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osprey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote osprey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 11:28
Makes sense, I babied the conquest I have and it did fail after a few years. And if I recall it said on the box constant eye relief not, to my eye its variable which doesn't bother me to some it may.

Another thing, weight/profile I can see were it matters a ton depending on the type of hunting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parshal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 14:22

I went by Cabela's and looked through the Leupold again alongside a Vortex HS-LR 44m scope.  The Leupold was much clearer even at 18x vs the Vortex at 16x.  At lower powers they were similar enough to not be of consequence.  What annoyed me is that the eyebox on the Vortex was much, much more forgiving.  I would choose the Vortex over the Leupold if it weren't for the lack of clarity at higher power.  For a target scope, I'd spend most time at high power.  For that matter, I've not dialed my 14x Leupold lower than 14x, ever.  Of course, I've been hunting very open areas.

I looked through a Zeiss Conquest HD5 3-15x42 and the glass is much brighter than the Leupold.  Of course, I expected that to be the case.  I'll need to research that one a bit more.  It looks like you can get a free Kenton custom turret with the purchase of that scope through December 31.

The warranty of the Leupold and Vortex has an impact on my decision which is a shame. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parshal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 14:24
I did notice a bit of distortion at the edges of the Conquest that I didn't notice on the other two.  It's possible the clarity isn't there on the others to actually notice it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote osprey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 16:44
I don't think I would have any problem buying a Leupold. The vx 3 line is really attractive because of the CDS and shaving of unneeded weight along with very reasonable price. I do have few acquaintances that have nothing but good things to say about Leupolds and their warranty, just acquaintances though.

But, at the same time I am like you a little hesitant. Not many here are overly fond of them some I would take with grain of salt like Star Wars guy seems to be a hack.

The only scope I have had any problem with is my conquest which I will be getting back in February but, I have not owned many scopes at all. I like the conquest so it's worth it to me to pay for the repair and shipping it's only $211 and some change.

Leupold might be the right future scope for me and the type of hunting I do out west here. I have no need for a low light and/or illuminated scope. I mainly spot and stalk open river breaks on public ground, lots of mileage. So an overly durable scope is unnecessary, light weight low profile is much more important. CDS is Taylor made for out here because guessing yardage is a no-go in this type of terrain.

Just some observations I picked up from this sight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parshal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 16:48

Originally posted by osprey osprey wrote:

Leupold might be the right future scope for me and the type of hunting I do out west here. I have no need for a low light and/or illuminated scope. I mainly spot and stalk open river breaks on public ground, lots of mileage. So an overly durable scope is unnecessary, light weight low profile is much more important. CDS is Taylor made for out here because guessing yardage is a no-go in this type of terrain.

This is very close to my usage as well although I'd add antelope hunting to the mix which is a lot of time in the truck glassing.  The rifle sits in the truck getting bounced around and constantly moved.  Weight and low light capability mean nothing but clear optics at high magnification can mean a lot.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote osprey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 17:08
I have taken up antelope hunting recently, love it. So, I don't think bouncing around in a truck is an durability issue on most any scope, I was talking about dragging over rocks and such, like rancid said.

What I have done with antelope is what a archery guy showed me a couple years ago. Is I hike around till I see a group, as I get closer I have bright white baseball cap I put on as I walk towards them getting closer. Their curiosity gets the best of them and they come running for a look see, in range.

I had worked well for me. Go figure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote parshal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 18:21
Originally posted by osprey osprey wrote:

What I have done with antelope is what a archery guy showed me a couple years ago. Is I hike around till I see a group, as I get closer I have bright white baseball cap I put on as I walk towards them getting closer. Their curiosity gets the best of them and they come running for a look see, in range.

Go out sage grouse hunting with a dog and the antelope will come right up to you trying to figure out what you are.  It's amazing how close we get to them every year with a dog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote osprey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 18:45
Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:

Originally posted by Alan Robertson Alan Robertson wrote:

I've owned Leupold scopes in past and liked them just fine. The Leupolds I've owned would take me to the end of legal shooting time here in OK and I don't remember ever breaking one. 



For the vast majority of hunters, this rings very true.  They carry the rifle very little, they shoot the rifle very little, and they take care when handling.  When/if you move beyond that paradigm, Leupold's value, as a general rule, rests in how great is there customer service and how quickly they return your scope WHEN it fails.

I have pushed to failure a few Leupolds and have observed several more die in service.  Everything fails, but my experience (and experienced vary) is that Leupolds fail more often than do other makes.  Granted, rifles I use get bumped and dropped and drug through brush and over rocks, and that is not where Leupold scopes thrive.  Where they thrive is on rifles that are shot seldom, are handled with care, and are called upon to function in relatively nice conditions.

