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Lightweight scope setup for mountain rifle

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 19:43
Fredfrankbob View Drop Down
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I am currently in the process of purchasing a new Remington 700 LSS chambered in .25-06 and would like to put an optic on it and keep the weight down, wondering about lightweight mounting options and scope suggestions, the rifle will be used on everything from varmints to elk.  Like to still be able to shoot out to 4-500 yards, any suggestions?  Budget is around 600.00.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:06
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This one is 14.1 oz which is pretty light. Good glass as well.

http://swfa.com/Minox-2-10x40-ZA5-Riflescope-P48154.aspx

This one is even lighter, and would also work.

http://swfa.com/Sightron-3-9x42-SII-Big-Sky-Riflescope-P9157.aspx

The lightest one I know of is this one.

http://swfa.com/Leupold-3-9x33-VX-II-Ultralight-Riflescope-P3275.aspx

I was not really impressed with the glass in the VXII I looked through. It was overcast that day and the low light capability is just not there with the 33mm objective.

Were it me, I'd hump the extra 6 ounces and get the Minox.





Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:14
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I'm not a Leupold guy, generally, but this setup would do nearly everything you're looking for:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-25-8x36-VX-3-Riflescope-P12644.aspx

If you could stand another 1.6 oz of weight, this one is a positively screamin' deal:  http://swfa.com/Vortex-2-7x32-Viper-Rifle-Scope-P10818.aspx.  You'd be giving up little, if anything, to the $479 Leupold.  They also had a BDC reticle, but it looks like they've sold out of 'em.  I bought one at $269 a few years back, and thought it was a tremendous deal even at that price.

I've got zero experience with this one, but it has no shortage of big fans on internet forums:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-6x36-FX-II-Riflescope-P7494.aspx

Lastly, this one's a touch heavier than the 6x36 above, but I can't recall hearing of aNNNyone who's had one that didn't just love it:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-6x42-FX-3-Riflescope-P12758.aspx

Sorry I couldn't spend all of your budget.  Big Smile  Whatever you pick, throw it in some Talley Lightweight rings, & rock on.

FWIW, I scoped my 700 MR (walnut & blue with the BDL-style bottom) with the now-discontinued Zeiss 4x Conquest.  It's longer & heavier than any of the above, but I just love it.  I'd never shoot it 400-500 yards, either, but mainly just because I can't see that far, or practice at those distances regularly.

Good Luck!

FC


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:14
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http://swfa.com/Swarovski-3-9x36-Z3-Riflescope-P40812.aspx
If you can swing the extra $150.00 this would be perfect.
 
 
Another great option and a Leupold that get favorable reviews.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:27
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Originally posted by neilbilly neilbilly wrote:

This one is 14.1 oz which is pretty light. Good glass as well.

http://swfa.com/Minox-2-10x40-ZA5-Riflescope-P48154.aspx

This one is even lighter, and would also work.

http://swfa.com/Sightron-3-9x42-SII-Big-Sky-Riflescope-P9157.aspx

The lightest one I know of is this one.

http://swfa.com/Leupold-3-9x33-VX-II-Ultralight-Riflescope-P3275.aspx

I was not really impressed with the glass in the VXII I looked through. It was overcast that day and the low light capability is just not there with the 33mm objective.

Were it me, I'd hump the extra 6 ounces and get the Minox.





I read a bit about the ultralight VX-II and seems there was some debate about the FOV, light gathering and eye relief, I know that I can't have every option I want with the price I am willing to spend, but weight is high on the priority list, this year I will be spending a good amount of time "hiking" trying to fill a tag and I would like to keep it as light as I can and still get the optical quality we all want.  I think a couple extra ounces is ok, just not sure exactly how many.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:27
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Check out the Minox 1.5-8x32.  FOV as good, if not better than most 3-9s.  It comes in at 13 oz, but has a constant 4+ inches of eye relief which is great.

Just another choice to consider...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 20:35
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Originally posted by Folically Challenged Folically Challenged wrote:

I'm not a Leupold guy, generally, but this setup would do nearly everything you're looking for:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-25-8x36-VX-3-Riflescope-P12644.aspx

If you could stand another 1.6 oz of weight, this one is a positively screamin' deal:  http://swfa.com/Vortex-2-7x32-Viper-Rifle-Scope-P10818.aspx.  You'd be giving up little, if anything, to the $479 Leupold.  They also had a BDC reticle, but it looks like they've sold out of 'em.  I bought one at $269 a few years back, and thought it was a tremendous deal even at that price.

