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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/01/2007 at 21:58
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Hello everyone,

 

First new post here at OT and I'll try to make it thought inspiring.

 

I need a scope for a 6.5 Grendel AR build I am doing. The rifle will be used at ranges of close quarters (under 25 yds) out to 800+yards. Uses will include paper punching at long range, some hunting (rarely... taht is what my bolt rifles are for!!), and SHTF (indeterminant ranges). Those of you who are aware of the Grendel cartridge know that this fairly lofty goal is achievable from the rifle, so I am looking for an optic to match.

 

Requirements:

 

-30mm (or 35mm??) tube

-At least 80 moa of elevation (though that is not needed for my given yardage with this very flat shooting cartridge, it would be nice if I ever want to go further)

-A magnification range and FOV that will handle the expected yardage (quick sight picture at close range on low power, with enough magnification to get me out to 800+ ...so around least 10x or more on the high)

-Excellent glass

-Milling reticle of some sort

-Could go either way with the illum reticle

-Could go either way with FFP vs. SFP (I've heard and discussed pros and cons of both with Koshkin)

-Not grossly heavy (under 24oz.) so as to keep the rifle easy to carry and truly dual purpose.

 

Some of the current contenders for this app are :

 

IOR 2.5-10x42, 2-12x35, 3-18x42; 

Sightron SIII 3.5-10x44 Mil-Dot (I know, different animal, but sitting in my safe waiting for a home)

 

 

YES, I am interested in quality optics and am willing to fork out up to $1200. 

 

 I'd like to know if you guys have any opinions, other choices, or if you have similar-purpose set-ups that either work or do not work for you (and what optic they are set up with)...

 

Whatever this leads me to, I will be sure to do a comprehensive write-up once I reach a decision.

 

 

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 00:26
koshkin View Drop Down
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As I mentioned elsewhere, I have a IOR 2-12x32 on my 6.5Grendel and I think it is an excellent match. 

All in all, for a versatile cartridge like the Grendel, I think the two IORs: 2-12x32 and 3-18x42 are an excellent fit, and if you want a clearly visible reticle at low magnification, SFP is, IMO, a better way to go.  It really all depends on what is most important to you.  If fast target acquisition is most important and long range shooting is more of "at the range and in god light" thing, I would strongly suggest you also take a look at IOR 1.5-8x26 which has a CQB reticle.  For fast target acquistion, CQB reticle is vastly superior to MP-.

Your Sightron S3 would also be a pretty good choice, and since you alreay have, there is nothing preventing you from trying it out.  You can always replace it with something else later.

Also, if you are willing to give up ona ranging reticle, Trijicon Accupoint 3-9x40 would offer the fastest target acquisition this side of an Eotech.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 02:02
BigDaddy0004 View Drop Down
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Howdy folks,

I've been looking pretty hard at the IOR 3-18x42 myself.

Does anyone think eye relief is an issue on an AR flattop?

Also, which height rings do you use?


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 10:18
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Koshkin, thanks agin for the advice...

1.5-8x26 with the CQB, reticle, huh? That is an interesting idea. I'll check out the specs and see how that may play into this.

 

Have you used the CQB reticle? If so, what are your opinions? It looks like the reticle is designed for .223 trajectory, with corresponding yardage numbers. I wish they hadn't done that, and simply left un-numbered stadia so that you could calibrate it for other calibers without becoming confused under stress and using the wrong holdover because of the number staring back at you. Oh well... mind over matter.

 

I figured I might try out the Sightron on top of the AR when it's done to see if I like it, as you suggested.

The problem is, I'm afraid it may suit me just fine and then I won't have an excuse to buy another scope, especially since the Sightron was originally destined for a Savage .308 tactical build I also have in the works (which I may can altogether since the exterior ballistics of the Grendel are at least as good as 7.62 NATO, with much less recoil). I have been contemplating rebarreling the savage for .260 Rem so I have something that outperforms, instead of equals, the Grendel, and that would be a fine home for the Sightron as well.

 

 

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 10:49
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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might take a quick look at the 2.5x 10 Nightforce and the choice of reticles.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 11:17
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Dale, I was unaware of these particular models.

