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Nikon Tactical?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/08/2006 at 17:13
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What is the lowdown on thes tactical scopes?  Is their reticle fairly decent? Do they have good glass? What are their positives and negatives?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/09/2006 at 08:28
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Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

http://snipercountry.com/InReviews/Nikon25_10x_TacticalScope _II.asp

 

More reviews if you need them.

 

Cheaptrick,

 

I can't access that webpage from my work computer.  How accurately does the windage and elevation track in the review?  The Nikon is a heavy scope (24 oz).  Have there been any problems with it, such as the Mildot not being in millirad's? 

 

Do you have any comments on this scope?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/09/2006 at 14:14
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here it is copied and pasted just for you...

 

"By Mike Miller

 

A few years ago I was approached by Nikon and asked to tell them what I would want in the perfect sniper scope for police work. I say for Police Work because the requirements for a Military Sniper Scope are different. Nikon did their homework before jumping in. Nikon went to the professionals and asked what we wanted before attempting to jam something off the shelf down our throats. The project took several years before coming to the market place. That is a welcome change from how some scope companies have simply put a mil dot reticle in a "hunting scope" and said "It's Tactical".

Police snipers tend to shoot within 500 yards and need higher precision than their military counterparts. The typical target size target area, for LE is fifty-cent piece size. A sniper needs to be precise to hit this at 200 and 300 yards. That requires fine adjustments, such as quarter minute of angle. The military requires the ability to hit a chest sized target from 100 to 1000 yards in one turn of the adjustment knob. This is because under field stress conditions, it is easy to forget how many turns you have made on the elevation knob. To get from 100 to 1000 yards takes about 35-40moa. Elevation knobs typically have somewhere between 40 and 48 clicks in each turn. The amount of movement is therefore determined by how fine the clicks are. A 1/4moa-per-click scope with 40 clicks per turn will have a total of ten moa adjustment per turn. That would translate to nearly four complete turns to get the required elevation adjustment to 1000 yards from a 100 yard zero. The same scope with 1moa-per-click would have 40moa per turn and reach the 1000 yard setting in only one turn. It's a tradeoff of either fine adjustment (1/4moa) or course adjustment (1moa) but all in one turn. For LE work the fine adjustment is needed. For Military snipers the 1moa clicks are usually preferred. One MOA roughly equals 1.047" per each hundred yards, or 10.47" at 1000 yards.

This scope from Nikon has a primary marketplace for the LE Sniper so this scope has 1/4moa clicks. This scope has 85 total MOA of elevation travel; 85 MOA of windage travel also. The adjustment range will take a typical police rifle to 1000 yards, with or without an angled scope base. Most Police Sniper scopes require an angled scope base to adjust from 100 to 1000 yards. The Nikon with a total of 85 moa travel, with 42.5 up and 42.5 down from the reticle centered position, has more than enough travel/adjustment for either flat or angled scope base use to 1000 yards. If you add an angled base of 20moa you would have 62.5 moa travel or enough elevation adjustment to get a .338 Lapua to over 1500 meters. Needless to say the Nikon has plenty of travel.

One of the things that bug me about today's scope market is a push toward huge objectives and far too much power for the intended purpose. Most scope companies are selling what many now refer to as "Weapon mounted Hubble telescopes". Nikon avoided this trend and made the scope for the purpose it was intended. That purpose is a medium range sniper rifle. The size is just about perfect. Its overall length is 13.9", weight 24oz. Tube diameter is 30mm and objective is the size most sniper scopes in this class should be limited to - 44mm. Larger objectives bring many problems with them. The larger objective gives more reflection and is easier for an enemy to spot. The larger objective forces the scope to be mounted higher creating additional problems getting a good stock weld and thus an additional challenge in hitting the target. I see no need for any daytime sniper scope to have a larger objective than 50mm. The power range of 2.5-10 is perfect for LE Sniping.

Nikon listened to what LE snipers wanted/needed and gave it to us. The scope can be had with or without the lit reticle option. The lit reticle has five intensity positions and can be set in either green or red color. It, unlike some other brands, does not affect the total adjustment range of the scope. It is well done and uses a common watch type CR2032 battery.

