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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 11:10
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Optics GrassHopper
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Gentlemen,

Yesterday I ordered the SWFA SS 1.4 (capped donut).  Very excited about this scope.  (and thanks to SWFA for the double battery - nice touch). 

I'm looking for advice on a second scope (which I will also purchase from SWFA - if for no other reason than to show appreciation for their sponsorship of this forum).  Application will be on a Noveske N4 16 inch (amazingly accurate, but then, that is their reputation).  That means, to me (not to start an argument), that I have the rotational velocity and linear velocity to place 500 yards w most bullet weights, certainly with the heavier 75-77 - PLUS- in this case, I'd like the scope to double , to some extent - as a field monocular - so I'd like to have the range, resolution, and contrast to be able to "see" into distances.  Sharp , bright, clear.  Which means, I can't really place a dollar limit on this one (well, ok, so 2k to 2.5k seems realistic).  but there are some constraints - weight being the foremost.  I have an IOR 3-18 on a 20" 6.5G (snipers hide ffp).  It's what I would call "decent" glass and eye box, and good reticle for what it is - but as some may know, it is also boat anchor heavy.    the other constraint , related to weight, is objective diameter - where I think 42 mm has to be the upper limit - just don't want the weight and bulk that comes with larger. Variable range - well, I'm not sure I want to be the guinea pig for the new 8x optics.   I've seen the ads/ specs for the S&B 8x.  A marvel to be sure, but something tells me there are compromises at some point, that physics is being pushed behind a curtain in order to serve the marketing gods.   So I'll pass on that for now.   And finally, of course, it needs a decent reticle with illumination.   I've got the accupoint 30mm 1-4x with the triangle post.  That's what I'd call a great day light reticle , not sure if that can be duplicated w electronics but ? 

My leading candidate at this point is the Swaro 1.7-10 CD-i.  The reticle is the weak spot in that rig, I think.  For example - the SWFA SS 1-4x24 donut w mil dot is my idea of a really well thought out reticle (although it would have to be FFP to work, which it is).  And as I said, I ordered one of these yesterday - willing to play guinea pig on that one.  But in this application - at this price point - I'd prefer more of a known quantity. 

thank you in advance.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 11:44
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Chief Sackscratch

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I would say test the SS 1-4 and youll get another with the t reticle and exposed turrets.....
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 11:57
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Optics GrassHopper
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Crossed my mind.  Problem there is the 4x top end.  Tolerable for targeting purposes to 500 yds, if not ideal.  but not enough arse for monocular / spotting duties.  Getting the sense that I may be looking for a chicken with lips.  we'll see.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 11:59
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Chief Sackscratch

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what about the SS 3-9?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 15:10
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Optics Jedi Knight
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That Swaro 1.7-10 has some amazing glass.  Best I have looked through to date.  If you intend to use it at night, you would probably want a 4a reticle and illumination.  At least that is the way I would go.  I think I would go with the 2-12 though.  Little more top end and only giving up 0.3 on the low end.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 15:50
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Optics GrassHopper
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SS 3-9 has no illum.  The 3x is getting tight on FOV.  33 ft vs 75 ft for swaro (partly due to magnification of course).  And I don't see any HD 3-9 listed any longer. 

helo19- why the 4a vs the circle dot illum?  I find, in general, I am faster with circle type reticles.  While I agree that thick posts are helpful in low light , with the good illum of the Swaro - maybe not as much a factor? 

regarding the 2-12x.  interesting.  a couple ounces heavier (10%).  an inch longer (8%), 7/16" more objective bell (25%), and 10 ft narrower FOV at min mag (15%).  That gets me from 10x to 12x on top mag.  Not sure I feel the trade off is worthwhile.  good suggestion however.  thank you.

I'd be happy with a 1-8x optic.  but not with a 24mm (1inch) objective glass.  8x24 isn't sounding like it's going to be a challenger to the Hubble telescope.   Wish the swaro 1.7 was an FFP reticle.  Strong preference. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 16:07
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Optics Jedi Master
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USO makes a 1-8, but it isn't what I'd call a perfect fit for the Noveski.

I'd say screw the weight consideration and buy the Premier on the sample list, it is heavy, glass is fantastic, reticle is great, turrets are great, it is an amazing scope.  It is heavy as balls and has a larger objective than you want; however, if color, contrast, and image quality are the primary considerations, Premier is almost as good as it gets.

The Swaro would be a good choice too, not exactly what you outline, but great glass is great glass.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 16:22
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Optics GrassHopper
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Wow.  It weighs 2 lbs.  Extra weight would definitely take the kick out of that PMC 223 ammo that's been busting my shoulder Big Smile.  Have to put the Premier on my Rob XCR.  They'd be a good pair.  I'd probably spring for some Zeiss FL 8x42 before I'd buy that sort of scope.  With that much glass, the stereo optic effect is too good to pass up. 

Seriously -

That's just too much meat for me to handle.  Not exactly a stalking scope.

RC - Why do you say the 1.7-10 z6i "not exactly what you outline"?  Interested to learn what I'm saying I think I want vs what I am leaning toward. 


