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Opinions on 4200 1.5-6x36

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 17:01
boliodogs View Drop Down
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I have always just used leupolds scopes but since I joined this forum I am hearing about how good some brands are and want to try some of them out. I still love leupolds. I do not have the knowledge or experience of most of the people on here so I am trying to learn and make good purchases. So far the 4200 scopes have been praised by most and one man told me he likes this 1.5-6x36 on his 45-70. My intended use for this scope would  to hunt bear and boar from close range to 300 yards in good light or poor light. Is this discontinued 1.5-6x36 4200 model   as good as the current 4200 scopes like the 4200 2.5-10x40H  ? What would be a good price for a new bushnell 4200 1.5-6x36?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 17:15
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The only reason the 1.5-6x36 was discontinued was lack of interest from a sales standpoint. If you can find one with the FireFly (heavy duplex) reticle, it's a great scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 17:17
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  If you can find ONE,PLEASE try and find TWO and give me a call!!!!!!!!!!  Bucky
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 17:33
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Thanks for the fast replies I just put this up a few minutes ago. What is a fair price for this scope?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 18:22
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Well if you can locate one, I would think that $350 ish would be a good price. Make sure when ordering that they actually have the scope in stock. Lots of scammer's out there.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/28/2009 at 19:31
boliodogs View Drop Down
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Roy Finn thanks. One place is listing it for 390 is that still reasonable? I can call them tomorrow. I can get the 4200 2.5-10x40 for 362 but I really like that 61.5 f.o.v. at 1.5 power. I would really want both for diferent rifles but I want to get one 4200 first to check it out before buying a second one. I can not find one in the stores. Like everyone I want a good deal.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 03:26
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I've seen them as low as $250. Used as low as $200. Nice scope but kinda heavy and large for the power. I've had 3 of them.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 07:40
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Jetwrnch thanks for the info. I think I will wait for a new one to show up under 300 then. The vx3 1.5-6x32 is less than 11 ounces at 429. I will get one of those for now. I know that is a great scope.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 08:33
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I have the scope with the FireFly reticle.I bought it over 2 years ago for around $350 it was mounted on my 50 T/C Encore and has worked just fine.I would buy this scope again.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 11:01
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I own that very scope with the Firefly reticle. I really like it but as you said it is discontinued. It is just barely smaller and lighter than the 2.5-10x40 model so in my opinion you would be better off just getting the 40mm model. Also, for some reason mine is only comfortably usable down to 2 power, at 1.5 power the eye position is too critical and its hard to get a full view without a blurred edge around the view. I like the heavy plex crosshairs because they stay so black. The wire reticle doesnt reflect light like the other plex reticles because of the Luminecent coating on it. I compared to a Ziess Conquest and the Firefly reticle stayed just as black in low light as the Etched Zeiss reticle. Ive never tried to charge the reticle to make it glow as it stays very easy to see in low light without it. I would say the Leupold with a Heavy Plex is the way to go if size and weight are important. If not just get a 4200 Elite Firefly 2.5-10x40mm. I got mine for $275.00 a few years back and Ive seen some used go for $225.00 but they had the standard plex. I also had one with the standard plex but the reticle would reflect light too much and looked almost transparent so I sold it for $235.00.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 17:19
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Thanks  Randall45 and Dave44. I have a few rifles I want to scope so I will be buying a few more scopes. I have a gunsmith mount my scopes and then  I sight the gun in. Once that is done I leave the scope on the gun. I have decided to stick with vx3 conquests and 4200s. I purchased 2 monarchs and I really like them but I willnot buy another one until I am sure they are a very reliable scope. Some say they are and some say they are not. I saw a conquest 3-9x40 and it was heavy at near 1lb. Other than the weight I liked it. I have never seen the 2.5-8x32 conquest or the 1.8-5.5x38 conquests but both have specs I like although both sound like heavy scopes. As far as scope weight goes for me it depends alot on the gun it is going on. On a heavy rifle a heavy scope isnot so bad. But I will not put a 1lb. scope on my tikka light rifles. I can not find any 4200s in the stores so the only way I am going to see one is to buy one. I have heard so much good about them that I will take Dave44s advice and get a new 2.5-10x40 with the firefly and a vx3 1.75-6x32 with the heavy plex. I own 2 v3s and they are even lighter than the vxllls but with less eye relief  than the vxlll. Dave44 do you like the conquest and how heavy was it comparec to the 4200. Also is it hard to get good sight in groups at 100 yards with the leupold heavy plex at 6 power? Sorry about the endless questions.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 18:05
DAVE44 View Drop Down
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I compared a 3-9x40 Conquest to my 1.5-6x36 Bushnell Elite firefly and in dim light could not tell one was brighter than the other, however the Conquest has a tad bit sharper resoloution making the whole view a bit crisper. That Firefly reticle is very heavy in the outer lines and then steps down to a bit thinner but still heavy and then the center lines are just regular center plex thickness. At first I didnt like it because I had only used regular plex reticles but after I mounted and got used to it it is actually nice to me. Bushnell Elites have a 1 year money back gaurantee if you dont like their scope so your really not risking much there and the Leupolds have very high resale value so if you get a good deal youll probably get all of your money back if you sell. I really liked the Conquests, they are nice scopes. The plex reticle is fairly heavy without being distracting but the inner center plex has very very thin lines. I also had a Burris Sig. Select 1.5-6x40 with Taper plex and I can tell you that the Taper plex in the Burris is exactly the same as the #20 Z-plex (Conquest) to my eye except the inner plex lines are a little thicker which made it better in my opinion for woods hunting. Optically it goes ZEISS CONQUEST, 4200 then Burris to me. Brighness wise they are all pretty equal to me. Dont get me wrong, I like the standard plex reticles and in LEGAL HUNTING LIGHT they are just fine. I just am starting to like how easy it is to find the crosshairs in dark wooded hillsides when the reticle is a bit thicker. Even after sunrise a lot of times Im still in the dark on the back side of the hill covered in trees which block out most of the sun.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 18:58
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Heavy plex Leupolds are very thick
not a great scope for tiny groups