Reticle options are of either the Nikoplex, or a new modified Miliradian/MilDot Reticle. I chose the Mil Dot Reticle. This new reticle from Nikon has some changes to it to make use far more accurate and simple. Nikon has mounted the glass-etched reticle in the rear focal plane. This places the reticle in a manner that is most common to US made scopes. In the rear plane the reticle appears to be the same size, no matter what the power setting is. This once again was what most snipers wanted. Like anything else it has its advantages and disadvantages. The advantage is the reticle is easier to see in low light and faster at the lower power settings. The disadvantage is the ranging features of the reticle are only precise at one setting. In this case that's 10x. To use the Mils for ranging and leads the scope must be set at 10X.

This variation of the Mildot reticle has some new features. In short the reticle allows snipers to mil within a tenth of a mil and be taught to do so in about a third of the time as with a standard mil dot reticle. It does this by adding an additional mark halfway between the dots and making the dots themselves .20 mil in diameter. My experience with older Mildot reticles was it is very hard to mil smaller than .25 of a mil. This made hold over and range estimates less accurate than with this new system. One of the great things about the mil type reticles is the ability to quickly compensate for range, wind and moving targets without turning an adjustment knob. This new system simply does a better job than the older mildots.

A scope, no matter what features, is only good if it can do several things:

  • See clearly. The Nikon has exceptional glass. It is clear to the edges and multi-coated on all glass surfaces to reduce glare and aid in letting light transmit to the eye. The scope worked well in all light conditions encountered. These conditions included bright day light, haze and low light urban conditions. The scope performed as well as any similar day scope can be expected to.
  • Have known and repeatable adjustment settings. This would seem a basic thing but frankly many other brand scopes previously tested have failed this basic requirement. The Nikon passed with flying colors. Tested across its adjustment range it gave the amount of adjustment dialed and repeated to previous settings every time.
  • Durability. The scope was used for several weeks daily, dropped, dragged in a drag bag and handled roughly. The scope was up to the task. It never failed. This scope is tough!
  • Functional size. This scope is the right size for any general use rifle. It is 13.9" in length. To add a cliché "This one is just right"
  • Enough eye relief for all shooting positions and with eyeglasses. This scope had every bit of 3.5" eye relief and worked well with and without corrective lenses. I never bumped, even under the recoil of a .338 Lapua with no muzzle break.

Overall this scope gets excellent ratings and would make even the pickiest LE sniper happy.

A side note is the scope comes with excellent instructions and a certificate for a free "MilDot Master" This is a slide rule type device that makes ranging with any Mildot scope simple and as quick as you can match the target size with the apparent mil size seen. Simply put the best thing for field ranging/sniping to come along - ever! Nikon not only made a scope worthy of use they gave the tools needed to make it even easier to use."

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/09/2006 at 14:28
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Anthony,

 

Thanks!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/09/2006 at 17:21
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They are nice scopes.

Only down side is they are a little pricey.

But, these days anything with "tactical" in it's name is pricey.

 

Mikes review pretty much sums it up.

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/10/2006 at 20:25
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I like mine a lot, but must tell you I have not done any testing with the adjustments to see if they work as well as claimed.

Also note that the newer ones don't have the half mil hash marks in them anymore.

I think that you would have to pay a lot more money in order to get anything better.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/14/2006 at 13:34
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Angled Base?

 

Is 85 MOA elevation enough to not require an angled base to reach a 1,000 yards?   

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/14/2006 at 15:55
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Originally posted by Rusty Rusty wrote:

Angled Base?

 

Is 85 MOA elevation enough to not require an angled base to reach a 1,000 yards?   

 

Cut it in half for "up"

Your talking 42.5 MOA of up.

Not all scopes are going to come in the same on adjustments.

Meaning, your NiTac might have a little more or less than 85 MOA. It varies.

 

One of the downsides to the NiTac is a lack of "up" in a 30mm tube.

I would highly recommend a canted base for a 1000 yards. 20 MOA would be decent.

I also would HIGHLY recommend Badger Ord. rings/rails.

 

Regards.......

