New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Ideal LONG RANGE RIFLE
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Check GunBroker.com for SWFA's No Reserve and No Minimum bid firearm auctions.

Ideal LONG RANGE RIFLE

 Post Reply Post Reply   Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options Page  1 2 3>
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 08:08
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

Hey guys - question for you......

 

what would be the best long range rifle for 300 - 1000 yrds. ???

 

.338 lapua / 300 winmag / .308 / .223       ????

 

i want to put together a good longrange setup next and would appreciate your advice.

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 08:09
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

and as far as optics? fixed or variable? parallax adjustments? adjustable objective?

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 11:03
noddah View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice


Joined: September/06/2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 129

Though looking at the caliber choice (Not too hot not too cold) I would recommend the 300 Win Mag. 

 

"Give or take" IMO the calibers drop off in the following order: 223-5.56 (500 - 700 Yards) 308-7.62x51 (700-1000) 300 Win Mag ( 800 - 1,100 Yards) 338 ( 1,600 Yards)

 

For the scope; is this rifle going to be a "daylight" range rifle?

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 11:31
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

yes, maybe dusk on occasion -  no nighttime needs

 

but mainly daylight, punching paper

 

i am leaning towards the .300 winmag or the .338 lapua -

 

is it taboo to have a 'tactical' scope w/out the tall turrets? 

 

i am leaning towards the 35mm IOR's or the S&B line -

any other suggestions?

what about super sniper or other brands?

 

thanks, this is a foreign area to me, i pride myself in hunting rifles/optics.

 

i look forward to your posts.  I will probably get a Sako TRG-S, Tikka T3 tactical or varmint model, or a Rem 700P.

 

i 'need' to keep this under 2500 bucks or so, so i don't want to have to modify the trigger, etc, too much.

leaning toward the Tikka varmint.  I could spend more on the glass that way.

 

thanks for help.

 

J

 

 

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:03
noddah View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice


Joined: September/06/2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 129

Nothing about the 338 is inexpensive... On the other hand components and factory loadings are plentiful with the 300 Win Mag; it is a compromise between performance vs. more choices, more trigger time and less expense.

 

Another scope I would consider is the Nightforce Scopes. The NF Scopes have allot of adjustment are a quality product; ($1000 to $1400 range) with rifle and scope you will stay in budget.

 

IOR also makes a good product; though it is my experience not all of the line is on par...

 

The S&B is awesome... I own them and love them; though I question if you will stay in budget with the S&B option.

 

The Super Sniper is a "bang for the buck" scope. I owned one on a 50 rifle and didn't care for it; though there are many who just love them...

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:07
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

yeah, i just researched the S&B scopes and were impressed/depressed.

i can't afford the tactical models - champagne tastes and beer money. as usual - heheh -

 

would it be taboo to put the highest quality hunting scope w/ a rangefinding or mildot reticle on top?

i can get a lot more glass for the money that way.

 

thanks

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:10
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

and if i can't economically put a range rifle together, i will just buy another hunting setup - hehe -

 

damn, i love guns....

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:18
Trinidad View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: May/04/2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1555

Hello Jon here are my pics for your aplication and budget, Tikka t3 tactical  300 win Mag.

Specially developed for heavy duty use by law enforcement agencies and tactical competition shooters. The action and free-floating, heavy barrel surfaces are magnese phosphatized for lasting protection. Muzzle thread for optional Sako muzzle brake or suppressor. The Picatinny rail on the top of the action takes any Weaver or U.S.Mil.Std. 1913 compatible mounts. The recoil pad is of black rubber and the lenght of pull may be adjusted with spacers. The standard 5-round magazines are tailored for each caliber for ultimate reliability and performance.
Overall length 24” barrel 1110 mm (43 3/4”)
  20” barrel 1020 mm (40 5/32”)
Barrel length 24” barrel 600 mm (23 3/4”)
  20” barrel 510 mm (20”)
Weight 24” barrel 3.7 kg (8 5/32 lbs)
  20” barrel 3.6 kg (8 lbs)
Short 223 Rem
Medium 308 Win
Magnum 300 Win Mag
300 WIN. MAG.                           [x]

