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Binocular Suggestions........... |
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Wally
Optics Apprentice Joined: November/08/2006 Location: 4 Corners Status: Offline Points: 124 |
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Posted: January/10/2007 at 08:23 |
I've been doing some research for a new pair of binoculars. I've been searching the birdwatcher sites, watching and searching several forums, corresponding with friends, and handling as many different types as possible. The problem is the more research I do, the more confused I become. I've noticed there seems to be some of the best advice given on this forum.
I am currently am using a Pentax DCF SP 8x32. I use it primarily for hunting. In some of the places I hunt, I spend a lot of time sitting and glassing. Still, I don't want too heavy of glass, because I do like to still hunt when conditions permit. I've found a binocular invaluable in this type of hunting. It's been a good bino, and I've learned a lot using it. I would like to step up to a better quality binocular, with a 40 or 42 mm objective, but stay in the 7 to 8.5x range. I would consider a 30 to 32 mm objective, if it provided a nice improvement over what I have now. I also need good eye relief because I wear glasses. I am considering trading or selling the Pentax.
I've looked at Leica Ultravids and the Swaro EL's. They are great, but they are out of my price range. ( I'm wondering if I should just stay with what I got, and save my money until I can afford one of these. I haven't seen a Zeiss Victory FL yet.) I'm wondering what anyone here might recommend as a good step up in quality from the Pentax I have, but yet not as expensive as the big 3's high end model's. Some units I've considered are the Kahles, Minox, Conquest ABK, a larger Pentax, or maybe a Nikon Premier. I've also seen some good deals on higher end units on the Samplelist, such as Leica Trinovids, and Swaro SLC's. On the plus side, I live within driving distance of SWFA.
I hope this makes sense. All suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Steve |
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anweis
Optics Master Joined: January/29/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1148 |
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Within @1000 you should be able to find Nikon LX 8x32, Svarovski SLC 8x30 and 7x42, Leica Trinovid 7x42. The later two i saw on the famous bidding site. From that Pentax SP 8x32, you need to step into the premium binoculars if you want to get anything better. |
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FrankD
Optics Journeyman Joined: November/11/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 686 |
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I agree 100% with what anweis posted. To see a significant improvement over the SPs you really do need to take a significant step up in price. My opinion of some of the ones you listed....
Kahles....a step up from the Pentaxs but I am not sure of the eye relief level of the 8x32s.
Minox HG 8x33....reportedly at the same performance level as the Leica Trinovids for around $550. Also have a rangefinding dial built into the focus knob. New, with few reports at this time.
"A larger Pentax"...I do not know how much you would gain in terms of brightness levels by going to the 8x43 and you would be losing field of view (393 vs 330). Pentax is reportedly coming out with a new ED series of bins (to replace the SPs?). You might want to consider them.
Nikon Premier.... The 8x32 produces, arguably, one of the best 8x32 images available. I have seen refurbs in the $600 price range and new models around $900. I do not know if the samplelist has any available but they would definitely be a step up from the SPs. The focus speed is fairly fast though and not everyone is fond of it.
If you can find a demo/pre-owned-certified Trinovid 8x32 for under $900 then I would suggest it as well. With just slightly more edge distortion they compare favorably with just about any of the 8x42 binoculars I have owned. Perceived sharpness is exceptional and the brightness level is just about on par with its bigger counterparts.
Hope this helps. |
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Frank
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lucznik
Optics Master Joined: November/27/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1436 |
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This statement is true with one small caveat. Stepping up to a high-quality 40+mm objective lens will get you better "light-gathering" performance and higher resolution even if all you do is trade for another SP. But, FrankD already pointed this out.
Other excellent choices (besides the ones already mentioned) in the at/under $1000 range would be the Leupold Gold Rings and Bushnell Elites. |
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What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?
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ahuebel
Optics Apprentice Joined: December/28/2006 Status: Offline Points: 109 |
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I just purchased vortex razors and minox HG (you can read about it on another post) and I am quite happy with the optics and durability of the vortex razor. Plus vortex's headquarters is in the US and they offer fully transferable, unconditional, lifetime warranty.
