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Leupold or Burris ???

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2006 at 19:53
quizzy873 View Drop Down
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I am looking for a new scope for my Ruger 7mm Rem Mag. I have a 50 mm on there now and I love the extra light so I am staying with a 50. I am considering the Burris Black Diamond 8-32x50 or two from Leupold, the LR/T 8.5-25x50 or the XV-III 8.5-25x50. Does anyone have any suggestions. My two uncles swear by Leuplod and pushing me to go that way. They both have lifetime warranties so that is not the worry. The second question is there such a thing as too much magnification? Should I consider a lower magnification like 4-16 or 6.5-20? Thanks for any help you guys can give.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2006 at 20:30
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I would consider toning down the magnification & buy a Black Diamond.  I have to give a slight edge to the Black Diamond over the LRT with regard to brightness & clarity.  You're going to have a hard time topping the optical quality of the BD unless you step up to $800+ ultra premium brands (Zeiss Diavari, Kahles CL, Swarovski, Nightforce, IOR, S&B, etc.).  Leupold LRT is very good but comes up (in my opinion) short to the Black Diamond.

 

Why are you looking at scopes with such high magnification?

 

Best of luck to you!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2006 at 20:52
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I think they are comparable scopes, but you get more for the money with Black Diamond.  I would also venture to say that the glass on Black Diamond is a bit clearer.  As for the magnification range, unless it is a bench/varmint gun there is really no need that I can think of for anything beyond 4-16x50.

 

ILya

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/14/2006 at 21:02
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8x32x50 on a Ruger hunting rifle?   I can't see it even if the thing shoots .5 MOA.  For the dollar amount you are talking about you can get Zeiss Conquest in a more reasonable magification and a lifetime warranty.  The next question I have to ask is do you want to pay for glass or warranty?  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/15/2006 at 09:18
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I can't imagine you needing more than 16X, and the exit pupil gets mighty small on 32X.  I doubt it wold be usable for hunting.  As far as Burris vs. Leupold, I'm with your uncles.  Both will be fine to look through, but the Burris Black Diamond I had felt kind of cheesy and clunky compared to my VX III's; cheaper finish on the Burris, and it will be several inches longer and several ounces heavier.  Handle them both and see what you like.  Have you though about a VX L?  I'm liking mine more all the time.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2006 at 14:56
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Thanks for the help guys. The reason I was looking at the higher magnifications is I just figured would help see at alittle further distance. As for the Ziess, I have heard of problems with getting the foreign made scopes fixed as well as a long turn around time, if there is ever a problem so I was trying to stick to the USA made products. Now the next question would be how much diference would there be beteen the 4-16 and the 6.5-20? If I go with the 4-16 I can get the ballistic plex other wise I would get the mil dot. Any preference on there two?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/21/2006 at 07:25
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I don't have any personal experience with Zeiss, but I have an acquaintance who does. He was having a problem with a new Conquest (I forget what it was) he shipped it back to Zeiss and within two weeks he had a new  Conquest in his hands.

 

Many foreign made scopes & binoculars complete their repair work here in the US. Kahles, for example does some of its repair work in Cranston, RI. From what I've read, I feel safe in saying that Kahles, Swarovski and Zeiss' customer service is just as good, if not better than Leupold. But I do admire someone purchasing a USA made product with Japanese glass .

 

BTW...the lower end Leupold Rangefinders & Wind River binoculars are manufactured in Asia and the Zeiss Conquests are assembled here in the USA. In todays global economy it's hard to purchase a "homegrown" product.



Edited by Stud Duck
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/21/2006 at 14:07
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I have got a burris signature select 4x16x44. I recomend this power because it allows you to back off for the close encounters. I spotted a buck at 900 yards with the 8 power binocs and put my 16x on him. I was amazed at how well I could make out the rack. 4X16 is my favorite choice. Also, I vote for the ballistic plex, that reticle used with a good rangefinder is hard to beat in my opinion.

Edited by kerndoo
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/24/2006 at 04:21
Mats View Drop Down
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Originally posted by quizzy873 quizzy873 wrote:

The reason I was looking at the higher magnifications is I just figured would help see at alittle further distance.

 

Well, more often than not it's the other way around - with the higher magnification comes optical drawbacks, added to that is the magnification of your own shakes & shivers. The Burris has an edge on the Leupold opticswise; the crisp, clear and detailed image will be of great use if you want to see small things far away. I'd go for nothing more than 16-20x on the top, simply 'cause it's very rarely of any use.