190 Gr. Match Hollow PointAvailable in Molycoat
Velocity 2950 FPS
Energy 3672 Ft. Lbs.

Available in Molycoat AVAILABLE IN MOLYCOAT

When developing our .300 Win. Mag load, we started with the "Seal Team" .300 WM load which was developed for pure accuracy & long range performance. We modified the load to be within industry dimensions and to increase uniformity. The result is the best available 300 Win. Mag. precision ammunition.

  • Waterproof
  • Fogproof
  • Shockproof
  • 35mm tube diameter
  • Superior optical glass by Schott Glasswerk, Germany
  • Photo-engraved rangefinding reticle
  • Battery powered illumination system with 7 intensity settings
  • Mc-7 wideband fully-multicoat technology with anti-reflex layers eliminating glare and maximizing light transmission
  • Duro alloy housing, "O" ring sealed and nitrogen filled
  • Finger-adjustable knobs

Technical Data

 

Scope comes with  35MM rings.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:31
Duce View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: September/19/2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1231

You might want to check the website  www.richardscostomrifles.com and see what he builds and shoots and view the clips of their long range shots at ground hogs and the deer shot.

 

Duce

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 12:34
Duce View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: September/19/2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 1231

Sorry I mistyped the link it is www.richardscustomrifles.com

 

Duce

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 13:11
Dolphin View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master


Joined: October/05/2006
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 1795

Here are my 2 cents.  The 300 win. mag. would be my caliber of choice of the above.  Ammo is readily available and inexpense, relatively speaking in a variety of loads and bullet sizes.  I performance is more of an issue and you reload then a 300 Wby. Mag. would be my first choice, followed by a 30-378 Wby. Mag.  Now, here is where I am going to get alot of flack about barrel burners.  The 300Wby. Mag. to a lesser degree.  The Accumark, out of the box is well known to last for as many as 5000 rounds, as long as you do not take it to the range and put 200 shells through it in 30 minutes allowing the barrel to glow.  There is many a shooter with whom I have communicated through other forums and at the local ranges who have stated this to me.  In fact, too many to discount what they have to say.  In addition, if you are putting together a custom project, you will be wanting a bull barrell, which will have a longer life expectancy.  The accuracy achieved and the distances you want without having to straing the elevation adjustments on your scope or worse yet, have to cant it, will be well worth the money.  Heat is the great enemy to any rifle barrel and even my Accumark, which has a relatively heavy SS barrel does not heat up very fast in 60 degree weather.  Anyway, below is a few ballistic charts on the calibers noted above.  At short distances the differences are not significant, but at longer range they do become significant, especially energy, if you every want to hunt the rifle at long distances.   www.longrangehunter.com

 

 

        The headings for the columns are listed between the second and third chart.

 

 

 

 