I've got zero experience with this one, but it has no shortage of big fans on internet forums:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-6x36-FX-II-Riflescope-P7494.aspx

Lastly, this one's a touch heavier than the 6x36 above, but I can't recall hearing of aNNNyone who's had one that didn't just love it:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-6x42-FX-3-Riflescope-P12758.aspx

Sorry I couldn't spend all of your budget.  Big Smile  Whatever you pick, throw it in some Talley Lightweight rings, & rock on.

FWIW, I scoped my 700 MR (walnut & blue with the BDL-style bottom) with the now-discontinued Zeiss 4x Conquest.  It's longer & heavier than any of the above, but I just love it.  I'd never shoot it 400-500 yards, either, but mainly just because I can't see that far, or practice at those distances regularly.

Good Luck!

FC


I know that I am not for the fixed, though alot of people swear by them, especially a 6x, there are just to many situations when peaking hills or peaks, brush etc.. I keep my scopes low and dial up if necessary.  I am not sure about the vortex. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 21:23
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That Vortex is a very nice little scope if you can live with 7X on the top end you'd be hard pressed to get as a good a scope for even 2x the money. I have 3 of them. Their customer support is good and Scott from Vortex checks in here once in a while.




Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:03
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This is the go to rifle that I have been wanting for a long time, not that the Vortex is bad, I really do not know that, but I want something that is going to be a solid performer with good low light performance and repeatability.  I finally can afford the rifle I want and and optic to go with it, I really like the input so far, just been looking at the different models and reading a bit of reviews.

How much brighter is a 40mm than a 32mm or 36mm of the same quality, I know that some manufacters are quite a bit different in that realm.
 
And of the scopes listed above, how would the optics clarity rate on say the minox vs the vortex, minox vs leupold, and the others I can't remember right now?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:12
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Originally posted by Fredfrankbob Fredfrankbob wrote:


I know that I am not for the fixed, though alot of people swear by them, especially a 6x, there are just to many situations when peaking hills or peaks, brush etc.. I keep my scopes low and dial up if necessary.  I am not sure about the vortex. 


OK, so now we are gonna spend all of your $600!

This one puts you up to the Vortex weight, but it does get you 10X on the top end:  http://swfa.com/Leupold-35-10x40-VX-3-Riflescope-P12650.aspx

And here's a fairly comparable Minox offering:  http://swfa.com/Minox-3-9x40-ZA3-Riflescope-P46136.aspx

And the aforementioned 1-8x Minox is a good suggestion, too.  

As for not being sure about the Vortex, I understand.  I bought my 1st one blindly, and with a bit of  trepidation.  It wildly exceeded my expectations, though, and I've bought several other Vortex products since.  The feedback on the Viper line has been quite favorable, and the feedback on Vortex's product support/customer service has been stellar.  They're really great folks, and & solid company.  

It really is an interesting question that you've posed.  The majority of the time, people are trying to get the absolute best glass for the money.  When it comes to the best glass for the ounces, the choices become fewer.

As always, I urge you to physically handle and look through as many of the scopes as possible.  But do come back & buy it here!

Take Care,

FC
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:18
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Leupold VX3  3.5-10x40
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:24
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Hey guys, I know this is optics and not firearms, but Fred, I noticed you plan on hunting Elk with this 25-06. Before you actualy do that, I know it is probably done, but you need to think first. That is one small bullet to throw at an Elk. My father has a 25-06 that he hunted with when I was growing up. It is a great caliber for white tail size game, but I am sad to say I watched him take a neck shot on about a 200-250lb mule deer up in Colarado when I was in high school, it didn't kill him, he dropped, got up, ran, and my uncle shot him 3 days later , maimed, with infection, he wasn't even suitable to eat at all. I would never recommend you shoot an Elk with a 25-06, you would literally have to have perfect bullet placement, and then things still may not work out. I only rant on 25-06 rifles because it just made my father and I sick when that hapened.

