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How good is the glass in the SWFA SS scopes?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/02/2012 at 21:27
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Just wondering if they are a good one to look at. Glass quality is pretty important to me.
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Specifically which models? The $299 fixed scopes have awesome glass for the money. I cannot comment personally on the more expensive ones but everyone on any forum I have read likes the glass a lot.
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Talking hd models here. To me they look very close to ior glass. I think it is excellent. I have a swaro z6 and i dont think it is quite that good, but it is pretty close.
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My 3-9 SS glass doesn't give up anything to my Conquests. Have a Swaro that is better, but it was over twice the price, so big deal.
Those SS knob thingys- those really float my boat- clickety clickety and back again, just where they started- always.
i've had it on several different rifles and liked it everywhere it's been- almost ruins a guy for regular hunting scopes.
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It is not going to be the same as the Premier you ordered.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 07:55
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well obviously the Premier is in a whole different league.  But I am looking for a higher magnification scope and really can't stomach another 3500 for the 5-24 heritage. Who makes these SWFA scopes? is it like a "store" brand where a third party is building them and then SWFA puts their name on it. Or do they have an optics factory and build them themselves?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 14:59
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Not sure about others, but my SS appears to be Tasco-made, inasmuch as the included papers have Tasco registered trademark info/wording in some places.
 
I think the glass on my 10x42 (not HD) is alright.  It has an odd quality to it that makes it almost seem as though I can't quite get centered in the exit pupil.  There's sort of a ...shadow-like? quality to it, which moves around a bit as I move within the eye box.  Still works fine, though.  In all honesty and candor, my few-years-older $79 Tasco Varmint 2.5-10x scope provides a better, if slightly more restricted (in terms of eye box, when set to 10x to match the SS), view.  This is in bright daylight.  I have no cause at this point to be shooting either of the guns these scopes are mounted on at dawn/dusk.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 15:13
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Tasco was the 2nd or 3rd owner of the Super Sniper brand.  They were a great scope initially and then Tasco began to cut corners and the quality dropped.  SWFA bought the rights for them at some point and started making them up to the proper spec and even improved parts of them.  This was the fixed 10x, 16x and 20x models.  They are made in Japan by an optics company for SWFA.

While this line does not have the best glass available (as it should not and cannot for the price) it is very usable and the repeatability and durability of the scopes are excellent

Then SWFA created a whole new line with the SS HD models.  Speced out and designed by SWFA with input from shooters and customers.  They share nothing similar with the original line including who makes them.  They are trying to discontinue the Super Sniper name as well as it is now the SS line.  The glass quality in those is every bit as good as anything in their price range and a ways above.  Again the adjustments have been great for them. 

SWFA continues to improve both lines by adding new features and models to both lines.  They have a more budget friendly line with the original line and with the HD line has a line that runs well with the mid to higher end scopes out there.  Its is just win win for shooters

Rumor is they will continue to develop the brand by adding new lines and options.  I am hoping for hunting scopes.  Big Grin 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 15:18
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

   I am hoping for hunting scopes.  Big Grin 


I am hoping for a 16 or 20x HD.
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Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

   I am hoping for hunting scopes.  Big Grin 


I am hoping for a 16 or 20x HD.

 
Buy a SS5x20 and set it on 16 or 20 and have the best of both worlds.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 15:22
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I forgot to say the reason they still come with Tasco documentation is when SWFA bought the line they also got all the boxes and manuals with them.  So to help keeps the costs down they decided to keep using them instead of making all new stuff.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 15:40
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Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

   I am hoping for hunting scopes.  Big Grin 


I am hoping for a 16 or 20x HD.

 
Buy a SS5x20 and set it on 16 or 20 and have the best of both worlds.



But it will cost me over 60% more for the 5-20 assuming that a 16 or 20x HD cost the same as a 10x HD.
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Gappa I hate to tell you this,once you have looked through a Premier it  will be very hard to buy anything else.I don't own a herritage but I do own the Hunter & LT.Paul @ Premier told me they use the same glass in all their models.The Hunter is half the price of the Herritage.You might also want to take a look at the SWARO Z5 line,Same glass as my Z6I & 40% cheaper.
 
If you still don't want to spend that kind of money the glass in SS is very good, you can't go wrong for the money.
 
