New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - New with some questions
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Check GunBroker.com for SWFA's No Reserve and No Minimum bid firearm auctions.

New with some questions

 Post Reply Post Reply   Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 09:17
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11

 Hello...I am new here and really under informed. I would like some informed opinions on a scope selection.

 Rifle is a Savage 10FCP HS Precision .308  I will get either a Farrel or TPS Picatinny scope rail. I am looking at the Vortex Viper 4X12 . I understand it has 57moa adjustment. Will this be enough for 600yd F-Class? Matches will be 300yd and 600yd. OR should I get a rail with 20 moa built in. Bullet will probably be a 168gr SMK. I don't know for sure, as it is yet to be delivered and load testing will have to be done.

 Also will a Leupold QRW ring mount to either Weaver or Picatinny rail?
 
  Thanks so much in advance. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 11:12
billyburl2 View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: January/08/2009
Location: Cottonwood, AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 3874
If you are set on that scope I would deffinately get the ramped rail. With a 200 yd. zero 175 smk's will need about 50 moa to get to 500 yd. As far as the rings go, picatinny bases accept both kind of rings, but not tac. style rings to weaver bases.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 11:44
cheaptrick View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar

Joined: September/27/2004
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 20475
I too would recommend a 20 MOA Picatinny rail. It's there if you need and not a hinderence if you don't. Scopes will come and go, but the rail stays with the rifle. Or at least mine does.
 
That rifle should be a real shooter!  Sharp Shooter
 
How much do you have to spend on a scope?
 
Welcome to Optics Talk........
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 11:48
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
Originally posted by billyburl2 billyburl2 wrote:

If you are set on that scope I would deffinately get the ramped rail. With a 200 yd. zero 175 smk's will need about 50 moa to get to 500 yd. As far as the rings go, picatinny bases accept both kind of rings, but not tac. style rings to weaver bases.



I'd be curious to know how you came up with that calculation.

A 168-gr. SMK has a ballistic coefficient of 0.462 (at speed greater than 2600FPS).  When I plug that in to my ballistic software, even with high elevation and low temperature, I only need about 50MOA to get out to 800 yards - from a 100 yard zero.



And I don't understand your ring and base response either. Should the "go" be a "no", and how are you defining weaver and picatinny base - or, rather, what are you defining as the different between the 2?


Edited for terrible spelling.


Edited by Rancid Coolaid - March/28/2009 at 11:50
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 11:55
billyburl2 View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: January/08/2009
Location: Cottonwood, AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 3874
I was going off of federal 2009 ammo guide. With a 200yd zero a 168 gr. smk is minus 51.6 inches at 500 yds.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:00
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
Billy,

Assuming your source material is this chart off the Federal website (for the SMK):


Please note that the drop is in inches, not MOA.  The two are roughly interchangeable at 100 yards, but not beyond.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:01
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
I guess Federal won't let you link to their images, so here is the page with the data.


http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/rifle.aspx?id=150


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:01
billyburl2 View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: January/08/2009
Location: Cottonwood, AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 3874
When some says picatinny base, I am assuming a 1913 mil standard slotted base. Which will accept weaver style rings. But tac style rings that have square cross bolts for one of these bases will not fit in weaver style bases. Sorry if I offended
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:03
billyburl2 View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: January/08/2009
Location: Cottonwood, AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 3874
You are correct. @ 500 yds that would be 25.75 moa roughly. My applogies
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:12
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
No, you did not offend at all, and I am sorry if that came out as sounding like I wanted to start a fight (I don't.)

I want to be sure the original poster gets the info he needs and that the info is accurate.  Also, I wanted to be sure I was not stupid - as your numbers just seemed off and that bugged me.

There is no need to apologize, I am trying to help you both. (And 51 inches at 500 yards is roughly 12 MOA, I think.  I'll search for an article relating how MOA works.  It can be far less simple than mils.)

We are all here to learn and help one another, that was my intention - and is almost always my intention.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:15
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:25
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
Here's a link that works without the need to download something (that may or may not spark the apocalypse in your computer)

http://files.thetallengineer.com/Mil_Moa_Simplified.pdf



Hope this helps.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 12:44
billyburl2 View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar

Joined: January/08/2009
Location: Cottonwood, AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 3874
R.C. thanks for the save. And to Sparks sorry for the added confusion,stepped on the ole crank on this one!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 18:44
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11

Not to worry...thanks for the information. While not completely sold on the scope, it fits my current budget and would offer all I need. I looked at the Millet , but read some very bad posts about them. (and some good ones) It's hard for me to go with that one, with about 50% of the posts saying bad reviews.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/28/2009 at 21:00
Steelbenz View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Avatar
ROLL TIDE ROLL

Joined: January/03/2006
Location: Heart of Dixie
Status: Offline
Points: 4913
Sparks, measure your freebore, than start seating at 80 thousands off the lands and move in.
My .308 likes them at 20 thousands of the lands.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 09:01
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Originally posted by Steelbenz Steelbenz wrote:

Sparks, measure your freebore, than start seating at 80 thousands off the lands and move in.
My .308 likes them at 20 thousands of the lands.
 