Edited by Bigdave - April/22/2011 at 22:25
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:38
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Originally posted by Bigdave Bigdave wrote:

Hey guys, I know this is optics and not firearms, but Fred, I noticed you plan on hunting Elk with this 25-06. Before you actualy do that, I know it is probably done, but you need to think first. That is one small bullet to throw at an Elk. My father has a 25-06 that he hunted with when I was growing up. It is a great caliber for white tail size game, but I am sad to say I watched him take a neck shot on about a 200-250lb mule deer up in Colarado when I was in high school, it didn't kill him, he dropped, got up, ran, and my uncle shot him 3 days later , maimed, with infection, he wasn't even suitable to eat at all. I would never recommend you shoot an Elk with a 25-06, you would literally have to have perfect bullet placement, and then things still may not work out. I only rant on 25-06 rifles because it just made my father and I sick when that hapened.


I have to agree with Bigdave on this a 25-06 is not an Elk rifle, even with a premium bullet such as a Barnes TSX. It is however a awesome deer and pronghorn caliber. I would have no problem using it on a big mule deer if I had to but I don't do neck shots, only vitals. The 25-06 was the caliber that was used to introduce me to "big game" rifles when I was a kid and I will probably always have one. I have my current one set up strictly as a Pronghorn rifle and although I have other more expensive rifles it is still my favorite. As for a scope that is suitable for everything from Pronghorn to Mule Deer (or 40-400) I would highly recommend this one, especially when weight is a consideration. http://swfa.com/Sightron-3-12x42-SII-Big-Sky-Riflescope-P9161.aspx. I just purchased one and put it on my Mule Deer Rifle (7mm Rem Mag) so I haven't had alot of time with it but I also have a 3-9 that I have used quite extensively and it is outstanding.


Edited by biggreen747 - April/22/2011 at 22:38
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:47
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Originally posted by Bigdave Bigdave wrote:

Hey guys, I know this is optics and not firearms, but Fred, I noticed you plan on hunting Elk with this 25-06. Before you actualy do that, I know it is probably done, but you need to think first. That is one small bullet to throw at an Elk. My father has a 25-06 that he hunted with when I was growing up. It is a great caliber for white tail size game, but I am sad to say I watched him take a neck shot on about a 200-250lb mule deer up in Colarado when I was in high school, it didn't kill him, he dropped, got up, ran, and my uncle shot him 3 days later , maimed, with infection, he wasn't even suitable to eat at all. I would never recommend you shoot an Elk with a 25-06, you would literally have to have perfect bullet placement, and then things still may not work out. I only rant on 25-06 rifles because it just made my father and I sick when that hapened.
I understand what you are talking about, and I have heard the discussions many times, the fact is there are many shots you will pass up when you choose a caliber such as the .25-06 I know this going into it, and if I do choose to use it as my primary you can bet that I will have the utmost confidence in my shot placement should I be presented with a shot, I do believe however that the "bigger stick method" is actually worse when you make a bigger hole in the wrong spot, it rarely kills them faster, most shooters with bigger sticks have the flinching habits, and really do you think a dead elk knows the difference between a .25-06 and a .270?  I think too many peopele question the caliber of a rifle, when they should be questioning the skill of the shooter and/or his shot selection.   If and when I choose to take my rifle, I will have developed a proper load and selected the proper bullet and will know when and where to take that shot.  My current elk rifle is a 7mm mag and its no fun lugging it around, but until my .25-06 is ready, I will be using the 7mm.  And on a last note, a neck shot is a pretty risky shot regardless of caliber.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 22:54
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As far as the original intent of the OP, the Minox is a great choice if you don't feel comfortable with the Vortex.  However, I replaced a 3-9X40 Zeiss Conquest with a 2-7X32 Viper, and don't feel underglassed with the Vortex.

As far as the 25-06 goes as an elk round, I would tend to recommend others, but it will do just fine with a really good hard bullet.  A coworker shoots only a 25-06 for elk, and doesn't have much trouble.


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/22/2011 at 23:19
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That is really intersting, might I ask why the switch specifically to the vortex, what about it made you fell it was a better choice than the conquest? I am shocked by the comments about the vortex, for the price, I would think otherwise, how does it do in low light conditions and repeatabilty?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2011 at 00:01
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The Vortex is a very nice overall scope.  The Conquest has a bit better optics, but not by a heck of a lot.  I switched to the Vortex for aesthetics, mostly, as it was going on a Remington Model 7, and the Conquest was pretty long.  The little Viper looks just right.  Low light isn't too much of a problem, as it has a decent exit pupil at every power.  I haven't spun the turrets much to check for repeatability (I have the BDC version), but I haven't had any trouble maintaining zero.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2011 at 00:14
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I'm loyal to the dollar, "read cheap bastard if you must Wink" and a lot of the rest of us are as well. Scope for the dollar right now "and even when they were $169 on sale" you won't do better than the Viper line from Vortex. You missed out on some stellar deals on Burris scopes just recently and when they were the best deal, it's what was mostly suggested.

