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what do you really have to spend for true quality?

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Category: Scopes
Forum Name: Rifle Scopes
Forum Description: Centerfire long gun scopes
URL: http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=24145
Printed Date: October/22/2018 at 03:38
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Topic: what do you really have to spend for true quality?
Posted By: REP
Subject: what do you really have to spend for true quality?
Date Posted: July/03/2010 at 22:09
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Replies:
Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: July/03/2010 at 22:48
ior valdada is about the only one i can think of.
http://swfa.com/IOR-4-14x50-Hunting-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1846.aspx - http://swfa.com/IOR-4-14x50-Hunting-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1846.aspx


-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: jleinum09
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 00:54
From how i see it, you get what you pay for with optics, period.  In most cases a five hundred dollar scope won't have as good eye relief, clarity, or be as bright in low light conditions Compared to a more expensive scope.  If you can afford a high end scope like Schmidt and Bender, Swarovski, Zeiss, etc. then definitely do it. If you are looking at spending less than 1500, i would wither go with the Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44 with the rapid z reticle.  I strongly suggest it since it sounds like you want to get long range performance out of your gun.  A Leupold Vari x3 would also be a good choice, it has a good bang for the buck.  

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One Shot, One Kill


Posted By: jleinum09
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 00:57
Oh, and another great scope would be the Trijicon 5-20x50 if you would like an illuminated reticle.   Excellent for low light conditions.  Would suggest the green mil dot reticle ! It is superb for the price. By the way, welcome to OT!!

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One Shot, One Kill


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 06:45
Originally posted by jleinum09 jleinum09 wrote:

Oh, and another great scope would be the Trijicon 5-20x50 if you would like an illuminated reticle.   Excellent for low light conditions.  Would suggest the green mil dot reticle ! It is superb for the price. By the way, welcome to OT!!


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Posted By: stickbow46
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 07:33
Welcome to OT.Swaro Z5,Zeiss or Trijicon.Cant'go wrong with any of the three!

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Pearls of Wisdom are Heard not Spoken


Posted By: billyburl2
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 07:42
With your goal of 1000yds, the  Trijicon,is doable but iffy. I believe it only has 50 MOA of internal adjustment. The Sightron Big Sky III scopes get very good reviews for having glass quality at there price point.
  As far as value versus features though, it is really hard to beat the S.S. 3-9x42. It is a first focal plane scope, with mil adjustment that match the mil-dot reticle. Glass quality is rated very high by most reviewers (I don't own one).
  While not quite the magnification range you wanted the S.S. does  all you stated, and does it well.
 
http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-9x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P41044.aspx">SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope http://swfa.com/images/ss_mildot_popup.jpg">Mil-Dot http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-9x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P41044.aspx - SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope
Stock # - SS39X42
  • Matte
  • First Focal Plane Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • OK for .50 cal
  • 0.1 MRAD
$599.95


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If it is tourist season, why can't we shoot them?


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 08:08
Originally posted by billyburl2 billyburl2 wrote:

With your goal of 1000yds, the  Trijicon,is doable but iffy. I believe it only has 50 MOA of internal adjustment. The Sightron Big Sky III scopes get very good reviews for having glass quality at there price point.
  As far as value versus features though, it is really hard to beat the S.S. 3-9x42. It is a first focal plane scope, with mil adjustment that match the mil-dot reticle. Glass quality is rated very high by most reviewers (I don't own one).
  While not quite the magnification range you wanted the S.S. does  all you stated, and does it well.
 
http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-9x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P41044.aspx">SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope http://swfa.com/images/ss_mildot_popup.jpg">Mil-Dot http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-9x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P41044.aspx - SWFA SS 3-9x42 Tactical Riflescope
Stock # - SS39X42
  • Matte
  • First Focal Plane Mil-Dot
  • 30mm
  • OK for .50 cal
  • 0.1 MRAD
$599.95

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Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 08:32
For an All around scope.
Here is a review of the scope I would recommend
http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15017 -  http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15017

here is the link to the actual scope.

http://swfa.com/Bushnell-25-16x42-Elite-6500-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P13139.asp - http://swfa.com/Bushnell-25-16x42-Elite-6500-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P13139.asp


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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 10:20
Originally posted by Steelbenz Steelbenz wrote:

For an All around scope.
Here is a review of the scope I would recommend
http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15017 -  http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=15017

here is the link to the actual scope.

http://swfa.com/Bushnell-25-16x42-Elite-6500-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P13139.asp - http://swfa.com/Bushnell-25-16x42-Elite-6500-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P13139.asp



Thank you I enjoyed the review. I would really value your input on my new Zeiss line post titled Made to order Zeiss? Thanks again, REP


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 11:22
just so we are clear the zeiss conquest doesnt come in a 30mm tube, its 1" only.

