are there other optics I should consider in this broad price range?  The Burris is really over budget for me so $1000 is the absolute most I can spend on this project.  I do subscribe to buy once, cry once.

Extra mounting costs (34mm)?  Do I really need a 20moa canted mount with 100+ MOA?  I'd like to keep the scope as low as possible.   Weight is always a factor as well but is not critical because I'm not going to be humping this thing everywhere. 

Issues?  Turret slipping on the SS, This Burris seems to have a similar system so I suspect it could be prone to similar issues.

Does anyone know where I take a look at the SS scopes anywhere (Gander, Cabelas, etc.) so that I can see the clarity first hand?  Does anyone have first hand experience with both the SS 3-15 and the Burris XTR 3-15?

Posted By: g3gtsboy
Date Posted: September/13/2014 at 21:47
Well as luck would have it I got to check out a SS 10x tonight at the range just as I was leaving.  The range was closing and It was dusk (around 8pm DFW) and a guy I was talking to during a cease fire just happened to have one on his rifle.  I just have to say... Impressive!  I'm a novice but it seemed very bright and clear, the reticle looked great.  I'm now thinking I'm just going to save the money and pick up the 10x SWFA side focus. 

Posted By: stickbow46
Date Posted: October/15/2014 at 17:55
Welcome to the OT!
Good choice,the 10X is a great scope but if your eyes are getting older you might want to look at the SS 3-15,it will give you a little more clarity out @ 1K yds.In any event you can't go wrong with any of the Super Snipers....Ernie

Pearls of Wisdom are Heard not Spoken

Posted By: sucker76
Date Posted: October/15/2014 at 20:43
I am middle aged and have terrible eyes. I have the SS3-15 on my 30-06 and love it.

Posted By: sucker76
Date Posted: October/15/2014 at 20:57
My only Burris to compare was a 1-4 tac30.  I'm not sure that was the best but the clarity was just about the same with the SS set to the same powers. Note though I looked through them on different days. 

Posted By: malinoisrock
Date Posted: December/03/2014 at 01:08
A long time ago a friend of mine had a 7mm stw built with a straight 30" bull barrel.  He bought a SFWA 10x side focus on my advise and we proceeded to Raton.  He had it zeroed at 100.  He wanted to start at 1000 at asked me how much to come up.  I forget what I told him but it was a pretty good guess because he proceeded to put ten shots into the old f/ palma x.  When we went down to the pits he looked at me and said "why does everone say this is so hard".  My target shot with a valdada and .308 did not have 10 holes in the x ring.  Then the wind came up and he got a clue.  If I remember he paid $400 for that scope fifteen years ago.  They are still $400 so that tells you something about what a even greater value they remain. 

So try "my hand at 1000" can mean a lot of different things.  I havnt shot at 1000 in a long time.  nowadays I mostly shoot a couple shots at much smaller distances.  Pup gets to come I get a some exercise and its generally a good time.  Part of that good time is the experience of good glass.  Yup the non hd 10x works at 1000.  So does a bushy 1040 10x with a 20moa mount.

If I was in the market for a 10x I would sell whatever I needed to to get the HD10x.  Im not a wealthy man, but this is my recreation time.  This is my relaxation time.  I generally hit what I shoot at and enjoy it but its about the process not the result.

If try my hand at 1000 means your going to be doing it for a while and shooting F theres a small problem.  10x is not enough mag. If you are shooting steel at 1000 10x is really not enough mag.  The new F target is awful small.  These steel courses are awfully small.  The nuances of the mirage that will let you dope the wind are much more discernable at 20x+.  Theres not a viable 20x+ fixed that has the glass of the swfa 10xhd. Perhaps im not informed nowadays. A fixed 36x is going to hurt you when the mirage comes up wierd thick and funky and you cant dial down.
Good glass helps score but its not necessary for score.  Walk down the line in a 1000yd shoot. The majority are using a very well made brand that tracks perfectly.  It has good not great glass.  Its been a while things have probably changed

So for me if I was going to give 1000 a serious try that would mean a SWFA5x20hd or a 5x20 800xx weaver.  But thats me.  If had to keep my budget down I would go with the 10x hd.  Id cut back on something else so i could peer through it. But thats me.  the 10x hd is a lifetime scope you will always find a use for it.  If you make the mistake of selling it you will miss it.  The old discontinued sightron  SII 24x 1"with the front adjustable objective gets to 1000 easily with a 20moa base. It will get to 1000 with a 0moa base.    It had/has a amazing amount of eye relief and a good eyebox. It was and is a good tool to shoot for score-and learn- on the cheap. Its certainly not the brick house that a HD or non HD ss 10x is.  Nothing wrong with getting in the game.  Dot reticle.  If you are shooting at paper a fixed point to shoot off of is nice.  Its simple.  You get good trigger breaks. The feedback a dot gives you in relationship to your observation of conditions and your dope is not distorted by multiple aiming points so as a learning tool for conditions it has value.  You shoot faster and conditions change less.  No the very best  pros dont chase the spotter but you will be as a beginner.  That spotter is your teacher.  That spotter is why paper will teach you more than steel ever will.  The target rings, the targets  space to the edge of the target and in rare cases the space to your neighbors target replaces a reticle grid.  Or dial a couple minutes in and stay on the target rings. The sightron old 24x can be found.  Now if you want to familiarize shooting off a reticle grid thats fine too.  Theres certainly a good argument for starting with and sticking to mil mil. It takes a long time to wean of of minutes if you learn off of them.  Everyone ends up mil mil in the end.  Fighting mil milis like fighting king kong.    The F target is inherently a minute based target so using it as a grid does have disadvantages.  They wont let you mark mils on it. Clown Its all about defining your goals.  My goals are getting me and the pup some exercise and enjoying my spare time. Wink Its all about the process not the result for me.  I find it absolutely incredible that I get to experience these high quality optics.  We are truly blessed. 

Posted By: fister30
Date Posted: December/28/2014 at 02:00
I am looking at the SS 3-15X42 classic and the HD SS 10X.  Is the difference between the HD and the classic the difference of chromatic and apochromatic lens?  The site for SWFA doesn't go into that kind of detail from what I seen.

90% paper/metal targets ranges from 200-1000K meters but mostly between 300-750.  The prices of these two scopes are in my range.  

Most of what I read, the SS scopes are the most bang for the buck.      

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