If you buy it and don't mount it, only look through it and are disappointed, SWFA will take it back and refund you. You'll be out a little shipping, but that's about as risk free as it gets.

I'd still go with the Minox. Big Smile


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/23/2011 at 06:48
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Originally posted by Fredfrankbob Fredfrankbob wrote:

...

How much brighter is a 40mm than a 32mm or 36mm of the same quality, I know that some manufacters are quite a bit different in that realm.
 
And of the scopes listed above, how would the optics clarity rate on say the minox vs the vortex, minox vs leupold, and the others I can't remember right now?


Those sound like questions for Koshkin, our resident optics guru.  As there have now been suggestions from 32mm to 40 mm in objective size, I'm not sure there's been a definitive comparison between all of those models.  However, Koshkin has done a review of some of the < 40 mm offerings, which he originally posted on this forum.  You can now find it here:  http://opticsthoughts.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=31:tweener-scopes&catid=12:riflescopes-random-musings&Itemid=4

Some things have changed since that time:
*  The Kahles is generally unavailable
*  The Zeiss has been discontinued
*  The Leupold has more reticle choices
*  The Vortex is being discontinued, and is now $149, instead of $269
*  The Minox is now available

Still, I think it gives you a decent idea of the pros/cons of each scope, & how they compare to one another.

With any luck, he'll be along shortly to sort out the suggestions that have been offered, & maybe make a few others of his own.

FC
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 16:56
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get the Z3 and you'll be a happy camper for a long time!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 18:07
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please explain to me why a 25-06 isn't good for elk and a 308 is ok. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 18:32
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Thank you all for the input, I have been checking out the suggestions, would weather conditions affect anyones suggestions?  I like the viper for the price, hard not to, I had issues with a lower line vortex in the past and after a few discussions with customer service, which I will say again, is the best I have seen, I was able to evaluate a viper visibly and saw a remarkable difference, I can only hope the internal differences are as great as the internal.  Anyways, back to suggestions and weather conditions.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 21:13
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Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

please explain to me why a 25-06 isn't good for elk and a 308 is ok. 
From what I have seen and read improper bullet selection, shot selection and poor shots have lead to the belief that the .25-06 is not enough for elk, while it may not be the perfect solution, in the right hands it is very effective.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 22:02
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Originally posted by Fredfrankbob Fredfrankbob wrote:

Thank you all for the input, I have been checking out the suggestions, would weather conditions affect anyones suggestions?  I like the viper for the price, hard not to, I had issues with a lower line vortex in the past and after a few discussions with customer service, which I will say again, is the best I have seen, I was able to evaluate a viper visibly and saw a remarkable difference, I can only hope the internal differences are as great as the internal.  Anyways, back to suggestions and weather conditions.


The Viper is Vortex's top-of-the-line hunting scope, and have excellent fit, finish, and performance, even when compared to higher priced scopes.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/24/2011 at 22:52
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Originally posted by Fredfrankbob Fredfrankbob wrote:

Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

please explain to me why a 25-06 isn't good for elk and a 308 is OK. 
From what I have seen and read improper bullet selection, shot selection and poor shots have lead to the belief that the .25-06 is not enough for elk, while it may not be the perfect solution, in the right hands it is very effective.
 
To each their own, if I'm hunting any animal, I am going it with enough to put them down quick. 25-06 with proper shot placement may be fine, but a .300mag 180grain  shot in the same place is better.

As for as why a .308 is better than a 25-06, a .308 165 grain hunting bullet hits about 500 ft lbs

harder than a 120 grain 25-06, 500 ft lbs is a lot. The .308 round has better ballistics, holds more velocity for a longer period of time. and has a larger wound channel after impact. Most importantly of all, I have never heard of a .25 cal round that was designed for hunting Elk sized game, every manufacturer loading manual I've read for load development has advised against it.  I'm finished on the subject, this isn't the post or the forum for it, I was just sharing my experience, and what little I know.


Edited by Bigdave - April/24/2011 at 22:53
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