-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: RifleDude
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 12:37
...except for the 3-12X56 Conquest...

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx


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Ted


Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle.


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 12:50
Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

just so we are clear the zeiss conquest doesnt come in a 30mm tube, its 1" only.


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Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 13:00
Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

...except for the 3-12X56 Conquest...

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx


WOW now we are getting somewhere this scope is in my price range, meets the focal desires etc.. Can you get it in the no.4 with high knobs? 


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 13:22
Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

...except for the 3-12X56 Conquest...

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx

ok sorry i should of said they dont have a 4.5x14x50 in a 30mm which is what he said he was looking for.Embarrased


-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: oldguy
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 15:30
I'm sure many will disagree but I find it difficult to judge any product based on price in today's global economy, brand names are just that and don't carry the respect they once did.
 
I've seen scopes that cost 700-800 bucks not as clear glass as those 300-400, it all depends on what you need,how much you want to spend, do you take care of your tools or prefer to just toss them around. Opinions of scopes on all forums are as varied as guns. I suggest going to as many shops as you can and check each brand out in person.


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 18:46
Originally posted by oldguy oldguy wrote:

I'm sure many will disagree but I find it difficult to judge any product based on price in today's global economy, brand names are just that and don't carry the respect they once did.
 
I've seen scopes that cost 700-800 bucks not as clear glass as those 300-400, it all depends on what you need,how much you want to spend, do you take care of your tools or prefer to just toss them around. Opinions of scopes on all forums are as varied as guns. I suggest going to as many shops as you can and check each brand out in person.


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Enough is to much.


Posted By: RifleDude
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 19:15
Originally posted by REP REP wrote:

Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

...except for the 3-12X56 Conquest...

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx


WOW now we are getting somewhere this scope is in my price range, meets the focal desires etc.. Can you get it in the no.4 with high knobs? 


No, the #8 is the only reticle available in this scope, and it isn't available with high target / tactical turrets.

Why are you so insistent on a 30mm main tube and tall turrets?  The only advantage the 30mm tube offers (besides the fact that the super premium scope manufacturers lavish their best technology in their 30mm models) is more elevation adjustment potential (not all 30mm scopes actually have more adjustment range than 1" scopes) and greater power zoom range.  If you don't plan to use the scope for super long range shooting, you don't need a 30mm (or larger) tube.  Tall turrets are not necessary for typical big game hunting, where the vast majority of your shot opportunities are less than 400 yards.  In most hunting situations, they are actually a liability, because they get in the way of gun cases, scabbards, hang up on stuff.  With some designs, they can easily be rotated away from zero through use if you're not careful.  For half the price of the high end 30mm scopes, you have quite a few superb 1" scopes to choose from, the Conquest being one of them.


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Ted


Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle.


Posted By: RifleDude
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 19:31
Originally posted by REP REP wrote:

file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CR34F4%7E1.PEA%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cmsohtmlclip1%5C01%5Cclip_colorschememapping.xml - ...I have no idea of what’s out there and when you are paying for hype with a good advertizing budget or real quality. This is where I am now hoping to learn of an offering that is of outstanding quality a real world price. -   -  
The Bushnell Elite 4200 series are very good, high quality scopes, especially for the money.  They are among the best values out there.  They don't quite have the optical performance of the Conquest, but they aren't that far behind really.

The Trijicon Accupoint series are great scopes as well.  They seem to me to be somewhere between Elite 4200 and Conquest class optically.  Plus, they have a very unique, innovative non-electronic illumination system.  I love the Accupoint scopes!  The 3-9X40 and 2.5-10X56 are both superb.  I prefer the 3-9X40 because it is much more compact and has more constant eye relief than the 2.5-10X56, but the latter has better low light performance.

In short, quality begins in the $250 - 300 range and you can get some really superb 1" tube scopes for $500 - $1000.  Most of the really good 30mm scopes start at $1200 and go up from there into the stratosphere.  But, if you plan to use your scope for big game hunting, you really don't need to spend more than $1K to get a very high quality scope.

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Ted


Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle.