many people prefer German #4, bold horizontal bottom and side and thin middle
that's probably the #1 recommended reticle for low light hunting short of an illuminated reticle

here's a pretty cool tool

http://www.kahlesoptik.com/reticleviewer/index.php


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/29/2009 at 20:14
boliodogs View Drop Down
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Dave44 thanks. I like the conquest 3-9x40  I saw in the store alot. The lower power conquests sound good too. Does the 3-9 have enough field at 3 for close work? Do you have any problems using the 4200 2.5-10 at 2.5? I know the vx3 well and I will not be selling them. I can get the 1.8-5.5x38  and 2.5-8x32 conquests for less money than the 4200. The 3-9x40 conquest costs more but I really want one. So I think I will buy the three ziess scopes first. Perhaps in the mean time I will find a 4200 tolook at. The 4200 sounds like a great scope but so do the conquests.Hard choices for me anyway.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 06:56
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The Conquests are great scopes no doubt about it. I can tell you one thing I noticed about the 3-9x40 Conquest. The #20 Z-plex in the 3-9 x40 model is different than the #20 Z -plex in the 3.5-10x44 or 3-9x50 model. The 44 and 50 models have a wide plex. In other words the heavier outer lines do not come as close to the center of the reticle leaving a wider small plex in the center which to me seems worse for low light. I think the 3-9x40 is the best one but I have not seen the newer low powered models. They even have a fixed 4x32 power Conquest for $300.00 which I would like to try out. Ive heard the 1.8-5.5x38 is a large scope but Ive also heard it is optically very good and perhaps even better than the 3-9x40 model.Im sure the Z plex is the same size in all the low power models and I believe you can even get the German #4 if you want it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 10:06
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The sale scopes both come with the #20 I saw no other options. I can get a 3-9x40 with the german #4. This seems like it would be good in low light and still give a thin area where the crosshars meet. Thanks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 10:29
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Cooker thanks. The heavy plex takes up 1 inch 0n 6 power at 100 yards and that seems like alot to me. I want good groups at 100 yard sight in so I can know pretty close where I should hit at 200 and 300 yards. that german #4 gives you a precise aiming point.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 10:38
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cool, I am with you on that

I have had 2 Zeiss Conquests, a 4.5-14 with Zplex and a 3-9x50 with a G4
the latter seemed to have thicker bars than the Kahles 3-10x50 I have
that's my favorite #4
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 13:39
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Originally posted by ccoker ccoker wrote:

Heavy plex Leupolds are very thick
not a great scope for tiny groups

many people prefer German #4, bold horizontal bottom and side and thin middle
that's probably the #1 recommended reticle for low light hunting short of an illuminated reticle

here's a pretty cool tool

http://www.kahlesoptik.com/reticleviewer/index.php


...............I have the German #4 reticle on my 1.5-5x20 VX111. The crosshair thickness at the reticles thinnest point covers 2.8" @ 100 yards. Great reticle for hunting, but not for the range unless you modify the target.
 
So! I simply change the target to adapt to the thicker reticle. With a black, red, or dark blue felt marker, I draw a 1/4" thick reverse L or a conventional L....I then line up one side of the vertical and horizontal scope crosshairs with the outer edge of the L. It works fine as it gives a consistent point of aim. The color choice of felt marker used on the target should depend on what is the easiest to see. The vertical and horizontal lines on many targets aren`t thick enough to effectively see. That`s why I change it a little using a felt marker to thicken the lines.
 
Trying to equally divide into fours a 4" or 6" circle by the crosshairs, does not give a real consistent aiming point because you have to judge all 4 quarter sections the crosshairs don`t cover for size equality. Too much guess work and an in-consistent point of aim.
 