 


Edited by stickbow46 - July/03/2012 at 21:52
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 15:44
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MZ5,Welcome to the OT!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 16:37
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For anyone who wants to share, who makes the VERY BEST glass (price is not an issue).  I spent a fair amount for my precision .308 (right at $4000), so I want the BEST scope I can find, with the best possible glass!!!!  It's for long range shooting.  Also, could anyone please explain why someone would want a SFP vs an FFP?  I don't understand the purpose of having a SFP (just to make sure I understand the difference, with an FFP, the reticle lines stay the same as the target is magnified, but with a SFP, the reticle lines are magnified along with the target, so if the target is small, you might not even be able to see it because of the size of the reticle lines.  Is this correct?).  Also, I know I want an illuminated reticle, but I'm not sure which type of reticle I get...Mil or MOA.  I said it was for long range shooting and eventually I'd like to reach for 1000-1200 yards, so while I MIGHT have to get a more powerful rifle (do you think my .308 can do 1000 yards?), I want to go ahead and get the best possible optic now rather than later.  Regarding magnification, I was thinking 4 to 5 - 25 to 30 x 40 to 50.  Do you think I'm close regarding magnification?  Also, I want parallax adjustment, BDC and .25 MOA or .1 MIL adjustments.  I'm REALLY leaning towards the Swarovski Z6i.  They have a 5-30x50 with 1/6 MOA clicks (5mm per click at 100 meters) unless I chose the BT turret system, in which case the clicks would be .36 in. at 100 meters.  Also, what is a BT turret system?  They also offer a "long range reticle", not sure what that means.  The other options are BT or custom BT reticles, not sure what the custom is, but I've emailed them and asked some questions.  So would you guys help out a newbie?  Sorry for any stupid questions.Big Grin
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 17:14
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Originally posted by stickbow46 stickbow46 wrote:



MZ5,Welcome to the OT!


Thanks! I've checked in from time to time for a couple years, and finally decided to sign up. :)

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Originally posted by dnilson dnilson wrote:

Also, could anyone please explain why someone would want a SFP vs an FFP?  I don't understand the purpose of having a SFP (just to make sure I understand the difference, with an FFP, the reticle lines stay the same as the target is magnified, but with a SFP, the reticle lines are magnified along with the target, so if the target is small, you might not even be able to see it because of the size of the reticle lines.  Is this correct?).


If I understand what you mean properly, this is backwards. A first focal plane reticle is magnified along with the target as you increase scope magnification. A second focal plane reticle is not. Another way to think of it is that with a first focal plane reticle, the reticle stays the same size relative to the target. With a second focal plane reticle, the apparent size of the reticle gets smaller, compared to the target, as you increase scope magnification.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 19:18
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FFP  increased magnification increases how bold the reticle appears.  They appear quiet fine at lowest power with the mil dot version of the 3-9 so the mil quad is preferable as it is a bolder reticle on the sides.  The appearance is that the reticle grows larger as power increases, while in fact the reticle corresponds precisely to one MIL so in actuality the reticle always corresponds the same to the target. It would be just like nailing a yard stick to a 100 yd target and looking through a scope at 3x looks small then turning power up to 9x looks much larger but in fact it is the same yard stick and it has not changed in size.  
 
With Second Focal Plane the reticle appears to always look the same to the viewer but with a high power mil dot type reticle at 20x the mil dots appear to cover the entire area of the reticle almost so some manufacturers use either 10x or 12x as the correct setting to range find with their scopes mil dots as that is the setting where they are quite useful but dont appear excessive in size.
 
Personally I like the 5-20x50 Mil Quad a lot and have really enjoyed owning that scope. I also like the
 3-9x42 Mil Quad and find that it represents the best value I know of in optics.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/03/2012 at 19:48
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Yes, MZ5, you have the FFP thing correct.  Describing it is tricky.  With FFP, the reticle changes in apparent size as the magnification changes, but always stays the same true angular size as the objects in the scene.  With 2nd Focal Plane, you get a reticle that always 'looks' same size.  With simple duplex reticles, 2nd focal plane is best.  With measuring reticles that don't get used at max-power all the time, FFP is the only way to go.

SWFA SS has a few different quality bars.  Usually the SS HD scopes are top-notch, while the SS (no-HD) are less impressive.  The sub-$500 non-HD scopes don't impress me glass-wise.  (I had an SS 3-9x from a couple or 3 years ago).  Its was fine for most purposes however, and I really didn't need more glass, and it wasn't bad, colors were crisp and bright enough, just a bit hazy.

Now, the 1-4 HD I had was really great.  Super crisp and bright with no color issues and no hazing.  Of course 4x isn't all that tough of a test, but it was some of the best glass I've seen.  Its difficult to imagine a need for better glass.   If its not the best, you're not giving up much on the leader.

With the cheaper non-HD scopes, you don't buy it for the glass, you buy it for the tracking, turrets, toughness, and reliability.    With the HD models, you get those things plus very good glass.

