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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 01:19
Drewll View Drop Down
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Hello...

I'm new here, and I wanted to ask the experts here what they think the next optic I should buy.  Background- I just purchased a Blaser LRS2 rifle in .308.  I live in california, that's why I bought a bolt action!  Anyway, I'm going to be using this, mainly target shooting from 100 to 600 yards during the day at a shooting range.  I will hopefully someday go hunting with it...  I was looking at scopes, and I'm leaning towards the Burris 8-32x50 Black Diamond.  I really don't want to spend more than $800!
 
Any thoughts would be appreciated!   

Thanks guys!

Drew
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 06:39
HuntMaster View Drop Down
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Welcome,Drewll ! You have come to the right place. Some of the guys will be here shortly to make some excellent recommendations.
Derek
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 07:39
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Here are two Zeiss scopes with excellent optics that will come way under budget. One has a hunting style reticle, the other, a long range style that can easily be used for hunting.

http://www.swfa.com/pc-5762-259-zeiss-3-9x40-conquest-rifle-scope.aspx

http://www.swfa.com/pc-9790-259-zeiss-3-9x40-conquest-rifle-scope.aspx 

Edited by mike650 - September/05/2008 at 07:40
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 08:27
cbm View Drop Down
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Currently..like right now......SWFA that hosts this site has some Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44 with the ZRF reticles, parralax adjustment, and target turrets for only $599 on e-bay. I couldn't stand it......had to buy one this week. I think there are 2 left and only a few days left on them. From what I have seen.......with the target turrets.........that's an extremely good deal for one of these scopes !!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 08:27
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
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My advice: you don't need a 32X.

Conquest makes a good scope.  If most of the work will be bench, consider something with target turrets.  If it will be used to hunt, don't look for the largest objective you can find.

I would say go with a Conquest 4.5-14x44 (maybe 50), IOR 4-14x50 hunter, or maybe a Swaro American 3-9x36  (for bench shooting, the Swaro is the smallest of the bunch - but the brightest and clearest, in my opinion.9X at 600 yards isn't ideal, but skill, ammo, and barrel will play the largest rolls there - optics are a distant factor.)

There are many, many options.  $800 is a good spot for good optics, clarify what you want and need most and we can narrow the options a bit.  At this time, there are probably 20 scopes that many will recommend; with a few more details, the list will get much smaller.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 08:38
mike650 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by cbm cbm wrote:

Currently..like right now......SWFA that hosts this site has some Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44 with the ZRF reticles, parralax adjustment, and target turrets for only $599 on e-bay. I couldn't stand it......had to buy one this week. I think there are 2 left and only a few days left on them. From what I have seen.......with the target turrets.........that's an extremely good deal for one of these scopes !!



Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:

My advice: you don't need a 32X.

Conquest makes a good scope.  If most of the work will be bench, consider something with target turrets.  If it will be used to hunt, don't look for the largest objective you can find.

I would say go with a Conquest 4.5-14x44 (maybe 50), IOR 4-14x50 hunter, or maybe a Swaro American 3-9x36  (for bench shooting, the Swaro is the smallest of the bunch - but the brightest and clearest, in my opinion.9X at 600 yards isn't ideal, but skill, ammo, and barrel will play the largest rolls there - optics are a distant factor.)

There are many, many options.  $800 is a good spot for good optics, clarify what you want and need most and we can narrow the options a bit.  At this time, there are probably 20 scopes that many will recommend; with a few more details, the list will get much smaller.


Excellent advise from above!!!!  Thunbs%20Up
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 09:37
Drewll View Drop Down
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Thank you for all the advise...  I was reading on a precision shooting website that if I will be shooting 600 yard targets, I should get a minimum 24x, and since I will also be shooting 100 yards, then variable power is ideal...
The most expensive scope I have is a Leupold Rifleman series scope.  I ran into problems with it, but Leupold is going to repair it...  At 6x power, everything was clear as could be but it was tough to see a golf ball at 100 yards...  I turned it up the max power, 12x and everything turned to a blurr!  I really don't want a scope that I can't see a golf ball at 100 yards...  What more at 600 yards?
I heard Zeiss is a good scope, at 14 power max, am I going to run into the same problem?  Can I see an egg at 300 yards?  Will I be able to see targets at 600 yards?  As you guys can see, the problems I ran into from my past experience is scaring me to buy a lower power scope. 

Thanks again for all your input...

Drewll
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 10:00
Drewll View Drop Down
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I really like the Super Sniper scopes...  So another question I have is why would you buy a scope the has a fixed power?  For my application, Is it okay to use from 100 yards to 600 yards (the 20x model)?  My thought was if the army snipers are using it, then it MUST be good!  Am I missing something with the scope not having variable power?  Please advise...

Thanks...  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 10:46
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Drewll Drewll wrote:

Thank you for all the advise...  I was reading on a precision shooting website that if I will be shooting 600 yard targets, I should get a minimum 24x, and since I will also be shooting 100 yards, then variable power is ideal...



Beware of all experts (this site included.)  Until recently, the USMC and Army and Navy trained and deployed their snipers with fixed 10X scopes - some are still in use.

