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High end spotting scope?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2009 at 15:46
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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HI, All
 
 I am new to the forum but it looks like you guys have a ton of helpful info. I have a swarovski 20-60x80mm HD that I am debating on selling. I was looking at the new swarovski models and the new leica telavid 82mm and was wondering if any body had info on these yet? The telavid is a 25-50 zoom and I am not sure I wanna give up the extra power? Or is the scope I have good enough that I will not really be gaing anything major for difference in price. Thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2009 at 16:49
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Unless you just like the dual ratio focus knobs on the Leica enough that it's worth the massive difference in $ you'll have to part with to get it, I would stick with what you've got.  Really, the only significant difference between the HD spotter you have and the new Swaro models is the improvements to the eyepiece.  On the Swaro, the new eyepiece is interchangeable with the scope you already have.
 
The newest, latest and greatest Swaro zoom eyepiece is also 25-50X, just like the new Televid.  Yes, you give up extra power, but in exchange, the eyepieces of both are wide angle all the way through the entire power range, whereas previously, only the fixed power eyepieces were considered "wide angle."  The view through the new 25-50X W eyepieces are superior to the previous 20-60X eyepieces.  I think the loss of power on the high end is more than compensated by the improved FOV.  I have a previous generation Leica Televid 77 APO with the 20-60X eyepiece, and in my view, the image quality drops enough beyond 50X that I seldom ever use power beyond that anyway, so I view the new wide angle zoom eyepieces as a very positive advancement!  I also have 20X and 32X fixed eyepieces because the view through them is much better than through the variable when set at the same magnifications. 
 
Again, the new 25-50X Swaro eyepiece is compatible with your scope, unlike the new Leica eyepiece, which isn't compatible with the previous Televid.
 
The Swaro HD scopes are great.  If I were you, I might just buy one of the new eyepieces, but I would keep the scope you have, as you won't notice any difference optically, when using the same eyepiece.  I've not looked through the new Leica spotter, but I've heard it's phenomenal.  However, no matter how good it is, it is so ridiculously expensive that I personally could never justify owning one!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2009 at 16:56
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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Rifeldude thanks for the great info. I have seen the telavid on there web sight but actually have no idea what the cost is. Same with swarovski, but it does look like they are both alot lighter so thats why I wanted to look. I actually have 2 of the swarovski's so I still have one either way. But maybe I can sell one get an eyepice like you said and come out way ahead. Thanks agian
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2009 at 17:15
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Originally posted by muleycrazy muleycrazy wrote:

  I have seen the telavid on there web sight but actually have no idea what the cost is.
 
Try $3200 for the body only (without the eyepiece) and $4000 with the zoom eyepiece!
 
Ridiculous!
 
Still interested?Wink
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/21/2009 at 17:53
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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WOW Shocked You are right I think thats a little steep.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:12
Tranan View Drop Down
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No, worries man, the scope you already have is good enough. There is always something better but I will say this: I do not understand the idea of 25-50x mag when you can have a 20-60x instead. I mean what's the catch?Whacko
 
The prices on the new Leica are sooo off the wall that I have no idea what those guys were thinking of. When you have the Diascope and the Prominar and not the least Swarovski with fairly good prices, why would anyone pay so much for a Leica?
 
So if you want better try the Diascope and the Prominar HD instead!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:27
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Originally posted by Tranan Tranan wrote:

I do not understand the idea of 25-50x mag when you can have a 20-60x instead. I mean what's the catch?Whacko
 


The 25-50X has a wide field of view throughout the whole zoom range equivalent to fixed eyepieces at the same magnifications.  With the 20-60X zoom range, the tradeoff is narrower FOV and tunnel vision at the lower magnifications.  Prior to this eyepiece, the consumer had to make a choice between high magnification and wide field of view, but with typical 3X zooms, designing an eyepiece with wide FOV wasn't possible without making the eyepiece huge.  I have a 20-60X zoom as well as both 20X and 32X fixed eyepieces with my scope, and I can tell you without a doubt that the fixed eyepieces have MUCH better image quality and wider FOV than the zoom set at the same magnification!  So, that is why fixed eyepieces are popular with many spotting scope users.  With this eyepiece, you can have both in the same eyepiece to some degree, but the tradeoff is loss of top end magnification.  This especially appeals to birdwatchers and people who take digiscope pictures with their spotter.  Swaro used the same design philosophy with their new 25-50X zoom as well.  Personally, if I could have a wide field 25-50X eyepiece for my spotter, I would very much prefer it over the standard 20-60X zoom I have.  Image quality drops considerably after 50X anyway.

Personally, I do agree the Prominar HD image quality is better than Swaro, but I disagree that the Diascope has a better image.  The Diascope is certainly nice, but I think the Swaro has at least as good an image, maybe better, since the Diascope typically has a little astigmatism around the edge of the field. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:37
Tranan View Drop Down
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Thank you for the explanation.
I totally agree on the fact that the fixed mags are better than the variable ones. It's true on the spotting scopes as well as on the rifle scopes. However the modern zoom eyepieces are so good nowadays that I do not really see the need for the fixed ones and the hassel of having to remove them all the time, thus wasting precious observation moments.
I use my scope primarily for birdwatching and I can tell you, that zoom eyepiece I have is heavily used Smile, which is why I love it.  I would by no means consider changing it for a fixed one.
 
