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Leupold VX-R and Vortex Viper Review

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300S&W View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 300S&W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2011 at 20:58
 
    All better.  Had second thoughts after I posted it.   If you think long,you think wrong. Big Grin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tman1965 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2011 at 21:53

I wont "hype" up anyones product... I will simply state my honest opinion of a product and if I think its awesome, just ok, or a total POS, thats what I'll post. If I have no experience with the product I wont comment at all on it. with that said, here in Ga. we can have some drastic temp extremes... this is the only place I know of where I can get sunburned and frostbitten in the same day! I have a 2-7x32 viper, and for what I paid for it 169.99+ shipping, I think it's a great scope. I have had no fogging issues with it at all, and its as clear as I could ask it to be at any range I can realistically use it. and in the event I ever do have a problem with it, I know without a doubt vortex will make it right. I personally just dont see how one can go wrong with that!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote grimreaper21 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:27
Originally posted by atlasman atlasman wrote:

 
Totally agree..........except when that low price tag is a "closeout price" and not supposed to be indicative of the "true value" of said scope......but rather, a deal where you are actually getting "more" then what you pay for simply by the good fortune of timing.
 
When I read so many guys here saying what a GREAT deal the Viper was at $169 I was expecting $250-$300 quality when I looked through it...........not $169. 
 
 

this boggles my mind a bit... If this scope is not a great deal at $170 then I have a feeling you would hate every $170 scope you ever looked through. 
 
do you have experience with any of the following? just wondering.
 

Bushnell Elite 3200, Leupold VX-II, Millet Tactical/Buck Gold, Nikko Stirling, Nikon Buckmaster, Sightron SI & SII, Vortex Diamondback, Super Sniper Fixed.

these are all scopes mostly in the same price range if NOT MORE expensive than $170.  The viper is said to best all of these scopes by a substantial margin.  If you look at the 2009 riflescope rating scale, the Viper is ranked two categories higher than all of these.  I can understand not liking the fogging (very temporary) or the eye position (corrected with more consistant eye/shooting position), but other than that It seems more like you were emotionally dissatisified.  any other explanations would help me out here. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:41
The thing that is killing me about this fogging issue is that will not happen in the field as was said by the OP.  You are not going to be out hunting in the super cold and then suddenly walk under a magic tree and the temp goes up 60+ degrees or vs versa.  A rifle scope does not get close enough to your eye that the heat from your head is going to affect it.  I honestly just don't see how this is an issue at all.

That is the same reason I always keep my binos in my jacket against my chest when hunting in the cold.  If they are cold and I put them up to my warm eye they fog up.  Its just the way it works.  But if they are at a similar temp because they were in my coat against my chest they do not.

One thing that I don't think has been taken into account here is what if one of the boxes in the UPS truck was sitting in a much warmer place in the truck.  That is something that is unknown, but it could explain the diff here.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pyro6999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:44
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The thing that is killing me about this fogging issue is that will not happen in the field as was said by the OP.  You are not going to be out hunting in the super cold and then suddenly walk under a magic tree and the temp goes up 60+ degrees or vs versa.  A rifle scope does not get close enough to your eye that the heat from your head is going to affect it.  I honestly just don't see how this is an issue at all.

That is the same reason I always keep my binos in my jacket against my chest when hunting in the cold.  If they are cold and I put them up to my warm eye they fog up.  Its just the way it works.  But if they are at a similar temp because they were in my coat against my chest they do not.

One thing that I don't think has been taken into account here is what if one of the boxes in the UPS truck was sitting in a much warmer place in the truck.  That is something that is unknown, but it could explain the diff here.

actually it can, ive done it myself to my 4200 elite.
i use one of those hand warming muffs like nfl quarterback use. i put a heat factory brand "body warmer" in mine. they are like 4x4 and they put out serious heat. when i sit in the stand i put my rifle across my lap and it tucks under the muff. i have to make sure i take the rifle out of there every so often. i neglected to once, and when i pulled my rifle up it was so warm under there that the scope fogged instantly. it was below zero outside mind you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:47
That is operator error, not a problem with the scope.  Wink  That is exactly what should be expected to happen in the situation you put your scope in.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pyro6999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:48
correct
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 03mossy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:53
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

One thing that I don't think has been taken into account here is what if one of the boxes in the UPS truck was sitting in a much warmer place in the truck.  That is something that is unknown, but it could explain the diff here.
There is no heat what-so-ever in the back of those trucks. equally cold from front to back, top to bottom.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 10:55
If it were sitting on the floor right above the exhaust it could have been kept at a warmer temp.  It is an unknown, that is all I am saying.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atlasman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 12:21
Originally posted by grimreaper21 grimreaper21 wrote:

this boggles my mind a bit... If this scope is not a great deal at $170 then I have a feeling you would hate every $170 scope you ever looked through.
 
It may be boggling your mind because I don't think you are reading the thread very clearly, I never said I hated the Viper.......in fact have said numerous times I like it.  I also listed another scope I have coming in that I paid $180 that I feel WAS a deal at that price.
 
 
Quote If you look at the 2009 riflescope rating scale, the Viper is ranked two categories higher than all of these. 
 
It could be rated #1 in the world by every magazine out there and nothing in my review would change.  Just my honest opinion and feedback.........sorry if you were disappointed by it. 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atlasman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 12:27
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The thing that is killing me about this fogging issue is that will not happen in the field as was said by the OP.  You are not going to be out hunting in the super cold and then suddenly walk under a magic tree and the temp goes up 60+ degrees or vs versa.
 
 
That's actually not what I said at all.
 
Quote I don't expect any drastic temp changes like that ever in the field but certainly worth noting.
 