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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Because I really like porros I would recommend looking at the
Mixon BD 8x44 BP 94.5% Light Transmission Eye Relief 18.5mm Exit Pupil 5.5mm Weight 24.3 ozs. Under $500 Edited by Bird Watcher |
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Wally
Optics Apprentice Joined: November/08/2006 Location: 4 Corners Status: Offline Points: 124 |
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Thanks so much for the replies. I've gotten some great information and advice so far.
anweis- I was afraid I might have to step up into the premiums to get a noticeable improvement. The good thing is there are some pretty decent deals around on closeouts and used premiums.
FrankD-your comments helped a lot. The Minox HD's seem to be highly recommended. I will seriously consider all of your advice. I'm taking a serious look at the certified pre-owned and demo market.
lucznik-thanks for chiming in. The reason I am thinking about stepping up to the 40 to 42 obj. class is for the extra light gathering and resolution. After all, those are probably two of the most important attributes for my uses. I haven't looked at the binocs you mentioned, but I'll be sure to check on them.
ahuebel-I appreciate your recommendations. I also found good information in the post you mentioned. I will look into the Vortex.
Thanks again for all of your help.
Steve |
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RifleDude
MODERATOR EVIL OPPRESSOR Joined: October/13/2006 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 16337 |
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Wally, Truthfully, all of the premium options these guys suggested are excellent and you'd be happy with any of them. I believe when you get to around the $700 price point level and up (roof prism), the optical differences become somewhat subtle and subjective and it really begins to boil down to which bino feels best to you and has the size, weight, and features you prefer. For instance, if you're a birdwatcher, you might be interested in really short close focus distance or speed of focus. If a mountain hunter, the lightest weight possible may be a huge factor, etc.
Good luck with your decision! Edited by RifleDude |
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Ted
Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle. |
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Wally
Optics Apprentice Joined: November/08/2006 Location: 4 Corners Status: Offline Points: 124 |
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Birdwatcher-I never really looked at the porros. I was always concerned about them not being waterproof. I understand that you get a better view for the money. I'll check on them.
RifleDude-Thanks for the advice. It is most appreciated. I intend to handle as many as possible before I make a decision. Only problem is some of the models which have come highly recommended, have been difficult to locate.
Steve |
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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Wally,
The Minox BD 8x44 BP has internal focusing, same as a roof prism. They are Argon gas filled to prevent internal fogging and corrosion. (Argon gas has a slower rate of diffusion than conventional nitrogen). They are dust-free and waterproof. One of the reasons that I like porro prism binoculars is the 3D image representation. The only drawback with these seems to be the smaller FOV. 337' or 6.4 degrees. |
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birdhunter
Optics Apprentice Joined: November/14/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 92 |
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Wally, go ahead and take the big plunge. I have had the same problem that your going through. I had the Kahles 8x42 that I liked alot and were the best binoculars that I have had up until this point. I have also had a pair of Nikon Monarchs 8x42 that I liked alot for the deal I got them for. These have been my experiences thus far with binoculars.
If you move up to the Swarovski EL's, Leica Duviods, or Zeiss FLs you till pay a big price for them with very little optical difference for the $$ over the around $1000 binoculars. I am currently looking at the Swarovski SLC's in 8x30, 7x42, or the Leica Trivoids 7x42 or 10x32 on the sample list. You can buy these for about half the price of the EL's, Duivoids of FL's. Not sure yet what I will buy but I just thought I would throw that out to you since were in the same boat. I personally like the 8x42 and if Swarovski SLC's made one or if the sample list had a Leica 8x42 Trivoid I would buy it in a minute. It 8x is what I perfer but since talking to Frank and some others on the page I may go with a 7x. I would love to hear from you about what you are thinking about buying and who from. Bye the way... The Nikon Priemer is a great binocular and if you could find a deal on those they are in the otical quality as the EL's, Duivoids or FLs for alot less $$. Keep in touch and let us all know what you purchase. Thanks bird_hunter66 |
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Birdhunter
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Wally
Optics Apprentice Joined: November/08/2006 Location: 4 Corners Status: Offline Points: 124 |
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Birdwatcher: I appreciate the information on the Minox Porro's. I really want to get my hands on some of the different Minox. I've been hearing good things about them. I also remember using a pair of cheap Nikon 7x35 porros. These were some of the easiest glasses to use I have ever experienced. Maybe that was before I knew better, but I always seemed to get along well with them. I might have to get more serious about the higher end porro's, especially if they are waterproof.