    Ballistics Table for a 300 Win. Mag. with a 180 grain Nosler BT

         0     0.00     0.00      0.00        -1.5      0.0      0.0    2970    3525      0.0    0.0000 
        25    -0.75     0.00      0.00         0.2      0.0      0.0    2922    3411     -0.1    0.0255 
        50    -3.00     0.00      0.00         1.6      0.0      0.0    2874    3301     -0.5    0.0513 
        75    -3.50     0.00      0.00         2.8      0.0      0.0    2827    3193     -1.1    0.0776 
       100    -3.50     0.00      0.00         3.7      0.0      0.0    2780    3089     -2.0    0.1044 
       125    -3.25     0.00      0.00         4.3      0.0      0.0    2734    2987     -3.2    0.1316 
       150    -3.00     0.00      0.00         4.7      0.0      0.0    2688    2888     -4.7    0.1592 
       175    -2.50     0.00      0.00         4.7      0.0      0.0    2643    2791     -6.5    0.1874 
       200    -2.00     0.00      0.00         4.4      0.0      0.0    2598    2698     -8.6    0.2160 
       225    -1.75     0.00      0.00         3.8      0.0      0.0    2554    2607    -11.0    0.2451 
       250    -1.00     0.00      0.00         2.9      0.0      0.0    2510    2518    -13.7    0.2747 
       275    -0.50     0.00      0.00         1.6      0.0      0.0    2467    2432    -16.8    0.3048 
       300     0.00     0.00      0.00        -0.0      0.0      0.0    2424    2347    -20.3    0.3355 
       325     0.50     0.00      0.00        -2.0      0.0      0.0    2381    2266    -24.1    0.3667 
       350     1.25     0.00      0.00        -4.4      0.0      0.0    2339    2186    -28.3    0.3984 
       375     1.75     0.00      0.00        -7.2      0.0      0.0    2297    2109    -32.9    0.4308 
       400     2.50     0.00      0.00       -10.4      0.0      0.0    2256&n

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 14:26
mwyates View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 1196
If you're going to shoot a lot, most people get tired of recoil from a 300 Mag, and certainly anything larger.  That's why so many of the 1000 yd shooters have gone to the 6.5X284.  Low recoil, and the long 6.5mm bullets have ballistic coefficients greater than .500.  My good friend shot 1000 yds. for a long time with a 30-378.  He made the switch to the 6.5X284.  His scores improved immediately.  He won't touch a 30-378 any more.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 15:06
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

do i have to handload to acheive good results downrange? or is there good factory loads for the above calibers?

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 15:14
Roy Finn View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Steiner Junkie

Joined: April/05/2004
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 4856
If your looking at the 300 WM, there are several loads from the factory that offer the 190 gr.Sierra BT loads, like Federal Gold Match, Black Hills etc. You're not going to want to log alot of rounds downrange behind a 300 WM. I start to get punchy after 25-30 rounds of 300 WM 180 gr. loads. Recoil and muzzle blast are pretty significant. If you are looking for a Remmy 700, you might want to hold off till next year when they put the new trigger on the 700's. It is going to be as good as any after market trigger out there. Just my 2cs.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 16:12
Dolphin View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master


Joined: October/05/2006
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 1795
I have to admit, recoil is a factor when shooting the heavy magnums, but the drops in the small calibers are significant and will require 30 mm tubed scopes and possibly canting.  But, it is a factor to consider, after getting pounded so many times.  My 30-378 has a muzzle brake and kicks far less than my 300 win. mag., but it is loud as hell.  I wear plugs and muffs.  Tough decision.  Let us know what you decide on and how it goes.  But, if long distance hunting ever is going to be in the cards, energy down field, must be considered.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2006 at 16:14
Dolphin View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master


Joined: October/05/2006
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 1795
By the way, the above tables, are from factory loads.  Federal Vital Shock for the 300win.mag. and Wby. ammo for the Wby. calibers.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 08:13
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

good to know guys - thanks for the input.

 

what about the 300 WSM? is it a decent long ranger? or the 338 WSM?

 

 

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 08:18
mwyates View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 1196

You will have to handload the 6.5X.284 (all serious bench shooters handload).  Check out the ballistics table below for a 6.5mm 140gr bullet at 3000fps.  It beats the 300 Win Mag and won't kill your shoulder or ears.

 

Max Point blank range is 299 yds when zeroed at 253 yds.
Range
yds
Path
in
ComeUp
clicks
Velocity
fps
Energy
ft/lbs
Momentum
lb ft/s
ToF
sec
Windage
in
Windage
clicks
Optimal
Game Wgt
Muzzle -1.5 Infinity 3000 2798 60.00 0.000 0.0 NaN 794
100 3.6 -14 2815 2463 56.30 0.103 0.0 0 656
200 4.3 -8 2637 2162 52.75 0.213 0.0 0 539
300 0.0 0 2467 1892 49.35 0.331 0.0 0 442
400 -10.0 10 2304 1650 46.08 0.457 0.0 0 360
500 -26.6 20 2147 1433 42.95 0.592 0.0 0 291
600 -50.7 32 1996 1239 39.92 0.737 0.0 0 234
700 -83.6 46 1852 1066 37.03 0.893 0.0 0 187
800 -126.7 60 1715 914 34.29 1.061 0.0 0 148
900 -181.5 77 1585 781 31.70 1.243 0.0 0 117
1000 -250.3 96 1465 667 29.30 1.441 0.0 0 92

