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Are they worth it? |
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caincutter
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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Posted: January/14/2008 at 09:10 |
Morning all-
I have a question that's probably been answered and discussed ad nauseum, but can't seem to find it specifically in my search. If so, please forgive and help out if you will.
My question is, are the higher end scopes really worth the price of admission? The reason I ask is I had a hunting situation the other day that left me wondering. I hunt in south MS and in primarily close quarters (100yds and closer, pine thickets, oak flats, etc.) and the 200-300yd shots are uncommon. My rifle is a 7mm-08 with a 2.5x8x36 Vari-X III. I've had the scope for about 6-7 yrs now and have been happy with it. That is until the other day..........
At 5:30pm, I had a deer walk out right under my tree. When I pulled my rifle up, I could just make out the body but couldn't tell if it was a buck or not. The deer walked around under my tree for 10-15 more minutes before finally wandering off. I'm hunting a very good deer in this pine thicket and I couldn't tell if it was him or not. Walking back to the truck, all I could think of was if a Kahles or a Zeiss would've really given me an edge. Granted, it was getting dark and I was looking down into a dark thicket, but I couldn't help but wonder "what if?" Now, I know the upper tier scopes are superior optically, and I wouldn't expect one to flip a light switch, but would one give me those extra minutes?
I've had my eyes on a Kahles C 1,5x6x42 on the sample list. Would that be a combination that would fit my needs? Thanks in advance for any help and sorry for the long post.
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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yes without a doubt the kahles would make a difference as would a zeiss. not taking anything away from your old varix3 cause they are good scopes, but the quality of the glass and coatings applied to them has been improved since that scope was made.
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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silver
Optics Master Joined: November/04/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2291 |
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The reason I bought a Kahles sight unseen was looking through the scope you have. I got the 2-7 AH off the sample list. It is clearer at all settings, but not as much at the highest powers.
For close stuff the 1.5x6 may be a better fit. Zeiss also has a 2.5x8
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"If we weren't all crazy we, We would go insane." Jimmie Buffet
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Chris Farris II
TEAM SWFA - Admin MODERATOR Joined: August/13/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3196 |
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That is when you can tell the difference big time with the superior quality scopes dusk and dawn. They definately give you an edge. I had a similar instance as yours the only reason I was able to make the buck out and make the shot was due to the optics on the gun!
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One day your life will flash before your eyes; Make sure it's worth watching.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Just so you know, a trijicon would have helped immensely as well. Make sure that you get a scope that has a thick post like a 7a or such I think that's right, but that will help if you go with a scope that doesn't have any illumination.
Welcome to the OT Edited by cyborg - January/14/2008 at 10:16 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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RifleDude
MODERATOR EVIL OPPRESSOR Joined: October/13/2006 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 16337 |
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Welcome, caincutter! My take on this question is "sometimes they are, sometimes they aren't."
The premium optics are definitely better, but whether or not they are 2X or in some cases 3X better than mid range scopes relative to the difference in the price tag is something nobody can answer but you. Is having an extra 15 minutes of low light visibility in the early morning & late evening hours worth $700 - $1200 extra above and beyond what you pay for the average "decent" scope to you? Keep in mind that you may have the scope for the rest of your life and use it for many hunting seasons to come, so factored over a lifetime, that may not be such an insurmountable price tag. To me, it is worth having a couple high end scopes for this reason, but I couldn't afford to scope all my rifles with them. Truthfully, there isn't a great deal of difference between the super premium $1500+ 30mm scopes and some of the better 1" tube scopes from brands like Zeiss, Kahles, Swaro, etc. Some people just don't place a high value on great optical performance, which is certainly fine, and they still have no trouble killing their share of game. It's all a matter of what's important to you and how picky you are about optics. I have optics of all quality levels, and all will do the job. But, I enjoy using my "good stuff" better.
The type of hunting you intend to use the scope should also play a big factor in your decision. If most of your hunting is during good light, most scopes will work just fine. If you hunt a lot in low light, or especially if you frequently hunt at night (where legal) for critters like predators and feral hogs, having premium optics provides a definite advantage. Edited by RifleDude - January/14/2008 at 10:25 |
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Ted
Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle. |
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TJ
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2008 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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Buy what you can afford! I cant afford anything better than a Weaver and to be honest, If you need a scope to light things up for you, its time to go to bed, Not hunt.