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/09/2007 at 02:15
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C.T. Thanks for the GREAT info and links.  Before I found  this forum I was somewhat overwhelmed with choices in optics and seriously uninformed. I plan on putting together a 6.5 grendel ar-15 but for some odd reason I always buy the scope first. I am tired of ebay and the previous posts have finally cinched it for me. I am going to the SWFA sample list to pick me up NiTac. Hope they take M/O's. P.S. You can add another  left hander to your cadre. Big smile         Thanks, Mongo                                                                                                 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/09/2007 at 08:22
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Check out the IOR scopes as well - they are known to have some of the best glass and reticles in the business.

 

good luck.

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/09/2007 at 11:22
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I have a 10 power, my best friend got the 16 power, both great scopes. The main downfall we have found is the turrets are extreamly hard to turn! To the point it is a problem, other than that there on par with the leupold mark 4.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/09/2007 at 16:13
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Originally posted by mongo223 mongo223 wrote:

C.T. Thanks for the GREAT info and links.  Before I found  this forum I was somewhat overwhelmed with choices in optics and seriously uninformed. I plan on putting together a 6.5 grendel ar-15 but for some odd reason I always buy the scope first. I am tired of ebay and the previous posts have finally cinched it for me. I am going to the SWFA sample list to pick me up NiTac. Hope they take M/O's. P.S. You can add another  left hander to your cadre. Big smile         Thanks, Mongo                                                                                                 

 

Your more than welcome, Brother.

Wish I would have wrote it........ 

 

Just consider me "the greeter" like that works @ Walmart.

I don't know everything, but I CAN tell you in where the beer aisle is......  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/09/2007 at 17:13
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Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

...I don't know everything, but I CAN tell you in where the beer aisle is......  

 

HMMMM... nobody told me about that little hidden perk of OT.  You been holding out on me, CT?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/10/2007 at 16:27
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Originally posted by RifleDude RifleDude wrote:

Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

...I don't know everything, but I CAN tell you in where the beer aisle is......  

 

HMMMM... nobody told me about that little hidden perk of OT.  You been holding out on me, CT?

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/10/2007 at 23:23
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 I'm sure the IOR is a better scope, I just could not pass up the deal of $649.00 on the  NitTac. Buy the way SFWA does take M/Os for items on their sample list. I will start a new post in the Tactical section when it arrives.   I should start a new post for this, but any advice on a mount? scope has a 30mm tube and a 44mm objective I would like a quick detach setup for milspec ar-15 flattop. Money is no object when it comes to mounts, wish I could say the same about the scope.                                                                                        Thanks Guys!  M223 

Edited by mongo223
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/11/2007 at 04:00
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/13/2007 at 14:06
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Hi, C.T.,  Appreciate the link  I'm not sure if its right or not, seems to take me to SWFA 's home page. Anyways I found the Badger rings, Man they are a work of art; however They did not seem to have a Q.D. feature. I found out the O.D . of the Nitac's bell is 53 mm. Somewhere in the ring section someone posted a method to determine proper ring hight. guess I'll head  back over there and do some research. I may end up going with A.R.M.'s Q.D.rings or Larue's Q.D. setup. Thanks again.   SmileM223
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Originally posted by mongo223 mongo223 wrote:

Hi, C.T.,  Appreciate the link  I'm not sure if its right or not, seems to take me to SWFA 's home page. Anyways I found the Badger rings, Man they are a work of art; however They did not seem to have a Q.D. feature.

 

You mean "levers" for QD?? 

Why do you want those for a tactical rig?

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Yes, levers. I like to have easy access to back up iron sites. Call me crazy.M223  
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Maybe I'm missing something you know that I don't. The scope is going to be mounted to a 6.5 grendel AR-15 Flattop. I planned on using quality fold down front and rear sights as back ups in case Murphy strikes. Is the quality of the higher end Q.D. lever mounts not good enough for return to zero? Cuz I like to keep up my iron site skills from time to time.If this does not make sense please clue me in.Embarrassed Thanks again! M223
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Originally posted by mongo223 mongo223 wrote:

Maybe I'm missing something you know that I don't. The scope is going to be mounted to a 6.5 grendel AR-15 Flattop. I planned on using quality fold down front and rear sights as back ups in case Murphy strikes. Is the quality of the higher end Q.D. lever mounts not good enough for return to zero? Cuz I like to keep up my iron site skills from time to time.If this does not make sense please clue me in.Embarrassed Thanks again! M223

 

Well, it's a matter of preference, I suppose.