I really like the looks of the NP-R2 reticle (similar in design to IOR's MP-8) with the stadia divided into 2moa instead of mil spacing. That would make holdover a breeze if you know the moa trajectory of your load.

Do you have any personal experience with these scopes?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 11:22
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Though it would really be ashame to buy something from other than SWFA. Chris has been so good to me and mine over the years that it would make me think twice about purchasing elsewhere (especially after using his forum to discuss it)

 

Hey Chris, is there any reason that SWFA does not carry Nightforce?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 11:40
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Hey Koshkin... as a side note, do you have any comments about the lack of parallax adjustment on the IOR 2.5-10x42 tactical? I assume it is probably set parallax free at 100? Have you used it at long range and, if so, have you encountered any problems with parallax (I understand that most of your parallax problem is encountered between 10-100 yds, but it is also critical to have the most precise sight picture at longer ranges)
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 11:49
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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Yes most of Nightforce stuff-- I use the Np-r2 on an ar---see the post in varmit guns 3.5x15 on an ar10.  I especially like the lack of thick bars at the edge scope field. The Moa hashs save mental conversion between mil at the reticle and moa on the turret. I use a 2.5x10 ch-2 on hunting stuff.and funny one (forget the #) on an 8x32. I use the Np-r2 for center at 400 yds. and the top at about 100, it takes a bit of getting used to , not centering the reticle but works well. Much faster than dial in. But if you need to refine simply add the MOA clicks to the inital holdover-- never have to past 10 MOA dial in and never have to "center down".
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:13
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Right.. and 2moa is a fine enough spacing to be roughly accurate with holdover, assuming your ranging ability is up to snuff and you have calibrated the reticle to your load.

Thanks for another option to ponder.

How is the NP-R2 for swinging on something close range at low power (fast acquisition)?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:24
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Just got off the phone with Ralph at IOR and he recommended the high rings for mounting the 3-18x42 Tactical to an AR's A4 Flattop.

Can anyone here confirm this from actual use?

Thanks for any help.



Edited by BigDaddy0004
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:28
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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The NP is as fast as any and if you want to hold for windage its 5 MOA, althought the ch-2 is faster.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:37
koshkin View Drop Down
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Nightforce makes good stuff.  My only problems with Nightforce scopes are that their reticles (the ones I've seen) are really thin, so I can not acquire them quickly.  They are great for long range shooting though, where you can take your time.  I tried to mess with the illumination to speed up target acquisition, but with that bloody rheostat of theirs I can either set it up to be sufficiently bright for daylight shooting or sufficiently dim for night shooting, but not both.

As for the CQB reticle, I have more experience with the original CQB reticle, that had a thicker donut and was not caliber specific.  I have used the new CQB 223 reticle as well and it is still pretty good, but not as versatile.  It is still useful though if you know reticle dimensions.  You can also contact IOR and ask if they ever made any 1.5-8x26 scopes with the old style CQB reticle.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:40
koshkin View Drop Down
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Originally posted by smitty47 smitty47 wrote:

Hey Koshkin... as a side note, do you have any comments about the lack of parallax adjustment on the IOR 2.5-10x42 tactical? I assume it is probably set parallax free at 100? Have you used it at long range and, if so, have you encountered any problems with parallax (I understand that most of your parallax problem is encountered between 10-100 yds, but it is also critical to have the most precise sight picture at longer ranges)


I did not have a problem with it out to 700 yards.  If there was any parallax induced error, it certainly paled in comparison with my crappy shooting.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/02/2007 at 12:43
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Hahaha....

Well that's an honest answer if I ever heard one.

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/03/2007 at 11:38
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Why dont you have a USOptics SN3  3.2-17 built for it. I know that's over budget but if you can afford a $1200 optic chance is that  you can just go all the way. The Sightron would probably work fine, but if you dont have anything to put it on send it to me I have several rifles waiting for a nice scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/03/2007 at 12:18
smitty47 View Drop Down
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Hi there "my" imaginaryfrnd....

Yeah, I am thinking about looking into the USO's. A purchase like that will DEFINITELY require me to get rid of my Sightron. PM me if you're interested in it and we can talk price.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/03/2007 at 14:46
Dale Clifford View Drop Down
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Unfair to even put USO or S$B in the discussion, no question if you can do it.
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