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 21:35
Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

Originally posted by REP REP wrote:

Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

...except for the 3-12X56 Conquest...

http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-3-12x56-Conquest-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P1781.aspx


WOW now we are getting somewhere this scope is in my price range, meets the focal desires etc.. Can you get it in the no.4 with high knobs? 


No, the #8 is the only reticle available in this scope, and it isn't available with high target / tactical turrets.

Why are you so insistent on a 30mm main tube and tall turrets?  The only advantage the 30mm tube offers (besides the fact that the super premium scope manufacturers lavish their best technology in their 30mm models) is more elevation adjustment potential (not all 30mm scopes actually have more adjustment range than 1" scopes) and greater power zoom range.  If you don't plan to use the scope for super long range shooting, you don't need a 30mm (or larger) tube.  Tall turrets are not necessary for typical big game hunting, where the vast majority of your shot opportunities are less than 400 yards.  In most hunting situations, they are actually a liability, because they get in the way of gun cases, scabbards, hang up on stuff.  With some designs, they can easily be rotated away from zero through use if you're not careful.  For half the price of the high end 30mm scopes, you have quite a few superb 1" scopes to choose from, the Conquest being one of them.


< ="-" ="text/; =utf-8">< name="ProgId" ="Word.">< name="Generator" ="Microsoft Word 12">< name="Originator" ="Microsoft Word 12">

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Enough is to much.


Posted By: bert gummer
Date Posted: July/04/2010 at 22:18

Here's a thought, If you go to a big cabelas or gander mountain

store they have the scopes mounted so you can get a first hand look

and when you look through them you can see the Quality, When I first

looked through a swarvo and a ziess I knew they were worth the $$
I think the high end leupold and burris are good also......
I think it's great they do this, some others stores may also????????
at least you know what your getting before you buy, also any good
scope manufacture will offer a unlimited lifetime warranty to let
you know they make the best Quality and stand behind it.......
 


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slow is smooth, smooth is fast. right?


Posted By: Alan Robertson
Date Posted: July/05/2010 at 04:34
Might be worth the wait...
http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20674 - http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=20674

For more info, search for Koshkin's (and others) Shot Show review.





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"Garg'n uair dhuisgear"


Posted By: Urimaginaryfrnd
Date Posted: July/05/2010 at 06:33
Viper PST 4–16x50 FFP Riflescope with EBR-1 MRAD Reticle  $849.95 would sound like a possible choice.  A lot of scopes simply dont have enough internal adjustment to get you to 1000 yds. The Leupold VX3 and Mk4 scopes do have quite a bit of adjustment so I would also consider this one:
http://swfa.com/Leupold-65-20x50-VX-3-30mm-Riflescope-P12738.aspx">Leupold 6.5-20x50 VX-3 30mm Riflescope
http://swfa.com/images/leupold_varmint_popup.jpg">Varmint Hunters http://swfa.com/Leupold-65-20x50-VX-3-30mm-Riflescope-P12738.aspx - Leupold 6.5-20x50 VX-3 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - LEU66585
  • Matte
  • Varmint Hunters
  • 30mm
  • Long Range
  • Target Knobs
  • Side Focus
  • Free Sun Shade
  • Xtended Twilight Lens System
$969.95
Another good choice would be:
http://swfa.com/Leupold-45-14x40-Mark-4-LRT-30mm-Riflescope-P2550.aspx">Leupold 4.5-14x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
http://swfa.com/images/leupold_duplex_popup.jpg">Duplex http://swfa.com/Leupold-45-14x40-Mark-4-LRT-30mm-Riflescope-P2550.aspx - Leupold 4.5-14x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - LEU56140
  • Matte
  • Duplex
  • 30mm
  • Long Range
  • Side Focus
  • Target Knobs
$754.95


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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
Bobby Paul Doherty
Texas Ranger


Posted By: REP
Date Posted: July/11/2010 at 07:52
[QUOTE=Urimaginaryfrnd]Viper PST 4–16x50 FFP Riflescope with EBR-1 MRAD Reticle  $849.95 would sound like a possible choice.  A lot of scopes simply dont have enough internal adjustment to get you to 1000 yds. The Leupold VX3 and Mk4 scopes do have quite a bit of adjustment so I would also consider this one:
http://swfa.com/Leupold-65-20x50-VX-3-30mm-Riflescope-P12738.aspx">Leupold 6.5-20x50 VX-3 30mm Riflescope
http://swfa.com/images/leupold_varmint_popup.jpg">Varmint Hunters http://swfa.com/Leupold-65-20x50-VX-3-30mm-Riflescope-P12738.aspx -
$969.95
Another good choice would be:
http://swfa.com/Leupold-45-14x40-Mark-4-LRT-30mm-Riflescope-P2550.aspx">Leupold 4.5-14x40 Mark 4 LR/T 30mm Riflescope
Duplex< ="-" ="text/; =utf-8">< name="ProgId" ="Word.">< name="Generator" ="Microsoft Word 12">< name="Originator" ="Microsoft Word 12">

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Enough is to much.