I never doubt an owner who says they have never been disappointed in a Leupold scope; however, I immediately know how they treat their gear.  Some environments and circumstances dictate that gear must be handled roughly, and those who operate in that world seldom carry a Leupold (by choice, at least.)  Admittedly, I am addressing tactical scopes more than traditional hunting scopes, but I see less of a distinction between the 2 with each passing year.

Opinions vary, and I graciously seek differing points of view and experiences; but I don't carry Leupold due to my experiences and first-hand observations of others' experiences.


Thanks for the comments, seems reasonable.
The only thing would I add is someone could hunt a lot in other words carry the rifle a lot in adverse conditions and still not need a tank of a scope. As spot and stalk hunter in big sky country, that being slow careful movement, deliberate actions, a compact lightweight scope can only augment western wide open hunting, seems to be just the ticket.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alan Robertson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 18:53
Originally posted by parshal parshal wrote:

Originally posted by osprey osprey wrote:

What I have done with antelope is what a archery guy showed me a couple years ago. Is I hike around till I see a group, as I get closer I have bright white baseball cap I put on as I walk towards them getting closer. Their curiosity gets the best of them and they come running for a look see, in range.

Go out sage grouse hunting with a dog and the antelope will come right up to you trying to figure out what you are.  It's amazing how close we get to them every year with a dog.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 3_tens Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 19:53
Alan. How are you going to get the gun to your shoulder without dropping the boom box. Loco    I prefer to go in the field lighter than that. Come to think of it.  I have never owned a boom box.
Humor over, now back on topic.  Big Grin
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 20:29
I better give back all those antelope and deer we shot with Weaver scopes......    Whatever
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 20:34
Originally posted by Son of Ed Son of Ed wrote:

I better give back all those antelope and deer we shot with Weaver scopes......    Whatever

I've never shot ANYTHING with a scope… how do you get those???  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 21:07
I've had numerous scopes up to $1200 on my rifles over the past 41 years of big game hunting.  I've also had the luxury to guide over 100 hunters, most of whom hunt all over the world, since 2000.  I'm lucky in that I get to see lots and lots of different glass, ask them lots of questions, and test them out somewhat.  In short, probably 60-65% of these hunters show up with some sort of Leupold scope mounted on their rifles.  FWIW 60-70% of these hunters use Swarovski binos. 

I'm obviously very interested in the durability of their gear, and not one single hunter has ever had a Leupold scope go mechanically tits up.  A couple of them did break due to being crashed on the rocks, but that's it.  Keep in mind these are big game hunters, not tactical, perpetual turret twister types.  The only scope I've ever had fail, which happened during a mule deer hunt, was a SwaroA.  I'm not a diehard turret twister either, but do find the CDS dial from Leupy to be great fun, and reliable so far (only 200-300 rounds via CDS so far though). 

Based on my experience, I do not believe the average big game hunter will ever wear out a Leupold, Conquest, Elite 4200, Meopta, etc.  I also do not consider glass quality to be the #1 consideration when I buy a scope.  I believe durability, CS, quality of reticle, eye relief/eyebox usability, and ease of mounting to be equally or more important because most any $200+ scope will get you well past legal shooting light nowadays. 

If Leupold's FX3, VX3, or VX6 doesn't float your boat, I'd personally take a long hard look at the Meopta Meopro 3.5-10x44 w/illiminated reticle.  Meopta makes some fantastic stuff. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alan Robertson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/10/2014 at 23:28
The first Leupold I owned was a fixed power pistol scope which I mounted in the barrel- mounted rear sight housing on an old Mauser, in '78 or'79. It was what is now known as a "scout" config. That was my only centerfire rifle for around 10 years and it went where I went and both the rifle and scope were considerably skint up by the time I traded up for a rifle with a VX-III and that one again for another rifle with a VX-III. That old scout rifle was kind of like a good luck charm because every deer I took with it was before lunch. I'd go wander around in the woods a bit with the sunrise and jump one and fill a tag. The last Leupold I owned was about 8 years ago and I never mounted it. It was still new in box when I sold it at a loss to a friend, because he just had to have it and I just couldn't warm up to it, having already made other trades for something noticeably better.
Speaking of "anything can break", I need to run out to El Reno and have Gene Sears ship a Swarovski back to SONA for me, now that season's over. They'll fix 'er back good as new and I'll get a chance to see what powder Gene might have in stock and stop by his range on my way back and sight in this spare replacement... SONA will have my scope back in a few weeks, but I can't stand to have that rifle blinded and unusable.