 

A BUIS is great for a CQB type weapon, I have them on mine, but I personally wouldn't bother with putting them on a rig like yours, unless you plan on doing some combat ops.

 

Combat operators like to be able to go to the BUIS in the event that their electronic optic (Eotech or Aimpoint) goes TU or becomes disabled somehow, the iron sights will enable them to still engage the threat.

(I'm NOT a combat vet or operator, so take my advise with a grain of salt.)

 

I like QD type rings, they are great for hunting trips that allow for a "quick change" if my primary scope breaks, but for your application I'd opt for conventional Badger or TPS rings.

 

Do you have a flip up front sight?? I saw pics of your rifle before but I don't remember if it had a flip up front sight.

Either way, iron sights on that rig will not give you the kind of accuracy a scope will.



Edited by cheaptrick
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/13/2007 at 19:29
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C.T. sorry, but I have yet to post any pics yet as I do not have a camera. I'll see if I can get hold of one soon so I can. The Grendel is a work in progress I only have a incomplete lower to date. What I do have operational is a 16" carbine w/ an ace skeleton stock , A.R.M.'s #50M hand guard, flip up rear sight, 4lb. single stage match trigger. The 16" Olympic  Arms heavy  barrel has a standard fixed front site. I normally run a tritium illuminated 3.4x Elcan on top for optics and I like it cuz it is easy on easy off. I am far from a sniper or anything like that. When I was in the military my mos was 52C or Utilities repair. I did manage to qualify as expert on the M-16A2  at 300yds with  iron sights.  Which  aint  much  if you  ask a  Marine  They  go out to 500yds.  Anyways some times I like the scope sometimes I like to go back to my roots. I would not mind mounting the Nikon on my  aforementioned carbine while I'm building the Grendel. Do you think the fixed front sight will cause problems? I have not had any issues with the Elcan. I may take your advice on the Grendel build cuz like I said those Badger rings really do look like the cats meow Thanks M223
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Originally posted by mongo223 mongo223 wrote:

C.T. sorry, but I have yet to post any pics yet as I do not have a camera. I'll see if I can get hold of one soon so I can. The Grendel is a work in progress I only have a incomplete lower to date. What I do have operational is a 16" carbine w/ an ace skeleton stock , A.R.M.'s #50M hand guard, flip up rear sight, 4lb. single stage match trigger. The 16" Olympic  Arms heavy  barrel has a standard fixed front site. I normally run a tritium illuminated 3.4x Elcan on top for optics and I like it cuz it is easy on easy off. I am far from a sniper or anything like that. When I was in the military my mos was 52C or Utilities repair. I did manage to qualify as expert on the M-16A2  at 300yds with  iron sights.  Which  aint  much  if you  ask a  Marine  They  go out to 500yds.  Anyways some times I like the scope sometimes I like to go back to my roots. I would not mind mounting the Nikon on my  aforementioned carbine while I'm building the Grendel. Do you think the fixed front sight will cause problems? I have not had any issues with the Elcan. I may take your advice on the Grendel build cuz like I said those Badger rings really do look like the cats meow Thanks M223

 

I'm sorry, I thought I saw a pic of your rifle here and it was a stainless 20" Varmint style rig....

My bad.

 

OK, I'm feeling ya now!!

 

I'll post a pic of my AR tonight, which is lot like yours with a scope mounted on it and the mount system.

Here's the rifle in all it's glory now..............

 

 

16" Bravo Co. Middy 5.56mm, with a Yankee Hill BUIS and a EO 552 and Larue mount.

(Has a 553 on her today.)

 

I'll throw my Super Sniper on it tonight and post it for you. It works even with the fixed FSB.

 

Sorry for my misunderstanding....

 

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No problem, sweet looking rig. I have been itching for a 553 myself among other things (PVS-14) alas corporate America has forsaken its workers once again. My company that has been here in America for over 100 years decided to ship all its operations to Mexico.I have a few months to find a new job. So after about 18 years of employment I  figure I owe myself one more toy before starting over. Gonna try getting on at the railroads machine shop.At least on my time off I'll be able to clean my filthy rifle off. Clean on the inside but dirty as all get out on the surface.Dead  Look forward to seeing the S/SBig smile   Thanks,M223
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