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Help with SWFA SS choice for AR10

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2013 at 21:49
fnbrowning View Drop Down
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Hello Everyone, first time poster here.

Rifle is an AR10A4
For shooting .308 at ranges from not under 100 to 300 yards; our range does go to 600yds. Target shooting at paper from bench or a bipod. It is going to be setup like a Designated Marksman Rifle (DMR).

The ammunition? I use is 175 smk @ 2.80 OAL with 43.x of RL-15 to very closely duplicate the current loading for the M118LR Special Ball Long Range (LR).

I want to stay with a fixed power scope. I'm all set to pull the trigger on one of the redoubtable SWFA SS (fixed)x42 Tactical 30mm Riflescopes.

I know that the military has said "1x every 100yds" and guys are shooting 1000 yards with a fixed 10 power.  But in a recent conversation with another shooter, when I said I would also use the rifle/scope combination to occasionally check the accuracy of my load development, he then suggested going to a higher power. For those times I want to "aim small, miss small" for ammo testing has me reconsidering a little more power in the SFWA line.

ISSUE:
I want to balance tactical rifle realism, FOV, Power, and Image Clarity. Can the average shooter with “middle age” eyes get sub-MOA at 100yd on10x power when needed for reloading development?

DILEMMA:
I’m in a quandary about which scope, SS 10x42 or SS 12x42 or SS 10x42HD??
- The specifications on the web re:10x42HD are not as comprehensive as the classic line.
- I can find no image comparison of the HD like the “SWFA SS Classic Line in Mil/Mil” set of pictures to compare the classic 10x42 against the 10x42HD.

- The 12x42 seems like an interesting critter, but very few have written about it. I note the FOV at 100yds. is roughly equal to the 10x42HD. Again, I’d love to compare images side by side.

An interesting question rises in my mind. If you needed to shoot well at 100-200yds, and stay close to the ideal of the tactical marksman archetype which might a person. (again with middle-age eyes) choose?
(a) Buy the 10x42 classic for the FOV, the image is bright enough.
(b) 2x more magnification of the 12x42?
(c) Buy the newer 10x42 for better internals and brighter optics.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2013 at 21:57
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The hd is a huge step up in optical performance. I habe owned both at the same time. If u have the cash get the 10x hd, it is a much superior scope
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2013 at 22:05
Sparky View Drop Down
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SS HD 10x without question if it is within your budget!!!!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/21/2013 at 23:20
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Optics GrassHopper
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The hd is a huge step up in optical performance. I habe owned both at the same time. If u have the cash get the 10x hd, it is a much superior scope

Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

SS HD 10x without question if it is within your budget!!!!


So both of you agree that image clarity makes for a better shot at groups then an extra 2x?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 02:06
Gil P. View Drop Down
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Originally posted by fnbrowning fnbrowning wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The hd is a huge step up in optical performance. I habe owned both at the same time. If u have the cash get the 10x hd, it is a much superior scope

Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

SS HD 10x without question if it is within your budget!!!!


So both of you agree that image clarity makes for a better shot at groups then an extra 2x?
 
I would agree with them. While you get two more power with the 12x42, it will not be able to resolve images nearly as well as the 10X42HD. Youll have a lot more trouble picking up bulletholes with the 12X42.
 
I own the 12X42 and its a great scope for the money if youre on a tight budget.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 06:54
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Originally posted by fnbrowning fnbrowning wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

The hd is a huge step up in optical performance. I habe owned both at the same time. If u have the cash get the 10x hd, it is a much superior scope

Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

SS HD 10x without question if it is within your budget!!!!


So both of you agree that image clarity makes for a better shot at groups then an extra 2x?


No question. Better glass trumps magnification.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 08:31
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Optics GrassHopper
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Gentlemen;

I see the consensus is trending toward the scope with the better glass. If we go that route, another question presents itself. Two scopes in the SWFA are priced at the same point:

SWFA SS HD 10x42 Tactical 30mm Riflescope
•Mil-Quad Reticle •Rear Focus • .10 Mrad
•HD Model Weight: 20oz • First Focal Plane Mil-Quad
Eye Relief: 3.75" • Field of View @ 100yds: 10.5ft

IOR Valdada 10x42 Tactical 30mm Rifle Scope
•MP-8 •Side Focus •
•Magnum lock support system on reticle {What's this mean??}
•Side focus from 50yds to infinity
Weight: 24oz • Length: 12.5" • Eye Relief: 4"
Field of View @ 100yds: 14.5ft

The IOR has more FOV
The SS HD weighs less and has uncapped turretts.
I cannot compare length, as the website (as mentioned previously) lacks the comprehensive specs on the HD unlike the specification list for the classic SS line.
I wonder about the image clarity & light transmission between the two.