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 17:17
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I recommend the 4a for the low light stuff, even with illumination just in case the illumination fails.  Honestly, outside of my Aimpoint, I don't trust many illumination reticles.  Some are better than others, but they seem to eat batteries pretty fast.  I would hate to be in the middle of a hunt and have that happen.  The 4a gives a big advantage if that does happen.  Just call it back up.

The 1.7-10 is a great scope.  I wouldn't worry too much about it being SFP, unless you decide you want a mil dot for ranging.  Just my opinion there.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 17:25
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Optics Jedi Master
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The Swaro has capped turrets, which is a major drag for turret-spinning.

To make it worse, the reticle doesn't have much help in the way of bullet drop markings.

The Swaro is a great hunting scope, no question, but on a SCAR, it would seem, - to me, at least - limiting.

There are very few scopes in the 1-10X category (they are tough to make), so you might want to consider looking at 2-10 or thereabouts.  

The IOR 2.5-10 FFP is a great scope.
http://swfa.com:80/IOR-25-10x42-Tactical-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P44579.aspx

It is 18 ounces, so not too heavy.

The glass is great for the money, illumination is great (center dot rather than the whole reticle), turrets are pretty good, and FFP is nice.  The only downside is that it tunnels from 2.5-4X (meaning the field of view does not increase below 4X, the image just sucks into the tube down to 2.5X.)

If you want the Swaro, I don't see you being disappointed, my Swaros are among my favorite hunters.  It will be fine on a SCAR, just be aware that dope changes take time and intention and that the reticle isn't going to help much in that regard.  Glass is great.


For a stalking gun, the Swaro is a good bet.  Or look at the same scope with another mag range with a bullet drop reticle.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 18:51
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Optics GrassHopper
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Thank you, good suggestion re IOR.  As mentioned above, have the 3-18 ffp now - which spends it life usually around 10x.  Fine scope.  Moving the wrong direction however. 

I am not a fan of excess magnification.  I prefer wide FOV and forgiving eye box vs more zoom (except in bench supported shooting - like with the IOR 3-18 application).  I'd be more inclined to go 1-6 Swaro than 2-12, and in fact, my concern with the 1.7-10 is whether I would regret losing the true 1x zero magnification. 

For whatever reasons - it appears that other than SWFA / Vortex Razor / and S&B Short dots - there are no 1x (ok, the S&B is almost 1x) with ffp and ranging reticles.  I've been scanning SWFA today and other than one "popular" maker not carried by SWFA , that seems to be the short list. 

oops, wait one second - any info / opinion on these -

US Optics 1.5-6x28 SN-4 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - USOSN4C

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 19:30
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Dark Lord of Optics

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Generally, the perfect scope for what you describe is the new March 3-24x42FFP, but it is not sold by SWFA, unfortunately.

Aside from that, Leica 3.5-14x42 with target turrets would likely fit the bill.

Among the less expensive options, perhaps Zeiss Conquest 4.5-14x44 with MilDot is worth a look.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/13/2011 at 20:18
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Optics GrassHopper
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Thank you.  Conquest - great scope, have one on my sporter bolt rifle.  Really long scope, but great value.  discontinued model - something unusual like 5.8x on the top end.  great hunting scope.

Leica - thanks, would probably lean toward the 2.5x (sans parallax and wider FOV at low end).  But the line is non-illim.  I did no illum with my IOR - and probably ok on that one that I did (already heavy enough and the one IOr lit scope I have seen was messy (an older one I had assumed , but still...)

I'm back in Swaro land - looking at their BRTi reticle on the 1-6x.   Anyone have experience with the eye box on the Swaro 1-6?  Especially at the 6x end.  Concerned it will be very tight.

I'm not familiar with March (other than the write up I've read by you).  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2011 at 16:03
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Optics GrassHopper
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Just to close the loop.  Ended up buying the 1-6x24 BRT-i off of the sample list.  thanks.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2011 at 16:17
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Dark Lord of Optics

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Good choice.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/24/2011 at 06:42
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Originally posted by tabeast tabeast wrote:

Just to close the loop.  Ended up buying the 1-6x24 BRT-i off of the sample list.  thanks.


NICE

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/25/2011 at 18:47
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Optics GrassHopper
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Came in today.  It was listed as "A" - like new in Box.  and I will say - it was mostly definitely like new in Box.  (other than the dead battery).  Amazing little scope.  I own the 2.5-15x44 z6i which is supposed to have a slightly upgraded glass composition (in the objective if I recall) and I have to say - this little guy is most impressive in a head to head against that one.  Noticed that the ocular lenses must all be identical in the Z6 line (which is to say - enormous diameter).  Field of view is spectacular.  I also own an IOR 3-18x42 FFP.  Interesting.  As others have said, IOR has nothing to apologize for regarding glass quality - but the performance of the scope , mechanically, at lower end vs the Swaro twins is , pardon pun, night and day.  The tunnel of the OIR is most noticeable vs the huge Swaro ocular.
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