birdhunter: I'm glad to see I'm not the only one wrestling with this delimma. I'd love to take the plunge, but........... I looked through some Swaro EL's and Leica Ultravids, and for some reason they seemed to really work for me. Maybe it's because they were far and away the best thing I ever looked through. I'm going to take a serious look at some of the SLC's and the Leica Trinovids. The Nikon Premiers also sound real good. I can see I've got a lot more shopping to do, but I guess that's part of the fun.........sometimes!
Thanks for everyone for the help and advice. I'll let you know what I decide.
Steve |
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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Wally,
I don't want people to think that I am "hung up" on the Cornell Lab reviews that I have mentioned, BUT, in light of what you just said, I find it interesting that out of the fifteen (15) binoculars that they tested, under $200, the one that they chose for "First Place" was the Nikon Action Extreme 7x35 porro prism binocular. Happy Binocular Hunting! |
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FrankD
Optics Journeyman Joined: November/11/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 686 |
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Oh, just admit...you are.
Do you want to spend even more time on the computer looking at reviews?
Here you go.....
http://www.consumersearch.com/www/sports_and_leisure/binocul ars/reviews.html
Edited by FrankD |
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Frank
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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Frank,
Did you ever see the movie Short Circuit? The favorite line was, "INPUT, MORE INPUT"!!!!! |
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FrankD
Optics Journeyman Joined: November/11/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 686 |
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Yep, saw the second one two but the first was better...as always.
Now go spend a few hours looking at all those reviews. Some are useful and others are just the usual advertising remarketed as a review. |
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Frank
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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Frank,
If you REALLY want to be of help, I would like you to do a review on the following: Minox BD 15x58 BR ED Minox BD 10-15x40 BR Vario Swarovski SLCnew 15x56 Zeiss Conquest High Power 15x45 No rush, just take your time. I'm most interested in the Minox 15x ED Edited by Bird Watcher |
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FrankD
Optics Journeyman Joined: November/11/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 686 |
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Funny guy.
I am sure those are all high quality bins but I do not think I have ever bought a bin that I did not think I could use or would use. A 15X bin is way out of my comfort range.
I may be a bit of help though. I think there was a review of a variable power Minox model (possibly the one you mentioned) done several months ago over on birdforum by "Atomic Chicken". Tero can probably find it better than I can but I will give it a try. |
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Frank
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Bird Watcher
Optics Master Joined: August/30/2006 Status: Offline Points: 1523 |
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What I was asking/suggesting is, if in your travels you come in personal contact with any of those, I would greatly appreciate your honest evaluation of same.
I have handled and looked through the Swarovaki SLCnew 15x56 at both BassProShops and Sportsman's Warehouse. Personally, I think it would serve my purposes very nicely. Honestly, I can't see myself turning loose that much cash, unless a rich uncle dies and leaves me a small fortune. So far, I have not seen any Minox 15x, or Vario's, in any of the stores in my neighborhood. As far as the Vario is concerned, it is more of a curiosity than anything, as I don't think the 40mm would be bright enough for me, at 15x. Perhaps you remember, from our previous conversations, that I am more interested in edge-to-edge sharpness, than in things like FOV, or weight, etc. Thanks in advance for any assistance or comments. Edited by Bird Watcher |
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FrankD
Optics Journeyman Joined: November/11/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 686 |
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Ahh, yes, I had forgotten.
I would be more than happy to do as you asked especially this afternoon. |
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Frank
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