Posted By: Sgt. D
Date Posted: July/11/2010 at 10:08
Before you spend any money I think you should borrow (if needed) whatever scope you can in the power range you mentioned in your initial post and test it at the longest distance you think you will be shooting. Make a couple of targets to help you decide if that power range is good for you. Find some cardboard or sheet metal that is 30"X30" and paint it white. Then make a 12'X12" square in the center that is black. Make another the same size but make the 30X30 back ground dk green or brown with the black center. Set these up about forty feet apart or enough that you can't see them both together. Now with your 10, 12 or 14 power scope judge what you see and how the cross hairs cover the targets.
Then if you can try it with a 17 or 20 power scope and see how much faster you can aquire the targets. For your budget you can get a scope that will serve you well. IOR builds scopes that track perfectly and have great glass with turrets that are very easy and some good rectiles to choose from. Zeiss is probably the best you will do for glass quality in this price range but, not the Conquest. The Conquest is a great scope but, one major cut for price is the coating quality. If you stay with IOR or Zeiss with the 30mm tubes you will get the adjustment you need plus some. Leupold makes great scopes but, for the specifics you want I would expect to get better service from the Zeiss or IOR. Some will say that going to 17 or 20 power will cost you on close range shooting because 4 or 6 power low end is too much for shots inside 50yds. I disagree. Take any scope and check its clearity on 6 power at 20yds. If the scope isn't junk the pic will be clear. Watch the Samplelist for sales on Zeiss and IOR. And I haven't had one but based on the guys here that have the SS by SWFA should be a serious contender.
Also I recommend staying with a 50mm obj or better. It will not have any serious impact on cheek weld and will offer maxium light for late day shooting. There is some debate on objective size for light transmission but, why have the quality glass/coatings that Zeiss or IOR offers and not give that glass/coatings optimal oppertunity to perform. Here are some to consider. Good luck! Let us know what you go with.
 
A bit over budget but it was on the samplelist.
http://www.samplelist.com/Zeiss-6-24x56-Victory-Diavari-DEMO-B-P222.aspx - http://www.samplelist.com/Zeiss-6-24x56-Victory-Diavari-DEMO-B-P222.aspx
 
These IOR are 35mm tubes but the rings are included. Offered new at SWFA.
http://swfa.com/IOR-6-24x50-Hunting-35mm-Rifle-Scope-P2910.aspx - http://swfa.com/IOR-6-24x50-Hunting-35mm-Rifle-Scope-P2910.aspx
 
The MP-8 rectile is awesome.
http://swfa.com/IOR-6-24x50-Tactical-35mm-Rifle-Scope-P8947.aspx - http://swfa.com/IOR-6-24x50-Tactical-35mm-Rifle-Scope-P8947.aspx
 
Your only hope of getting a Zeiss with turret adj and the power range needed in your budget will be on the samplelist or from a individual sale.
http://swfa.com/Zeiss-6-24x56-Victory-Diavari-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P7752.aspx - http://swfa.com/Zeiss-6-24x56-Victory-Diavari-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P7752.aspx
 
http://www.samplelist.com/ - http://www.samplelist.com/


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Take care of Soldiers, Show em how its done and do it with em, Run to the Fight & and hold your ground! I die my men go home! If you're a NCO and this ain't you. GET OUT! GOD BLESS AMERICA!


Posted By: neilbilly
Date Posted: July/11/2010 at 10:18

Very nice Father's Day present. "I got cards and Jelly Beans" Shocked


With the budget you have I'd buy another rifle as it's a tall order to fill having a scope that you use hunting where you might get a 50 yard shot, and also be able to shoot distance on varmits. 


Just my .02 but I think you can easily do another rifle and 2 scopes for $1500



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If God didn't want me to play with it, he'd of made my arms shorter.



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