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Long Range 30-06 |
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Posted: November/26/2007 at 18:00 |
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Today was the first day of deer hunting for PA. I hunted all field the opening day; the first time in a long time. Unfortunately I wasn't prepared. The average effective range if a deer was in site, was about 200 yards. Which Im pretty dead-on at. There were two spots though, whcih were clear over 300 yards. These yardages were never attempted with my Remington 710 30-06 (shooting High-Point 165gr.).
Can these types (300-500) of yardage be achieved successfully with my type of gun. I only have the scope that came with the 710 when it was released. Whcih is a 4-9x40 bushnell. (Time for an upgrade) Any suggestions on any thing (Bullet load, gun mod, scope, etc...) |
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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take the 710 and get rif of it, i hope you checked to make sure it wasnt in the lot of many with a recall on it. i prefer 150 gr bullets for my 30-06, 50.2 gr of 4064 was a sweet load. if you must keep the 710 i would strongly recommend a better scope, especially given your long shot situation something in a 4.5x14 may be a better choice.
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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kmad61
Optics Apprentice Joined: December/12/2004 Location: NC Status: Offline Points: 64 |
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I agree,150 gr in the 30-06 and 2 good mid range scopes are the Nikon Buckmaster and the Bushnell elite 3200,4x14x40 would work well.
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Corky
Optics GrassHopper Joined: November/22/2007 Status: Offline Points: 35 |
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I shoot a Rem 700 30-06 with a Nikon Monarch 4-16x42 scope. It is deadly shooting a 150 gr. Barnes Triple Shock X with IMR4007SC.
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Im a noob when it comes to this stuff...but why should I knock my loads back to 150gr?
And why such negativity on the 710? Is the 700 the best remington out there? What caliber in the 700 would you go with? |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Not knocking the above responses, but I have hunted with my 30-06 for many years and have accounted for a fair amount of game. The 30-06 can handle a wide variety of bullet weights. If you need the speed, in other words shooting at fast moving game such as in driven hunts, the 150gr is the bullet. If the game is more stationary, go to 165 or better still 180gr for better knockdown effect.
The 30-06 is capable of taking game down at 400yds+ if the shooter does his part.
This past hunting season I took two kudu with 165gr at over 400yds.
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Acenturian
Optics Journeyman Joined: September/07/2004 Status: Offline Points: 543 |
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I would also recommend a good 4-12 or 4-16 powered scope for shooting out to 300 yards. The 150 gr. bullet will give you a bit better trajectory at longer ranges.
Perhaps 400 yards with lots of practice or unless someone is an ex-military sniper.
500 yards ... get closer no matter what your using. Sorry, at that range and maybe this is the bow hunter coming out but that is not hunting that is sniping. Yes, they make some Whiz Bang Uber magnums that fly flatter then a laser beam and they will reach out there but part of hunting is learning to get close enough to make a good clean kill at acceptable ranges that does not result in injured animals getting away.
K nuff of my soap box. I think the 710 is fine (Like the 700 better) .30/06 is a fine cartridge and has done the job and done it well for over a 100 years. If its the scope it came with then I would definitly up-grade.
Depending on your price range I'd look at the Nikon Buckmaster, Nikon Monarch, Burris FullField, Burris Signature, Sightron SII or the Weaver GrandSlam.
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Top Cat
Optics GrassHopper Joined: May/26/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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I would use a smaller optic with less magnification for big game at that range... A 200-300 yard shot is within iron sight range for me, and a fixed 4x is easily competent to 400 yards on a target as large as a deer.
There is no need to overscope that rifle, when a smaller scope with less magnification is lighter and easier to carry, and has a better field of view for moving targets...like deer in Pa are likely to be doing after the first hour on opening day...:)
A Sightron S-1 3-9 would be a good scope for that rifle and I would stay with the 3-9x40, and practice shooting at longer range to gain confidence in your rifle and load, and in your shooting. Sighting in your rifle to hit about 3" high at 100 yards will allow a center of the chest hold out to 300 yards. A 165gr bullet strikes about 5" low at that range, depending on the particular brand of ammo, but is still in the heart lung area. If you put in a little range time you will see where the bullets land.
150, 165...0r 180 grain bullets are fine and will knock any deer down, but the 165 is a very good overall choice.
Not that this has anything to do with the discussion, but I did grow up in Pa, and my Cousin was a DFW in York county...one of the country's best deer areas...at that time. I spent a lot of time walking around that county.
TC
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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the 710 is like a geo metro, its not if but when its going to break, the model 7 and the model 700 are so much better, your caliber is fine, 30-06 is plenty, the reason i like 150's is because i have had really good luck in the accuracy dept with them
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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Pooreyes-2
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/02/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 79 |
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If you are thinking of a new gun.Here are afew I would look at. My first choice would be the 308, I love the alround bullet,from 150 out to 185 I think. But I use 168gr,I might go back to a 155 or 165. Another choiceyou have is the big 7mm. also I am hearing alot about the 280.
I also likemy270 shooting 130gr.and it shoots pretty flat, But alot of guys on here dont likethe 270 because the limit in bullets.