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If the .50 BMG Cant get the job done......RUN!
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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i disagree with you there, a good scope will help you make that shot at last possible light |
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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caincutter
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2008 Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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Thanks for all the reply's. I agree rifledude about the investment. To me, it's not a question of initial price, because if you buy premium products with a lifetime warranty, then, in theory, it's a one-time cost. My concerns mainly rested in the fact that I don't want to buy into names or hyperbole; if I pay for "best" then I want it to actually be "best" in hunting situations. My Leupold is what it is-a fine scope that's served me well so far. It has it's limitations, yes, and now I'm ready to move up. It's just hard to spend money sometimes on something that you've not had any experience with. Probably like most folks, in my family and where I hunt, you don't see a Zeiss or Swaro sitting atop every blued barrell. I come here to hopefully read accounts of some knowledgeable people, such as yourself, to give real world experiences. I can then take that, look for myself, and make an educated or well-informed decision ( I hope ).
Again, thanks for the responses and keep the good info coming.
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RONK
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: April/05/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 3199 |
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It really comes down to opinion. It is a matter of fact that a very expensive scopes will often give you more minutes of shooting time , most of the time. It is a matter of opinion whether killing that deer is worth 700 or a thousand dollars more than the scope you have.
Keep in mind that no matter what you get, there is or soon will be something better. You can spend your whole life and a lot of money continually upgrading, or resign yourself to the fact that some of them get away...
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tahqua
MODERATOR Have You Driven A Ford Lately? Joined: March/27/2006 Location: Michigan, USA Status: Offline Points: 9042 |
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What made me step up to Kahles was I could not see in my riflescopes what I was seeing in my 7x42 Zeiss binoculars in low light. It is discouraging to see a nice buck in the thick stuff or long range in low light. Then go to the rifle and not be able to pick it out. This has happened when there is a small herd, too. I see them in the binos then go to make the shot and then it's "which one is it". Nothing but brown bodies and no head gear. Edited by tahqua - January/14/2008 at 13:58 |
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medic52
Optics Professional Joined: October/05/2006 Location: Missouri Status: Offline Points: 893 |
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In answer to your question is it worth it? TO me yes it is and yes I did, I UPGRADED to the better optics......
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"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him." G.K. Chesterton
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Tip69
Optics Master Extraordinaire Tip Stick Joined: September/27/2005 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 4155 |
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I doubt you will be disappointed!
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take em!
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mwyates
Optics Master Joined: June/15/2004 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 1196 |
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I hunt a lot with a Kahles 3-9X42 CL and a Leupold VX III 2.5-8X36 (half the price, but better than your Vari X III). Is there a difference in low light? Well, maybe, ...sometimes,.....probably no real difference. The Kahles has a big beautiful picture; really nice to look through. The Leupold is not as nice, but as I've said here before, neither it or some of my cheaper scopes have ever kept me from making an ethical, legal shot in low light. Sounds to me like you need binoculars. A scope is not for telling if it's a buck or not.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Mike, while I agree that bino's are the ticket, I have to disagree to some extent with the reasoning. When light is low, and animals are moving sometimes trying to pick out the buck from the others can be hard at best, the third one from the front might not be the buck by the time you get the scope up. That's why I would disagree. So I'll take the better optics. Hey to each their own though.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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TJ
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/14/2008 Location: Michigan Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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Dissappointed? No, Broke? Yes!
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If the .50 BMG Cant get the job done......RUN!
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jonbravado
Optics Master Joined: October/05/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1131 |
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i think we are splittin hairs here -
good glass (binos AND scope) are equally important in my opinion.
having both has made me a more effective and ethical hunter.
where i hunt in SC, 90% of your shots on the big bucks are taking in fading/poor light.
it makes or breaks it for me.
my 2 cents. The kahles CL will give you 10-15 more minutes of hunting over that vari-x.
but so will a zeiss conquest in the proper configuration.
J
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jonbravado
Optics Master Joined: October/05/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1131 |
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and to illustrate - i talked a buddy of mine into a pair of 7x50 fujinon binos, and he is sitting 15 minutes longer in the evenings and shooting more quality deer.
glass really matters.
J
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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the price you have to pay for success sometimes
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Glass absolutely matters, no question. Get the best glass you can almost afford. In other words save a little longer and hunt a little longer, the correlation is uncanny.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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