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 08:28
jonbravado View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: October/05/2006
Status: Offline
Points: 1131

that's impressive for a small projectile - i may give it a closer look.

 

lots of good info guys - thanks!!

 

recoil may be a deciding factor -

i shot a synthetic 7 mag the other day and the recoil and percussion rattled me to the core.

great, flat gun, but i won't shoot it again - hhehehe

 

J

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 09:03
ceylonc View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman


Joined: September/13/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 514

I have to agree w/mwyates with regard to caliber selection.  The 6.5/284 is a fantastic round

for 1,000yd shots.  It can be a barrel-burner but so long as you keep the barrel heat down you

should be fine.  Even if you only get 1,500-2,500 rds., it's not like a custom barrel is going to

cost over $600.  If you're looking at doing a custom rifle, you can certainly save enough money

in a short amount of time to get a new barrel...

 

With regard to optics, I LOVE the IOR 35mm 6x24 50mm and the MP8 reticle .  Nightforce also

makes a great scope for your applications and they also offer a number of reticles from which

to choose.  Obviously S&B and USO are the "cat's ass" for tactical uses but they also

command a small fortune. 

 

Don't forget to spend wisely on your scope base & rings.  I can't imagine a reason why you

wouldn't go with a one-piece picatinny base.  For rings, there are a number of really good ones

out there from $50-200.  A few that I have used or personally inspected and can recommend are

Warne, Seekins Precision, Badger Ordinance, TPS, and A.R.M.S., IOR.

 

Best of luck!

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 12:19
mwyates View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 1196
I haven't heard any reports of the 6.5-284 being particular hard on barrels.  It's not super fast and doesn't burn much powder.  The table above used a ballistic coefficient of .500.  The Sierra 142gr matchpoint has a BC of .595 and would best those numbers significantly.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 14:49
Dolphin View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master


Joined: October/05/2006
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 1795
While we are suggesting calibers, especially wildcats, but with a little more recoil. what about a 6.5-06?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 15:49
mwyates View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master
Avatar

Joined: June/15/2004
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 1196
The 6.5-06 is good, too, but not quite as efficient a cartridge as the 6.5-284.   My choice up from the 6.5-284 would be the .264 Win Mag.  It burns a good bit more powder to get 200 more fps, though.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 16:19
ceylonc View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman


Joined: September/13/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 514

Originally posted by mwyates mwyates wrote:

I haven't heard any reports of the 6.5-284 being particular hard on barrels.  It's not super fast and doesn't burn much powder.  The table above used a ballistic coefficient of .500.  The Sierra 142gr matchpoint has a BC of .595 and would best those numbers significantly.

 

Check out 6mmbr.com.  Many of the posters there have described instances of only getting 1,000-1,500 rounds out of 6.5-284 barrels.  I imagine this has to do with competitions that require the shooter to squeeze off 20-22 rounds in a short amount of time (10 minutes or less).

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2006 at 16:46
Dolphin View Drop Down
Optics Master
Optics Master


Joined: October/05/2006
Location: North Carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 1795

I tend to agree, as my experience is with high power Wby. magnum calibers, which are known as barrel burners and is grossly incorrect.  If you sit and shoot a 30-378 multiple times over a short period of time and do this every day, then it will be a barrel burner.  But, there are many well documented rifles in this caliber with over 5000 rounds still shooting accurately.  Since everyone on this site knows I love my Wby. calibers, I just thought I would post the ballistics for a 257 Wby. Magnum with a 115 grain Nosler BT, which has a BC of 0.453.  Not to collapse any bubbles on wildcats, but this caliber and bullet has superior ballistics ot the above mentioned 6,5-284 and at 1000 yard is just shy of it, in energy.  Recoil, should not be much different.  Just some food, or should I say powder, for thought.