Interesting about the large field of view on the 25-50x though. It's obviously positive, but the loss of so much magnification is still a problem.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:38
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If weight is an issue another plus about the Swaro spotters is the new (x)TM (magnesium) bodies are lighter and more compact than the (x)TS bodies. If I'm understanding the specs correctly the STM 80 HD is 6+inches shorter and 12oz lighter than the STS 80 HD.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:43
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Simple (auto tracking), reserved, yet effective.
Especially useful for longer range shooting...
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 18:52
Tranan View Drop Down
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This thing with the weight I do not see as importnat at all regarding the spotting scopes. I do not want my scope to be too light as it feels more unstable. You carry them often shorter distances, have a strap etc.
 
A lighter weight is not necessarly a disadvantage but I wouldn't wanna pay more money for it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/29/2009 at 19:55
mike650 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Tranan Tranan wrote:

This thing with the weight I do not see as importnat at all regarding the spotting scopes. I do not want my scope to be too light as it feels more unstable. You carry them often shorter distances, have a strap etc.
 
A lighter weight is not necessarly a disadvantage but I wouldn't wanna pay more money for it.


Depends on what your doing with it. Your bird and planet watching requirements may differ from my hunting or even someone elses target shooting requirements. If your packing your spotter weight and bulk could make a huge difference. The new Swaro 80 isn't about a couple of ounces, it's almost a pound difference and close to the same form factor as the 65mm but with the benefits of a larger objective for maximum light at longer distances. 

Yippee





Edited by mike650 - May/31/2009 at 00:16
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/01/2009 at 10:25
JGRaider View Drop Down
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Optically speaking, I'd keep what you've got.  My guess is you'd see a marginal improvement in optics at a premium price tag. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/02/2009 at 19:32
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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Yep, talked with several guys that have them in stock. The kicker is the weight loss that was speculated, well it cuts 3 oz thats it. The 25-50x eye peice is 1oz heavier then the 20-60x. So nothing to write home about here.
 
 The wide angel lens is signivicate differenc for sure. at 25x it is 20ft wider feild of view then the 20x setting on older eyepice so there is no reason to start woth 20x.
 
 I due still have a brand new 20-60x80 HD for sale if anybody is intrested PM me. Thanks for all the great info guys.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/04/2009 at 20:29
John Barsness View Drop Down
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Keep what you have. Too many people chase the tiniest (and often theoretical) differences in optics these days. You wil; not fail to observe any big muley buck with what you have, believe me.

With the money saved you might want to upgrade other stuff, but you ain't going to buy significantly better optics than what you have, at least until maybe 2025.

 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/05/2009 at 11:40
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JB, may I ask what is your favorite all around spotter for big game hunting?  I've pretty much narrowed my search to a 60-65mm class spotter.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/10/2009 at 16:49
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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raider, its hard to beat the image quality of the swaros, plus they have about the best customer service around.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/11/2009 at 09:25
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muley, have you looked through the Kowa Prominar TSN 664?  I've found a great buy on one, but never looked through this model.  I'm trying not to spend $2k ona spotter right now.  Thanks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/11/2009 at 22:07
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JG Raider,

I have too many spotting scopes to pick a favorite, but here are some thoughts:

For daypack use the 12-4x60 mirror Leupold and Meopta draw-tube models would make the top of my list, because they fit better in a pack than most and are top-notch optically.

I have both smaller and larger scopes, but those are the two that get most of the use for my kinds of hunting.
 
If you'd like more details on the others then I'd be happy to provide them. I have spotters from Nikon, Swarovski, Alpen, Bushnell etc. etc. The good ones are all worth the price. But in genral I find the ergonomics for specific uses more important than the optics, because the best optics are all so good these days, even a little below the really high-priced stuff.
 
 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/11/2009 at 22:38
muleycrazy View Drop Down
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raider, No I havent personally looked throught one. But from what I here they are a great glass for the money. Good luck
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: June/12/2009 at 16:34
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I met several guys who owned expensive spotting scopes. They all agree that Kowa probably make the best spotting scope on the market right now.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/04/2009 at 13:07
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Based on all the forums and reviews pages etc that I have read, in MY OPINION it seems that the best big Spotter is the kowa TSN Prominar 883 and even the 774 as many birders acclaim it,  for the 60-65 class, the best one is the swaro 65 HD,  and for all  that I have read, for hunters as us, if we get this little swaro by its optic and size qualities we don´t need to go up to a 80mm class, means that here we have got enough (full)  spotting scope for our purpose (hunting speaking).
The only bad news that I have for you guys is the tag, and maybe this reason is why there is no way te get one cheap!!
Off course there are other options in the market and they are not far behind swaro; Kowa TSN 664, nikon fieldscope ED, and Zeiss Diascope, as many experts mention them, so if there aren´t enough bucks we could consider any of these..
In my case it is really a pitty that zeiss doesn´t have a 60X eyepiece, because I have some zeiss products and I´m happy with them and would buy a diascope if there would be a 60X EP , does any body know if there would be one soon? (before the coming hunting season)
Please post your opinions, as I want to know if I have discovered the truth of the spotters!
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