I bought a Stoney Point (Hornady) case yesterday for .308. I intend to do just that.Will see just what jump it wants for best accuracy. Do you neck turn? What brass would you recommend? I am thinking Lapua first, maybe Winchester for price. The trouble is I do not know how uniform the Winchesters are. Just sorted some Federals I have by weight, and found why my Browning shoots lousy groups. Weight variation went from 177grs to 143grs. Such an extreme spread by weight!!! Of course the BAR is not a tack driver by any means. good hunting rifle though. As witnessed by more than one deer.  


Edited by cheaptrick - March/29/2009 at 09:57
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 10:08
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Thanks for the edit "cheaptrick"...much appreciated!!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 10:16
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

I too would recommend a 20 MOA Picatinny rail. It's there if you need and not a hinderence if you don't. Scopes will come and go, but the rail stays with the rifle. Or at least mine does.
 
That rifle should be a real shooter!  Sharp Shooter
 
How much do you have to spend on a scope?
 
Welcome to Optics Talk........
 
For now about $500.00...... situation could improve with a sale of a firearm, I may wait to get a better scope and just use mt Leupold 6.5x29 VXIII. I usually use this on my 6.5 Grendel for target/F-class (AA Arms upper/DPMS lower) Scope is about 10 yrs old.
 Any recommendations instead of a Vortex??? kind of financially challenged due to work picture. Still find $$$$ to practice shooting though.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 11:30
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
If this is a purely bench rifle (not a hunting rifle with close- or long-shots, consider a 10X Super Sniper.  It is a fixed power, it is well built, the optics are very good for the money, and there are no worries with regard to elevation adjustment.

I have seen a Viper or 2 now, not bad for the money, I'll be interested to see how they hold up over time.

Since you seem to put weight on reviews, look at the Super Sniper, it is a great scope.

Also, look at Falcon scopes (not sold by SWFA), I don't own one, haven't shot one, but know a few knowledgable people who like them allot.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 12:12
sparks1 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2009
Location: Land of 10,000
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Since you seem to put weight on reviews, look at the Super Sniper, it is a great scope.
 
I have to rely on reviews as I cannot buy numerous scopes and see which one suits me.
 
 I am trusting members here that have used different scopes to steer me toward a variety of scopes and then in the end I will make a decision based on information i receive.
 Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 16:13
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 7702
I should'a said, "look at the Super Sniper reviews."  It is a good scope at a great price.


I appreciate the problem of not being able to handle or look through before you buy, I recommend the Super Sniper.

I've also looked through Vortex and thought it was a good scope for the money.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 17:25
Voodoo6 View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice
Avatar
Now With Kung-Fu Grip!

Joined: March/29/2009
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 213
Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:

I should'a said, "look at the Super Sniper reviews."  It is a good scope at a great price.


I appreciate the problem of not being able to handle or look through before you buy, I recommend the Super Sniper.
 
10x Super Sniper is good to go!
 
Hello all! New to the forum and this is my first post. Howdy
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 22:16
cyborg View Drop Down
Optics God
Optics God
Avatar
God of Wind

Joined: August/24/2007
Location: North Georgia
Status: Offline
Points: 12082
Welcome to Optics Talk Voodoo.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 22:19
Ed Connelly View Drop Down
Optics Retard
Optics Retard
Avatar
God of no Chihuahua

Joined: December/16/2007
Location: USA
Status: Offline
Points: 24220
Hello Voodoo.    Bucky      
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/29/2009 at 22:19
Kickboxer View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Moderator

Joined: February/13/2008
Status: Offline
Points: 18344
Originally posted by sparks1 sparks1 wrote:

Originally posted by Steelbenz Steelbenz wrote:

Sparks, measure your freebore, than start seating at 80 thousands off the lands and move in.
My .308 likes them at 20 thousands of the lands.
 
I bought a Stoney Point (Hornady) case yesterday for .308. I intend to do just that.Will see just what jump it wants for best accuracy. Do you neck turn? What brass would you recommend? I am thinking Lapua first, maybe Winchester for price. The trouble is I do not know how uniform the Winchesters are. Just sorted some Federals I have by weight, and found why my Browning shoots lousy groups. Weight variation went from 177grs to 143grs. Such an extreme spread by weight!!! Of course the BAR is not a tack driver by any means. good hunting rifle though. As witnessed by more than one deer.  

I've got two BARs, one in .243 and one in 30-06 and they WILL drive tacks.  
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Similar Threads: "New with some questions"
Subject Author Forum Replies Last Post
New scope question kyrupp7 Rifle Scopes 7 11/29/2004 10:10:52 PM
New Shooter Questions scudder Rifle Scopes 43 11/21/2006 3:46:07 PM
New Nikon 3-12x42 Question tarboroheel1 Rifle Scopes 2 2/5/2007 3:07:01 PM
Zeiss Conquest question new vs old newmanuim Rifle Scopes 1 6/14/2007 11:19:22 AM
Stupid question by a not-new guy Rancid Coolaid Tactical Scopes 15 8/24/2007 10:18:43 PM
New guy - old question... Joe Hunter Rifle Scopes 10 10/17/2007 12:59:43 PM
New member new scope questions P&Y Rifle Scopes 9
Happy New Year Fellas, Whats New Obi Wan Kenobi Rifle Scopes 4
Help buying new scope snyderracing Rifle Scopes 0
New rifle (again), need new scope (again) bugsNbows Rifle Scopes 10


This page was generated in 0.422 seconds.