I find that my groups are just as small using the above method as when I had a 3x9 with the thinner reticles. 
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 14:00
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IMHO- Anything in the 4200 Elite series would serve you VERY WELL.............
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/30/2009 at 17:20
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I ordered a zeiss 2.5-8x32 the z plex was my only choice but I think it is ok. I am still interested in 4200s but I wanted to get the zeiss scopes while the price was right. It seems the german #4 is quite different from brand to brand. On my monarch african the crosshairs arethin where they meet.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/01/2009 at 10:06
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I have a 1.5-6x 4200 with Firefly on my .338 FN Mauser, which is a pretty light rifle so I don't mind the weight. With the scope it weighs 8 pounds 1 ounce, which some would say is still a little TOO light for a .338. I picked the scope on the Internet, in a straight trade for another scope (different brand) that I bought used for $250. So there are some good deals out there.
 
For many years I used a 1.5-6x Bausch & Lomb Balvar made in Japan in the same factory where the 4200's are made. It was a great scope and very tough, it's only fault somewhat mushy adjustments. The 4200's are better in that respect. The B&L only weighed 12.5 ounces, though, and I don't know why but after that they just kept increasing the weight of the same basic model through various name-changes.
 
You can shoot very small groups even with a relatively thick-center reticle simply using a bigger aiming point than most printed targets provide. My preference is for a white-centered diamond about 4" on a side. This allows the reticle to be precisely centered in the middle of the diamond, and very small groups can be shot--while still taking advantage of the thicker reticle for aiming when hunting.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2009 at 10:50
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John Barsness thanks for the great information. I got your book   Optics for the Hunter  in the mail a few days ago. I have been enjoying it and learning from it. This book has answered a lot of questions for me. Have you weighed any 4200 scopes and if you have what did they weigh? The reason I ask is I have found catalog scope weights to often be lighter than t  he real weight. Leupold scopes have always weighed the same or less than advertised but most other brands have weighed in heavy. I am 65 and I do not drive at night. If I read your book right my old eyes only need a 4.0 exit pupil for maximum low light performance. I am thinking of getting the xv3 1,75-6x32 or the vxlll same power. Either of these scopes are much lighter than the 4200. I was thinking about the vxlll because the vx3s seem to have less eye relief than the vxlll and the vxlll is cheaper. So as good as the 4200 1.5-6x36 is it seems like the vxlll is better for me. How is the eye relief on the newer 4200s. If I get a 4200 it will be the 2.5-10x40 that weighs the same as the 4200 1.5-6x36 and gives me a 4.0 exit pupil at10 power. Have you tested the conquest 1.8-5.5x38 ? I have seen this scope listed at 14.4 ounces and elsewhere at 18 ounces. Sorry for all these questions but I can not find these scopes in the stores to look at myself. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2009 at 16:15
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Glad you like the book! From what you say, my guess would also be that an exit pupil of 4mm is about the most you can use effectively.

The eye relief on all 4200's tends to be shorter than in the equivalent Leupold. Whether or not this matters depends not just on the rifle but your own shooting style. I have a buddy who gets whacked by scopes every year, even scopes with long eye relief, because he "crawls" the stock.  (I also suspect it's because he is taller than average but has never used anything but factory-length stocks.) But Leupold do provide better eye relief than most other scopes in their price range, one exception being Zeiss Conquests.

I haven't tested a 1.8-5.5 Conquest, having only tested Conquests from 3-9x up. All of those have weighed what Zeiss claimed, however. If you like a lightweight scope then Leupold is among the lightest.

Personally, I've always found the VX-III optics more than enough for the standard American hunting hours of 1/2 hour before sunrise to 1/2 hour after sunset, but the VX-3's are a little better. The eye relief on the V-X-3's is a litlte shorter than on the VX-III's but in my experience it also varies less from low to high X than on VX-3's. I have tested three different VX-3's now (two 3.5-10's and one 2.5-8x) and eye relief varied .4 inch or less  on all three. This  is less than the Lerupold specs call for, but I have been told by the Leupold people that their listed specs are maximum, so often individual scopes vary less. This has been my experience in when testing them.
 
You really couldn't go wrong with any of the choices you're looking at. I have used all three brands with generally excellent results. So I'd make the choice based on what features are most important to you.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2009 at 22:23
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John Barsness thanks for answering all my questions and helping me out. Thanks also to the other forum members for the good advice. When I was 19 I shot a 378 at a sable antelope. It broke my glasses in half and gave me a cut eye. It did drop the sable in his tracks. I have never been hit by a scope again because I use scopes  with good eye relief mounted well forward and do  not get my head to close to the scope. The Conquest 3-9 I saw in the store had very long eye relief at both 3 and 9 power. I liked that. The f.o.v. seemed pretty good at 3 power. Are you still writing for handloader and rifle. I hope so.
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