Any comments on which is the superior scope? Feel free to ask any questions if I missed a point.
Thank you for your input!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 09:10
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I have owned a bunch of IOR scopes.  They are good scopes IMO, but I think the SS line is better overall.  I have not owned that exact IOR scope, but I owned 2 of the 2.5-10x and have used that scope.  I would pick the SS 10x HD. 

It really is an awesome scope if fixed power is your need.

The SS 3-9x would be an awesome choice as well, it would be perfect for your rifle IMO. 

IMO the image quality of IOR vs the SS HD line is pretty dang close.  When I got my 10x HD I had two IOR scopes.  I spent alot of time comparing the 10x to the 3-18x IOR on 10 power.  I was honestly hard pressed to see any significant difference optically.  IIRC in some instances I thought the SS scope look a bit better, but it was close.  It seems like in low light I was able to make out a touch more detail with the SS 10x scope.

The IOR scope has 1/4 MOA adjustments.  So the adjustments does not match the reticle.  The SS scope has 1/10 mil adjustments so the adjustments do match the reticle.  That a lone would make me pick the SS HD scope. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 15:03
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I am setting up a very similar style rifle, rra lar-8 varmint. I also a happy ss 10x and 16x owner however for the ar 10 style gun I am opting to go with either a weaver tactical 3-15 or a vortex viper 4-16. I want the low mag for short range target acquisition plus the option to deer hunt if my heart desires. If your dead set of the swfa ss line I would go with 3-9 first then 10x hd. Off a bench I am able to see bullet holes very clear with my friends 10xhd my reg 10x is kinda tough. Just my 2cents. Good luck.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 15:33
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I have both the classic 10x42 and the 10x42HD.

If your budget allows it, go for the HD.  The imae quality is better and I like the feel of the turrets more.

Classic SS has a little more field of view and can focus closer (important for airguns and rimfire), but if you are shooting beyond 50 yards, 10x42HD is a better option.

ILya
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 15:35
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SS3-9x42 under $599 you can't beat it.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 15:59
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Id say anyone who can afford to buy the HD can afford to step it up a notch to get the scope they would wind up with in a few years rather than buying one then trading it later for another with more magnification.  Ive owned almost all of the SS line of scopes.
SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - SSHD520X50MQ
  • Patented First Focal Plane Mil-Quad Reticle
  • 30mm
  • HD Model
  • Locking Ocular Adjustment
  • 0.1 Mrad Elevation & Windage
  • 10 Mils Per Revolution
  • 30 Mils Of Total Travel
  • Side Focus
$1,299.95 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 16:02
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 16:09
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Trust me go with the 5-20 SS and either Bobro or La Rue mounts.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/22/2013 at 17:58
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HD glass over magnification, every time!
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/26/2013 at 09:29
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Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:

Id say anyone who can afford to buy the HD can afford to step it up a notch to get the scope they would wind up with in a few years rather than buying one then trading it later for another with more magnification.  Ive owned almost all of the SS line of scopes.
SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope SWFA SS HD 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - SSHD520X50MQ
  • Patented First Focal Plane Mil-Quad Reticle
  • 30mm
  • HD Model
  • Locking Ocular Adjustment
  • 0.1 Mrad Elevation & Windage
  • 10 Mils Per Revolution
  • 30 Mils Of Total Travel
  • Side Focus
$1,299.95 
 
You make a compelling argument. There's a piece of information that I cannot find, would you care to help?
 
I understand the field of view specs for a variable are given at min/max. I would feel more comfortable about the purchase of the 5x20 if I knew the Field of View @ 100yds for the 10x setting. (or if it makes more sense, 1/2 way through the magnification range, 12x)
 
Thanks!
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