I shoot out to 1,000 yards and don't own (and don't want) anything higher than 17X.  You don't "need" 24X and, in truth, there are no 24X scopes in that price range that I could recommend.  If you double the price to about $1600, Nightforce makes a great 5.5-22x56.  At $800, forget 24X or higher that will be useful.

Finally, a fixed 10X is a great scope for all-around use; the SS is very durable, very dependable, very reproducible, and very uncomplicated.  As you moved from fixed-power to variables, you increase the mechanical complications of the scope (more potential for breakage or problems), you increase the number of lenses, and you increase the rules that govern the scope's effective employment.

When I read your initial post, my first recommendation was going to be a SuperSniper.  it is a great scope and would serve your purposes very well.

The difference between you Leupy and these will be dramatic.  in my opinion, 10X is all you "need"; if you want more, get more, but most are disappointed with the view at 24X and higher through scopes that don't ahve very good glass - and you pay significantly more for very good glass.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 11:13
Drewll View Drop Down
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I'll keep that in mind...  Hmm...  So would the Super Sniper 16x be okay?  Or is the 20x not recommended?  At 1000 yards, would I still see my target clearly with the 16x or 20x?

 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 12:36
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I agree with Rancid on this.  I don't like scopes with to much magnification, to many problems arise from it. 
1. Decreased exit pupil, which makes image look darker and harder to see.
2. Resolution seems to go down significantly with the higher powers, even with good glass.
3. Mirage becomes so bad you cannot make out your target.
4. Image becomes very shaky and it makes it harder to stay on your point of aim.

Seeing your target clearly has more to do with the quality of the glass then the magnification.  When you get into those higher powers the mirage becomes so bad that sometimes you cannot even make out your target.  It just looks like a blob that is moving back and forth.  If turn the power down you can see it. 

Personally I think a fixed 16x is to much for the distances you want to shoot.  If you were shooting 800 and beyond all the time I could see it.  But for 100 to 600 with occasionally shooting to 1000 I think 10x will be much better for you if you go with a fixed scope.  It is low enough that you can deal with the mirage.  You still have a good exit pupil, and it is enough magnification to shoot out to 1000 no problem. 

I have an IOR 3-18x and I shoot 100 to 600 a lot and sometimes out to 1200, and I very seldom go above 12x.  I mostly shoot on 10x and for 100 to 200 I will a lot of the time be shooting on 6x or 8x to lessen the mirage. 

The nice thing about a variable is you can adjust it anywhere you want for your current shooting needs.  With a fixed you only have 1 option.  I would look at a variable if I were you.

Fixed 10x is not going to work for hunting.  So if you are seriously considering using this rifle for hunting then you are going to need something besides a super sniper.  Unless your hunting is in a stand and you are always shooting longer distances.  But for typical hunting use it is not going to be ideal. 

If you want a really nice fixed 10x scope for $800 this would be the one.  http://www.swfa.com/pc-10113-292-ior-10x42-tactical-30mm-rifle-scope.aspx  It is going to be a nice upgrade in glass over the super sniper.  Super Snipers are good, but they don't have the glass quality that an IOR has.  But by the time you get rings and base you will be around $900.

This would be a good one to use for both hunting and target shooting.  It will have pretty good glass, mildot and adjustable/resettable turrets http://www.swfa.com/pc-12405-2172-bushnell-25-16x42-elite-6500-30mm-rifle-scope.aspx  Add a warne 20 MOA base and burris rings and you would be right at your $800. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 12:39
supertool73 View Drop Down
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That bushnell scope also comes with a free rainjacket coupon.  My dad and I both have one, they are really nice jackets and makes the scope an even better deal.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 13:11
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The 3-10 Kahles Cl multi-zero on the samplelist will have the best glass in your price range. It is an awsome scope for the money. I love mine and wil be getting another soon.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 13:18
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Originally posted by 3_tens 3_tens wrote:

The 3-10 Kahles Cl multi-zero on the samplelist will have the best glass in your price range. It is an awsome scope for the money. I love mine and wil be getting another soon.



That will not be an ideal scope for target shooting though.  You need to be able to be making adjustments all the time and the type of turrets on it will not be what he needs.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 13:37
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2008 at 21:10
Drewll View Drop Down
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Thanks for all the advise guys!  I think I have to sleep on this one... Darn it...  I'm now more confused than when I started! hehehe...  Its a "good" confused though!

Thanks,

Drew
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/06/2008 at 10:09
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 Drew ... if you're shooting targets only and I mean only .... fixed is good . But if you ever want to use it for hunting ... the targets move .... there's objects usually between you and your shot that will be blowed up with fixed and not able to acquire for a kill . You're talking 10x + and that's not going to work . There are MANY great variables with great FOV and extreme clarity at ALL the zoom settings . Look at it this way ... you can set a good variable where you want it and leave it there ... or you have the option of any higher or lower to choose . That hype of NO variable having all the good points of a fixed is BS . Anyone telling you that bought a lousey variable . You can get excellent ... high quality lenses/glass in a variable .... for far less than $1,000.00 . And target turrets are an included option on many already in the box .

Edited by mercenary1947 - September/06/2008 at 10:17
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/06/2008 at 10:14
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The Burris you mentioned is a good scope. I would look to a lower powered version, as the other guys said.
http://www.swfa.com/pc-8156-204-burris-4-16x50-black-diamond-30mm-rifle-scope.aspx

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