New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Need help with 1-4/1-6 scopes
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Check GunBroker.com for SWFA's No Reserve and No Minimum bid firearm auctions.

Need help with 1-4/1-6 scopes

 Post Reply Post Reply   Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/19/2013 at 20:28
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Hi,

I have a couple rifles - one with Eotech and another with Aimpoint. For my third rifle (AR-15) I decided to go with something different. Something to cover the mid-range but can also be used for CQB if needed. I was thinking Red Dot + 3X Magnifier, or 1-4 or 1-6 scope, but leaning more towards the scope. 

However, so far I do not like any of the 1-4/1-6 scopes with the setting at 1X. They are NOT like looking through red dot sights. They have some kind of visual “distortion” going on, as if I was seeing through a glass/cotact on one eye that is just barely not the right prescription. I wonder if they are intentionally introducing something like pincushion to reduce the rolling ball effect around the edges? Anyways, when I pan the gun/scope, it gets blurry and distorted especially around the edge. It does not scan like a Eotech or Aimpoint. I have sensitive eyes :-), so I think I will get headache if I stare into these scopes too long.

So far I checked out Vortex Razor HD 1-4 and 1-6, Trijicon 1-4, Leupold Mark 6 1-6, and a few cheaper brands. They all seem to have this problem in varying degrees, although Razor 1-4 seems to have the least problem. (generally 1-4 seems to have less of this issue than 1-6, I felt)

Would  SWFA SS 1-6 have the same issue at 1X setting? I can’t try this model locally, so I would hate to order it to realize that I do not like what it does at 1X.

Thoughts?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/20/2013 at 20:19
Chrome223 View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: February/26/2011
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 30
The SWFA 1-6 is wonderful on 1x (almost as nice as their 1-4x), but probably not much better than any of the other scopes you listed.  In particular, the Mk 6 is a very nice optic.  The eyebox on the Trijicon is also quite good.  Since you're having issues with those, it suggests a diopter issue.

You've got to adjust the diopter on the scope before they look crisp and clean.  Once that's done they are usually pretty good.  (Now, 'panning' is another matter and will be an issue with a red dot magnifier as well).


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/21/2013 at 20:56
ccoker View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: February/13/2008
Location: Austin, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 2032
how far away is the target when you are scanning?
did you adjust the eyepiece focus for your eye?
were these mounted on a gun or just handheld?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/22/2013 at 17:29
Wild_Wild_Wes View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: August/29/2013
Location: Rancho Cordova
Status: Offline
Points: 23
I was amazed when I first looked through my SS 1-6 on 1X. So much more like an RDS than I was expecting.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/22/2013 at 21:28
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
I did adjust diopter on all of them except, i think, Leupold mark 6, for some reason in couldn't turn it.

it was held on my hand rather than mounted onto something.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/22/2013 at 21:31
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
I was scanning things that were across the room, maybe 20-30 feet, as well as something close like 10 feet.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/22/2013 at 21:49
supertool73 View Drop Down
Optics Jedi Master
Optics Jedi Master
Avatar
Superstool

Joined: January/03/2008
Location: Utah
Status: Offline
Points: 9516
You cannot properly test a scope in your hand. Hate to say it but the opinions you gathred by testing the way you did are worthless.

Scopes have a very small band of light comimg through them that work best if centered perfectly in your pupil. Holding them up to your eye by hand will never allow you to hold them steady enough to keep your eye centered. That would explain the fuzzyness and problems you saw.

A aimpoint eotech work completly different than a traditional rifle scop
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/22/2013 at 23:43
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
For panning i think you might be right, but for steady hold, it is not like looking through a pair of high end sunglasses - that is I don't see anything optically weird.

I notice that my left and right eyes do not see the same. I never noticed that before with eotech and aimpoint. I do understand they are different design, I just hoped that at 1x it would be like looking through a window, but so far my experience tells me no.

are you saying i should see it like with naked eye, or at lest through a flat pane of glass?

btw, i get motion sickness very easily, so any slight visual weirdness that most people do not notice, i do.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/23/2013 at 08:59
ccoker View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: February/13/2008
Location: Austin, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 2032
they will never be completely like a red dot..
I have ran a ton of them..

Having said that, I don't think it is an issue that some training won't make irrelevant.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/23/2013 at 13:13
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Thanks for all the feedback so far folks. I think I still want to go with scopes rather than a red dot and a magnifier. I just need to find the one that gives me least trouble at 1x.

Out of all of them my favorite was Vortex Razor HD II (the glass was clear, the eye box big) and Leupold Mark 6 (the ffp reticle).  Would SWFA SS HD 1-6x come close to either, in glass quality and straight look through at 1x?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/23/2013 at 13:26
ccoker View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: February/13/2008
Location: Austin, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 2032
I don't like a red dot plus magnifier..
tried them a few times, nope..

I really like the Meopta 1-4, it's got a big eye box and is very fast.

Another few great options are the Steinier 1-5, Swarovksi Z6 and Kahles 1-6
But all at a much higher price point

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2013 at 01:49
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
I had a chance to try out a almost new SWFA SS HD 1-6 scope locally. I was ready to purchase it until I looked through it. 

At 1X it was not even close to being 1X. It actually looked like 0.8X or something, and the image between my left and my right eyes will not match up at all. Right image is smaller (80%) and it is offset by like 15%, displaced upward. There is no way I can scan a room with this. Bumping it to 1.2X or so to match up the magnification, but it brought up the other issue - I lost FOV where I will have a blind spot between my two eyes. I tried to play with the ocular knob twisted all the out to all the way in, and it did not solve the problem. I tried to fix the displacement by moving my eye position further up, which bring the image down, I think, but then the scope shadows kick in before the left and right image are aligned side by side.   