The HD 1-4 was good enough, I'm now waiting on my 3rd and 4th SWFA SS scope. Bandito
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Originally posted by Chrome223 Chrome223 wrote:

With measuring reticles that don't get used at max-power all the time, FFP is the only way to go.
 
With the cheaper non-HD scopes, you don't buy it for the glass, you buy it for the tracking, turrets, toughness, and reliability.

Thanks everyone for the information, but I'm still unclear about what I need.  Maybe I should clarify a couple of things.  The reticle I choose WILL, eventually, be used at maximum power most of the time, because I plan to use it for competitive long distance shooting (1000 + yards) and I DO want an HD scope. Also, I'm prepared to spend as much as it takes ($3000 +)  for the best glass and the most accurate and reliable scope I can find.  If you could have ANY scope for long distance shooting, which one would it be?  Rocket Launcher
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Originally posted by dnilson dnilson wrote:

For anyone who wants to share, who makes the VERY BEST glass (price is not an issue).  I spent a fair amount for my precision .308 (right at $4000), so I want the BEST scope I can find, with the best possible glass!!!!  It's for long range shooting. 


Opinions will vary, but if you want the very best LR scope money can buy, I'd look at Hensoldt and/or March.  There may be other optics that are just as good, but none better in an absolute sense.
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Originally posted by dnilson dnilson wrote:

Thanks everyone for the information, but I'm still unclear about what I need.  Maybe I should clarify a couple of things.  The reticle I choose WILL, eventually, be used at maximum power most of the time, because I plan to use it for competitive long distance shooting (1000 + yards) and I DO want an HD scope. Also, I'm prepared to spend as much as it takes ($3000 +)  for the best glass and the most accurate and reliable scope I can find.  If you could have ANY scope for long distance shooting, which one would it be?  Rocket Launcher


Perhaps, just as a suggestion, you would prefer to buy a couple of scopes and see how you like them? The hyper-expensive scopes don't seem to sell for very much less than new prices, on the secondary market, so one would probably not be out too much with such an approach. Plus, then you'd have the benefit of your own preferences and viewpoint, rather than hoping others' preferences, viewpoints, and perceptions of things. Just a thought.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/04/2012 at 10:28
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I'm really leaning towards a Swarovski Z6i, but no else has even mentioned them.  Why is that?  I've been told they have some of the best glass available.  Is this not the case?  Thanks!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/04/2012 at 14:36
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Originally posted by MZ5 MZ5 wrote:

Originally posted by dnilson dnilson wrote:

Thanks everyone for the information, but I'm still unclear about what I need.  Maybe I should clarify a couple of things.  The reticle I choose WILL, eventually, be used at maximum power most of the time, because I plan to use it for competitive long distance shooting (1000 + yards) and I DO want an HD scope. Also, I'm prepared to spend as much as it takes ($3000 +)  for the best glass and the most accurate and reliable scope I can find.  If you could have ANY scope for long distance shooting, which one would it be?  Rocket Launcher


Perhaps, just as a suggestion, you would prefer to buy a couple of scopes and see how you like them? The hyper-expensive scopes don't seem to sell for very much less than new prices, on the secondary market, so one would probably not be out too much with such an approach. Plus, then you'd have the benefit of your own preferences and viewpoint, rather than hoping others' preferences, viewpoints, and perceptions of things. Just a thought.

I truly hope you're trying to be helpful and not sarcastic.  Hard to tell.  I'm very interested in the preferences, viewpoints and perceptions of others as a means of learning what others, more knowledgeable than I, believe to be the more valuable, high quality optics.  Surely there was a time when you were new and had to learn from others.  Also, I'm not rich, but am comfortable and have worked long and VERY hard for my money, so when I say price is no object, I'm not trying to be ostentatious, just saying that I've worked hard for what I have and can now afford the best (I'm in my 50's).  I love to shoot and would like to compete, but I have a nerve injury in my leg which prevents me from getting involved in 3 gun competitions and I thought long range competitions might be an option...hence the interest in getting the best scope possible.  Also, why buy two scopes, when, with time and learning (believe it or not, I've done quite a bit of research on my own, but there is no substitute for experience and all I'm asking for is help from those with experience, rather than dealing with sales people who have their own agendas), I can buy one, best possible scope and get it right the first time.  

I know S&B makes extremely good optics, but I'm most interested in the very BEST possible glass and the more I read, it appears that Zeiss may make the best glass.  Anyone agree/disagree?  Thanks in advance!
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Also, I'm not asking for anyone to actually choose the best scope for me, just wanting the consensus on the best possible glass and answers to a few other questions.  I can take it from there.
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