 

-- Mats

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/26/2006 at 15:06
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I have a 8.5-25 Leupold Mark 4 illuminated tactical scope and I like it just fine. I do think that the 4.5-14 is a good or better choice for most use. I have had nothing but good luck with Leupold. I have had only one of three Burris scopes that worked properly and the warranty service was less than customer friendly. U.S. Optics is better than both. Zeiss has the best glass but nobody seems to make scopes with more MOA internal adjustment than the Long Range Leupolds. The TMR reticle can be used for hold over at set distances (see Leupold website). The Monarch Gold Nikons are top quality glass and worth a look. If you go on glass alone you will choose Zeiss. If the combination of service ability to adjust to shoot longer distance (75MOA on the 8.5-25 Leu) (100MOA on the 4.5-14Leu) The availibility of an illuminated reticle, the choice of multiple reticle styles Leupold is still a valid consideration.

IOR scopes are fine glass and worth a look also.  I wouldnt buy a Burris. I also think that 4.5-14 or close to that is the way to go.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/01/2006 at 04:01
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    Hello All,       

               I am ok with a scope that has more than 16 power if what you are shooting at is smaller than a motrcycle at some pretty long distances( 200-500 yards)  with a less than 7 mm cartridge.  Or if you are thinking of putting that same scope on top of a .50 cal and sniping Soviet BMP's at some considerable distances( 400 - 1600 yards). 

               If you are going to put high power on top of a hunting rifle, give yourself that added advantage of being able to go low power for quick target pick up at close ranges.  That way you can always crank it up and study those antlers!    If you go too high with your lowest seting on the scope then you are saying that you never expect a shot closer than , say '200 yards', theoretically.  Which negates the possibility that you will stalk to within reasonable range of your prey.  It is quite hard to pick up game animals with a 6X at close range and find them immediately or track them on a running shot.  That is what the lower powers are for, so keep that in mind.

               As far as scope manufacturer goes, I believe that you have naroowed down to the two finer domestic manufacturers that we have here.  I prefer Burris, as all of mine outshine all of the high end Leupolds that I also own.  Some may think me crazy, but I have had really good things happen to me when I put the only Burris Black Diamond I own on top of my .223 varmint rig.  My kill percentage has gone up in the wee hours of morning and near nightfall.  I am thinking because I, too am receiving "better viewing to the killing" with the 50 mm objective.

                I am now, though still poorly funded at the moment, planning to purchase their new XTR with illum. BMD and target turrets to go on top of my .25-' 06.  I still think that you cannot go too wrong with a leupold though.  You say that your two uncle's own a Leupold, ( probably 4.5- 14X50mm's), so go with the Burris and Leupold side by side and see what you think. 

                Good Luck

                     Scott

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/02/2006 at 13:42
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 Leupolds are extremely overpriced and over rated !  Antiquated tecnology and misleading ads . My friends and I have about 7 of their junk scopes that break alot and we will never be ripped off by them again. The down time sucks waiting for repairs .  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/02/2006 at 20:50
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Hello Merceanary1947,

         I suppose that one could say that Leupold's are quite high in the price range and perhaps to some degree, they are overated!!! To call them junk is a great stretch of the imagination!!!   For most of us, we work through Leupold to see why they are so popular.  If you are having problems with their customer service, then this is the first case I have heard of.  Most people that I know that are still big fans of their products, and think that their customer service is excellent, to say the least  !!

         Though, I have moved on to Burris, and in my humble opinion, think that I have found exactly what I am looking for in scope performance with the price I am willing to pay.  However, I do not feel as though I would be buying junk if I were forced to buy only Leupolds.  I agree that they are overpriced in the market of all other things being equal.

          They still have come out with and innovated the scopes that can bend around the barrel.  Their new LX technology keeps the axis of the shot close to the axis of sight!!  Pretty innovative, in my book!! That way you  get big objective light transmission and low scope mounting to ensure a good cheek to stock weld and a better chance of maintaining accuracy... All without giving up the good form of shooting, that many of us have to do, when we go to bigger than 44mm objectives.

           I still could not call them junk.  But everyone is entitled to their own opinions!  And you are entitled to your's!!

            If you notice, they are primarily whom everyone compares against in the way of finely crafted products, so to call them junk is a big stretch, I believe.  They are very big into the SWAT, and US Armed Forces in their current deployments, and as such, I seriously doubt that they could maintain that level of prestige, if they were really junk!!  They are the first choice of many nationally recognized benchrest shooters, so I am still thinking that some people are willing to pay for this, and still see value in them, don't you?  If you are unhappy with your purchases from Leupold, I am sure that you could sell them to whomever, and get pretty close to what you paid for them, so the perception of quality must be pretty well established, don't you think?

                   Seriously,

                       Junk?!?!