I had no problem with some of the other scopes I tried. In order of least distortion at 1X - Elcan Spector 1-4, Vortex Razor II 1-6, Leupold Mark 6 1-6.  Elcan and Mark 6 are out of my budget, so that leave Vortex Razor as my best option so far. Only problem is I hate the reticle. I love the SWFA SS HD 1-6 reticle design, and I really wanted to love it, but I couldn't use it for 1X.

Any inputs?  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2013 at 04:02
Jon A View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman
Avatar

Joined: March/14/2008
Location: Everett, WA
Status: Offline
Points: 660
Yes, focus the scope's ocular to your eye.  With 1-X scopes I often find this is best done on 1X with both eyes open instead of the standard way of doing it.  Once you get the image to match the best at 1X check to ensure you can still see the reticle easily at 6X.

Use a zero MOA mount.  It sounds like the elevation in the scope you looked through had been adjusted to its extreme.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/27/2013 at 13:19
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Thanks Jon. Hmmm, I think you might be right on that elevation adjustment set on extreme. That is probably why the image was offset quite a bit. I might have to give it a try one more time. 

Does anyone else find the SWFA set at 1X to be LESS than 1x though? 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/29/2013 at 01:05
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Tried out a SWFA SS 1-4X today. This was way better at 1X than the 1-6X. Also this was actually mounted on to a gun, so I could actually use it like it was intended.

Only weird thing was that when I focused on something close (10 yards?), I could not get the reticle to be sharp on the target. Thing that were further away was OK. 

Also another thing that I noticed is that the diopter piece on the SWFA 1-6 and 1-4 seem to do almost NOTHING when I move it. With Razor or Mark 6, I can't definitely tell it is doing something. Is this by design?

I think Vortex Razor 1-4X has the most natural looking 1X. Leupold Mark 6 the next, and SWFA 1-4 seems to be about the same. And then PRobably Vortex 1-6X and then Steiner 1-4X, TRijicon 1-4x.

Then the cheaper rest falls quite a bit away from the above.  

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/29/2013 at 18:43
maxfly View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/02/2012
Location: pa
Status: Offline
Points: 2
brother in law accidently dropped my trij (attached to a rifle) from a table to a chair then onto the floor.  ocular bent.  sent back to trij, and they said it was not repairable. sent it back with no attempt to fix.  Perhaps that will eliminate one scope company from concideration.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/30/2013 at 00:28
Sparky View Drop Down
Optics Master Extraordinaire
Optics Master Extraordinaire


Joined: July/15/2007
Status: Offline
Points: 3190
What were you expecting them to do and for how much?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/08/2013 at 18:26
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
OK, so after 3 weeks of agonizing decision making, I decided to go with Leupold Mark 6 because I am getting a very good deal on it. I would have picked that or Vortex Razor II 1-6X, but the reticle design drove me to the Leupold instead. Vortex had better eye box size, so this was a hard choice.

BTW,  I am ordering the TMR reticle version, even though I haven't seen that in person. Hopefully I won't regret it! 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/12/2013 at 20:27
johnny_boy View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: September/19/2013
Status: Offline
Points: 11
Don't have the mount yet, but I have the scope. I wanted to post a picture of the TMR reticle as I could not find any decent image of this compared to the CMR reticles. I like it at 1X as it is big enough to use it as a red dot (I think it is like 6-8 MOA dot), and when set at 6x, small enough to be precise.

I set the light at 5 out of 7, and it bleeds a bit at that intensity. Setting at 3 would do. The day was overcast late in the afternoon, so I did not need a lot of red LED intensity. 
1X

6X
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: October/16/2013 at 16:24
ccoker View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: February/13/2008
Location: Austin, TX
Status: Offline
Points: 2032
nice
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/29/2013 at 10:29
rotts4u View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: June/08/2012
Location: Chattanooga, TN
Status: Offline
Points: 12
Can anyone advise what height rings would be needed to get one of these 1-6X SWFA to sit right on a flat top receiver? I don't want to end up with something .5" too high etc.

Thanks

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/30/2013 at 20:20
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Resident Redneck

Joined: June/20/2005
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 13868
Bobro Precision Optic 30mm Mount Bobro Precision Optic 30mm Mount
Stock # - BOBB03201300
  • 30mm
  • Low
  • Slightly Forward
$209.95 
One brands "low" is not always same as another but you do want slightly forward.
SWFA S.S.A.L.T. 30mm Scope Mount SWFA S.S.A.L.T. 30mm Scope Mount
Stock # - SS30HSSALT
  • Picatinny MIL-STD-1913
  • Matte
  • Comes with 1" Inserts
$59.95 
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Similar Threads: "Need help with 1-4/1-6 scopes"
Subject Author Forum Replies Last Post
Need help identifying vintage scope 67goingthing Rifle Scopes 4
Trijicon 3-9x40 scope ID help needed waltham41 Rifle Scopes 10
Need help with multi purpose scope estes640 Rifle Scopes 25
Help!Need to know if my scope would work on a rife V8Mechanic Rifle Scopes 6
Need help with .460 scope decision TaylorMiller Rifle Scopes 4
Need help with Remi 597 and tasco varmint scope Shooter01 Varmint Scopes 1
Need help Choosing New Scope! Mtansey Rifle Scopes 12
Need help choosing scope for Deer Hunting Rifle cgriff20 Rifle Scopes 8
Need scope mount and rings help txgolfer52 Tactical Scopes 2
Need Help choosing a Spotting Scope! BrushyHillGuide Spotting Scopes 8


This page was generated in 0.559 seconds.