That's what I said in the review.......I replied later that when my truck is sometimes only a couple minutes from my stand this is a concern.
 
 
 
 
 
 

 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 12:37
I guess that took on a double meaning.  What I was meaning is that you also said you don't expect those changes to happen in the field.  I was agreeing with you in that respect.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cruft Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 13:01

OK 300 you caused me to own up so here is the comparison.  Any benchrest guys back off, hunters only.  The 3 scopes tested were; 1) the Vortex Viper 2-7x32 BDC,  2) the Bushnell 4200 elite 1.5-6x36 with rain guard and german #4 (my favorite reticle in the whole universe) and the 3) Burris eurodiamond German#4 illuminated (which makes it the best reticle in all 21 dimensions).  It is a beautiful crystal clear day here in central Virginia but my sighting distances are not the usual suspects but will start in that which should interest hunters.  The first distance is 135 yards as it was a junction box with writing.  Now this is important as it's a measure of resolution and contrast sensitivity test is beyond me.  The next distance was a 400 yard clearing with waving grass of some sort.  So here's the findings; can't tell the difference between the viper and the bushnell at 135 yards.  That was a suprise.  Excellent resolution from both.  At 400 yards Same results the two tied.  But there is a really BIG difference,  the easy and comfort I got behind the scopes.  The viper is pure misery.  Must fiddle and adjust head position no end.  The bushnel easy peasy.  Boy was that a telling side by side test and no way to find out other than doing it this way.  Now comes the Burris eurodiamond.  Sidebar; my experience with Mike at Burris customer service left me with a concrete promise to never by another product from this company so I'm no shill.    And I won't sell a POS scope to another brother.  But this scope utterly blows the first two away.  When I got behind it, the instant comfort, field of view, edge clarity was beyond belief.  So I compared the three to transmission lines at 500,  600 &  8oo yards.  Results;  the first 2 were good enough to kill anything deer size all the way out but the resolution not so good.  The Eurodiamond not only could I see the ceramic separators but I could see the wires clearly!  And this at 6X.  Anyone wanting a tweener and have gotten this far shouldn't pass up the closeout a SWFA.  I hope Ilya can explaing why the ED is so poorly rated by him.  Get Your Popcorn Ready 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 13:29
Cruft, you didn't say, but I'm assuming the ED was the 1.5-6X40, is that correct?
 
You do realize that scope retailed for 2X what the other 2 did and has a larger objective, right?  The larger objective diameter provides better resolution.
 
I had a Euro Diamond 2.5-10X50 w/ Ballistic Plex, and I agree it was a nice scope.  I sold it to my brother, and he's happy with it.  I didn't like the fact the entire ocular rotates with the magnification ring, but overall, it's a good scope.  I think they're a good buy at the current closeout prices, but at normal retail, for the same and in some cases less money, I would rather buy a Zeiss Conquest, which I think has better optics than the ED.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cruft Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 13:48
Yes it is 1.5-6.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cruft Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 13:52
RifleDude,  what is that rife, a dakota?  the case coloring is a delight but I would only fondle such a thing and guns are meant to be shot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RifleDude Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 14:03
Yes, it's a Dakota Model 10.  I don't have one... yet.  I'm a sucker for nice falling block SS rifles.  Fit, finish, balance, style, and overall design are all first rate.  Action is built like the proverbial swiss watch.  All decked out, they are works of art.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ccoker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 14:34
I had the ED 1.5-6x40 #4 electro dot
fairly good scope optically, but the illuminated reticle failed on me twice
(newer style)
after MUCH pleading I got them to send me another scope model, sans illumination
Both of my LRS burris scopes crapped out

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 300S&W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2011 at 15:59
 cruft,first off it must be NICE to have a 400yd indoor range with waving grass in it cause you sure weren't out on a day like this.  Bucky
 
  I see Rifledude addressed the ED price issue so.....................................
 
  I'm guessing that you've noticed at OT that the 4200 Elite series scopes are highly thought of. Almost in the Conquest class,I think.  We push the 3-9 to the hilt because it's a great scope at a heck of a price.  I tried to locate one of the 1.5-6x36 models after they were discontinued but it didn't happen.  It to,like the ED,was a good bit higher in price than the 2-7 Viper was at it's highest price.  I paid $275 to the door for my Viper.  I still have notes I took when I was searching out a low powered variable for my Mauser Carbine. For that 4200 the lowest price I found (before the prices were pulled) was $360 w/o shipping.  I guess what I'm getting at is that your testing (and I want THANK YOU for going through the trouble) to me shows the Viper compared favorably,optically,with the 4200 and that's a complement in my book.  As far as the PURE MISERY?  Shocked of the head position (was there a problem at all dstances?) I can only say that I don't have that issue.  But,and maybe this is the diff,my stock's lop is cut to fit me to a T with a full fov at 7X.  I did notice that the specs for both scopes shows the 4200 with a bit wider fov to.  Anyways,I still believe that the Viper is a VERY GOOD scope even at the higher price it use to be. I could have returned it if I didn't think so.  I feel there's another issue at work here. I had bought a highly recommended scope for my Mauser before I got the Viper. Paid $100 more than what I paid for the Viper and didn't keep it long enough to hunt with. A couple of it characteristics just didn't and couldn't work for me at all.  I won't say what the scope was because it is a very popular brand in a very popular power range that is well liked by many users including the guy I sold it to.  Maybe that's what's happening here.  ALOT of those Vipers have been bought and it's only here recently that there has been a FEW complaints.  I honestly believe the scope will work for most but won't,as with any scope,work for all.  I'll continue to recommend it for use in situations where I feel  it will best satisfy the customer and at a price they are looking pay.  So,how much you looking to sell that rag Viper for?  Big Grin
 
 
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