                         Scott

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/02/2006 at 22:12
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I'll take all that Leupold "junk" you want to give away

I sold a Vari X II that I'd been using for at least 10 years not long ago for $100 more than it cost new.  I don't think that falls under the definition of junk.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/03/2006 at 12:48
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         As I stated in another post with another topic, I am selling a Vari X III 4.5-14X40mm for only about $100.00 less than I paid for it brand new.  I have never gotten more for a scope except when I sell it to the Amish, sho are no longer able to legally purchase a firearm from the dealers. ( It is because they refuse to get a picture ID for themselves.   Not because they fail a background check, or have bad rap sheets or anything, but they regularly pay up to $200.00 more for the same rifle, that you could buy anywhere else for $200.00 less.)

           The only reason is that today I need the money for other things and getting rid of a scope is less painful than getting rid of a rifle.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/03/2006 at 16:54
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Are they allowed to use scoped guns???
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/07/2006 at 12:46
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Yes the Amish are allowed to use scoped guns but they are required to buy the scopes here on line at SWFA.

Ha Ha

 

 

I think Merc is actually the Burris rep. (probably the only one that hates Leupolds that much).

I like my Leupolds but for a hunting gun the   VXIII  4.5-14 x50 is a fine choice.  You can probably get more for your money with some other brands but as for service Leupold is top and the two times I called Burris - well as  for me forget Burris I wasn't happy with them - but that is just my luck --because  others have had good luck from Burris.  Zeiss is a fine scope well worth considering best glass of the lot.  Anybody can make a product that breaks especially when it is shipped roughly.

5214949943 New Zeiss 4.5-14x50 Conquest Rifle Scope New Zeiss 4.5-14x50 Conquest Rifle Scope
  • Silver
  • Mil-Dot
  • 1"
  • Side Focus
  • Target Knobs
  • Etched Glass
  • 2nd Plane
  • Free $20.00 Zeiss Conquest Baseball Cap w/ Purchase
SWFA: $799.95
More Info... Buy Now
5214909943 Zeiss 4.5-14x50 Conquest Rifle Scope Zeiss 4.5-14x50 Conquest Rifle Scope
  • Matte
  • Mil-Dot
  • 1"
  • Side Focus
  • Target Knobs
  • Etched Glass
  • 2nd Plane
  • Free $20.00 Zeiss Conquest Baseball Cap w/ Purchase
SWFA: $769.95
More Info... Buy Now

You can also use the mil dots as hold over points.

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/07/2006 at 13:12
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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As for the Amish they won't use electricity but they will use a cell phone that can be recharged at someone elses house. They wont buy a car but they will pay someone to drive them to a work location in a car. They are premitted to use ceertain things but not own them they used my tractor and post hole digger to build a metal barn.  Really Hard Working Nice people. They do not like to be photographed. They are good hunters and since a scope is a tube with glass in it they more than likely would be able to use one but I doubt you will find them using any expensive ones because they are plain simple people and want to keep their lives that way - certainly a low stress lifestyle where kindness and good values are the norm not the exception.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/08/2006 at 11:52
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Beretta opps I mean Burris, turns the power selector when you turn the rear focus cause the lube gets stiff, must use two hands, Conquest plastic everywhere, turrets use Polish notation (turrets move the reticle not the POI) no choice of reticles, Most scopes even higher end ones get a little fuzzy around the edges on their highest power. Usable on a 6.5x 20 leo really about 18x likewise on other manufactures. The best high powers are Comp Leos (check www.6br.com) but are fixed. (Or Nightforce if you want a variable) Any of these give outstanding value for the dollar. Any unwanted Leos will be properly taken in cared for, cleaned and heavily used by myself and mwyates.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/08/2006 at 15:59
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   Hands down as the other member said the Burris black diamond is the way to go .... much better glass and more light and CLEARER !  I have the Burris 8x-32x-50mm Black Diamond and have owned many other leupolds and it beats them by far. leupold better wake up or they're going to go down the same road as weaver and tasco !  I'm sure the lesser power Burris scopes use the same grade lenses and by what the world is saying are beating the pants off leupold . Our local dealers have bucu leupolds on the shelves and can't keep the new Burris' in stock !  I just ebayed 3 leupolds and won't buy anymore . If you don't believe me go to a dealer and try both units ... you'll see !  Zeiss .. rock solid and fast repair if ever needed ... which is rare .... but who wants a second mortgage to buy the best one .... hahha  Cheezy finish on the Burris .....??????  What a joke .... would you rather have the leupold glass shiny deer spooking finish that scratches quicker than the devil ? Of course I'll never give up my  SNIPER Custom Shop Tasco 8-40 x 56mm .... if the bullet does'nt kill them I beat them to death with the scope .....   When somebody new sees it they think it's a wall ornament for a sporting goods store ... it's so huge ... LOL

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