I think the 300 is a over kill for deer, good forelk or bear.
Just afew things to think about.
First find the right gun then match it with the right scope.
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Bigdaddy0381
MODERATOR Georgia peach Joined: February/27/2007 Location: Georgia Status: Offline Points: 13682 |
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The 710 is not a bad gun at all.i have in 300 win mag and it shoots very well.i have actually posted some shot groups with it.As for a good bullet out to 300 yards with a 30-06 i would go with a 165 gr.this will do the trick but the 150 are not a bad chocie at all.
i honestly don't get wht the 710 get suck a bad name.I have shot well over 500 rounds thru mine and can still place 5 in the berries.The only thing i know the 710 needed work on was the trigger.but a good smith can fix that with no problem but most any other rifle has a trgger job done when new also.
thats my thoughts anyways.
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jonbravado
Optics Master Joined: October/05/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1131 |
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the ole marine snipers, for the most part, used the 165-168 grn BTSP in the 30.06's for long range shooting. There have been confirmed kills out to 900yrds or so w/ the 30.06 as LATE as desert storm. while not near as popular as the .308, it's still a great weapon at longer ranges. of course, i saw all this on history channel or discovery channel. some of the ole marines should chime in.
in MY 30.06, by far the most dependable accurate bullet was the 165 grn BTSP by hornady.
my 2 cents.
get a good scope and even better mounts.
J
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jonbravado
Optics Master Joined: October/05/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1131 |
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my reasoning:
with the 165 grn BTSP, you can acheive the 'baseball bat effect' on deer out to 300+ yards.
i have seen it, and it's awesome.
J
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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In the 30-06 for the longer ranges I'd opt for the 168 or even the 180, the weight helps the bullet to retain energy, of course there are always trade offs.
Scope wise 2.5-10, or 4-16, 3-12, any thing along those lines should be just fine for out to 400 yrds, Get the best glass for your budget.
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An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Can somone exlain why you would drop back to a 150gr? Isn't it, the higher the grain, the faster, the harder, the less bullet drop at a lesser grain?
Why would i want to go to a smaller scope if I want to shoot at farther yardage? I want to be able to shoot at any size animal, down to a groundhog size. |
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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I respect your thoughts on getting closer. And that too is also how I think. But if you read my original post. The average yardage how I was set up, would of been around 200 yards. here were only 2-3 spots were it would of been 300-500 yards. And if a monster buck showed it self in those areas (rumor had it there was one), I would love to have that sense of feeling, that I could take those yardages without second thought. I hardly ever hunt those ranges for deer. But other animals;smaller animals, such as fox, coyote, groundhog, even beer once in a while. |
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Whats the best load to be shooting. I see here thats its a wash out between the 150 and 165. Ive always stuck with the 165gr. I use lighter loads for smaller game. Like 130's or something lke that. But im not talking about that. Im talking about bigger game. So...one guy suggested Hornady ammo.
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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It is actually the other way round. Gr is a measurement of weight, so the higher the grain the heavier the bullet is. The heavier an object is, the more difficult it is to throw it at a longer distance. So a light bullet, say 150 gr will travel faster and more horizontally then a heavy bullet, say a 180 gr. The flight path in relationship to the horisontal line is called the trajectory. The flatter the trajectory, the easier it becomes to hit a target at further distances, as you need not aim much above the target. however, before you rush out and buy the lightest bullet you can find, the trade off's. A light bullet is easily effected by wind. Most importantly it does not carry the kinetic energy for the "baseball effect". In other words heavier bullets has more off a knockdown effect and are less effeceted by cross-winds. So the trade off is a light bullet that travels fast and has a flat trajectory, or a heavy bullet that travels slower, has a high trajectory but good knockdown effect.
In this regard the 165 gr is good middle ground for a 30-06.
I would go for a scope of 3-10x40 or 50, unless you want to do target shooting, then a 14 or 20x can be handy.
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Focus
Optics Master Conquistador!! Joined: June/05/2007 Location: Maine Status: Offline Points: 1006 |
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I believe you will find the 165 grain bullet to be the best bet for longer range in your caliber. 10X will be enough power for longer shots on deer and won't complicate your life with things like adjustable objectives. If you want a dual purpose rig for ground hogs and other varmints at longer range than the aforementioned 4x14 or 4x16 power will be better. Hornady inner locs, nosler ballistic tips and paritions, and sierra game kings are all good bullet choices. The new innerbonds and accubonds are great choices that do well close and way out there. Keep the rifle if it shoots good and upgrade the optics, spend some time really shooting at the longer distances and you will be more confidant and know where your shot is really going way out there. Shot my first deer in Potter co. Pa. nice country. You'll find the most important thing on those long shots is making use of anything around you for a good solid and steady rest. Good Hunting.....
Focus |
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dpslusser
Optics GrassHopper Joined: September/21/2007 Location: NorthEast, PA Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Wow guys, thanks for the help. I do use a Harris Bi-pod when ever I get the chance. That sure does make a difference. Thanks for the info about Bullet Gr. I guess I never really looked into. But it makes prefect sense now. I guess the main thing for me to do, is look into a new scope.
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