                         Excuse the headliners, I cannot get them to match, but forget about the unintelligble markings and everything else should make sense.

 

     Yards  MOA         &am p;nb sp;         &am p;nb sp;   sp;   Inches     &am p;am p;nb sp;   Velocity Energy Path    TOF         &am p;am p;nb sp;         &am p;am p;nb sp;

          0     0.00     0.00      0.00        -1.5      0.0      0.0    3400    2951      0.0    0.0000 
        25     0.75     0.00      0.00        -0.2      0.0      0.0    3341    2850     -0.1    0.0222 
        50    -1.75     0.00      0.00         1.0      0.0      0.0    3283    2752     -0.4    0.0449 
        75    -2.50     0.00      0.00         1.9      0.0      0.0    3226    2658     -0.9    0.0679 
       100    -2.50     0.00      0.00         2.6      0.0      0.0    3170    2566     -1.6    0.0914 
       125    -2.50     0.00      0.00         3.2      0.0      0.0    3115    2477     -2.5    0.1152 
       150    -2.25     0.00      0.00         3.4      0.0      0.0    3060    2391     -3.6    0.1395 
       175    -2.00     0.00      0.00         3.5      0.0      0.0    3006    2307     -5.0    0.1642 
       200    -1.50     0.00      0.00         3.3      0.0      0.0    2952    2225     -6.6    0.1894 
       225    -1.25     0.00      0.00         2.9      0.0      0.0    2899    2146     -8.4    0.2150 
       250    -0.75     0.00      0.00         2.2      0.0      0.0    2847    2069    -10.6    0.2411 
       275    -0.50     0.00      0.00         1.2      0.0      0.0    2795    1995    -12.9    0.2677 
       300     0.00     0.00      0.00        -0.0      0.0      0.0    2744    1923    -15.6    0.2948 
       325     0.50     0.00      0.00        -1.5      0.0      0.0    2694    1853    -18.5    0.3223 
       350     1.00     0.00      0.00        -3.3      0.0      0.0    2644    1785    -21.8    0.3504 
       375     1.50     0.00      0.00        -5.5      0.0      0.0    2595    1719    -25.3    0.3790 
       400     2.00     0.00      0.00        -7.9      0.0      0.0    2546    1655    -29.2    0.4082 
       425     2.50     0.00      0.00       -10.7      0.0      0.0    2498    1593&n

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  1 2 3>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Similar Threads: "Ideal LONG RANGE RIFLE"
Subject Author Forum Replies Last Post
Building my first long range rifle modingus Tactical Scopes 5 2/20/2007 11:44:02 AM
New Swarovski X5 Long Range Rifle Scopes Chris Farris Tactical Scopes 6
Scout scope for long range? Flick Rifle Scopes 10 5/17/2006 11:42:57 AM
Long Range Optics... cheaptrick Tactical Scopes 11 4/1/2006 4:27:09 AM
Var-X III Long Range??? blsnelling Rifle Scopes 2 8/12/2005 9:00:58 AM
Long range varminting scopes suggestions Jeffro3006mag Varmint Scopes 5 1/18/2006 3:28:21 PM
Which long range scope? john Rifle Scopes 6 9/23/2004 8:41:38 AM
Long Range Hunting Scope Canyon Runner Rifle Scopes 33 1/28/2005 10:58:24 AM
Long range scope LongRange Tactical Scopes 9 6/27/2005 11:42:08 AM
Ultimate Long Range Varmint Scope Lord Windsor Varmint Scopes 10 4/20/2007 11:06:06 AM


This page was generated in 0.328 seconds.