Leupold used to make a scope with a German #1 post and if I ever see one used for sale, I'll have to get it.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Obi Wan Kenobi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2014 at 01:49

Originally posted by Alan Robertson Alan Robertson wrote:

I've owned Leupold scopes in past and liked them just fine. The Leupolds I've owned would take me to the end of legal shooting time here in OK and I don't remember ever breaking one. Having said that, the low light performance of the top of the line Leupolds is not even close to being in the same league as the top of the line Swarovski, or Zeiss scopes. Not. Even. Close.

I once bragged here on OT about a VX3 low light performance vs. a Swaro based on a quick look around with each scope. I was challenged to prove it. A local dealer was willing to let me do a more extensive side- side comparison at night and the Zeiss and Swaro were resolving details where the Leupold was blacked out, or showed a murky view of something unidentifiable.
This test was in darkness, hours after legal light, with available light provided from nearby city lights illuminating an overcast sky... maybe like a quartering moon on a clear night. The test was really beyond what most of us would expect from our optics performance, but showed the true capabilities of each scope.
What would this mean in real world applications, in legal light? The Alpha glass scopes will give a hunter an edge. A friend and I watched a 14 pt buck step out into the wheat field about 180 yds away, with about 5 minutes left to shoot. I was counting tines with a Swaro and he could tell it was a buck with his Monarch. It was his turn to take one, so...
There is a reason that the Alpha scopes can sell at multiples of lesser scopes, not that it will always pay off for you.



Great write up my friend, NOT EVEN CLOSE and the prices are nearly the same. That's what gets me hot. NOT EVEN CLOSE and Leupold tries to sell you on every gimmick except what the scope's main purpose is suppose to be. Seeing and making clean shots on animals in the last legal shooting minutes available.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Obi Wan Kenobi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2014 at 01:54
Originally posted by parshal parshal wrote:

Originally posted by Obi Wan Kenobi Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

Of that group you mentioned...

I'm open to any and all scopes.  I'm not set on those particular ones.

Thanks for the replies.


All scopes are not made equal, even the ones in the same class for the same amount of money. If you are going to spend 500-1,500$ on a rifle scope get the very best glass for your money, don't fall for gimmicks. The last few minutes of legal shooting light are precious and that's what you are paying for. Leupold is NO WHERE near Zeiss or Swarovski. And like I said, I love what Zeiss has done with their technology. They've made it affordable for almost everyone.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Obi Wan Kenobi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2014 at 02:55

Originally posted by osprey osprey wrote:

No doubt, I can't imagine this brand of scope being useless junk with everything they make. Sure every brand has their lemons and models that are not all that great.
But according to Star Wars guy that this particular brand can not be successfully hunted with is reaching to say the least.

His advice to the op and anyone else reading is not at all helpful.

Not sure why you think someone's advice is not helpful. If you take hunting as serious as I do, I'm trying to help you avoid the wasted money and the frustration I've had. I have been fortunate enough to shoot 3 deer of a life time. Every deer you see on this wall I shot with a Zeiss Kahles or Swaro. The deer to the far right scores 135 inches 11 point. I hunted him for 2 seasons with a Leupold Vari X III scope and could barely make him out when he entered fields at dusk. He was shot the first time I saw him November 2007 on a miserable overcast afternoon right at dark with a Kahles I bought from SWFA. The deer to the far left was shot at dawn with a Z5 walking through a swamp heading back to bed down.

http://www.pix8.net/pro/pic.php?u=1660JoOUc&i=11591537

I've been lucky enough to shoot 3 bucks of a life time in 26 years of hunting. The buck on the right was shot at dawn on a logging road in Saskatchewan he scores 177 inches shot with the same Z5. The buck in the middle my favorite would have broken the holy grail of 200 inches but his tines on the back are broken off from fighting. He scores 194 inches shot with a Zeiss I bought from here. He was shot at twilight in a corn field about 6 minutes left while it was snowing. The double drop on the left was shot on a friends farm in the mid west working a scrape line right at day break at 160 yards before he was about to step in the woods, he stayed right on the edge of the woods until the sun was up enough and it was just legal to shoot before he left. I can ASSURE YOU SIR. If I had been using a Leupold none of these deer would be on my wall. They'd still be living or fallen to some bow hunters I know. BTW my brother in law 2 weeks ago just shot a 200 pound 8 point clean typical with a 21 inch spread, with a Zeiss HD on is Browning 30-06 after trading his Leupold. The deer was shot 45 minutes past sunset crossing a logging road in the woods at 75 yards. My bro in law said he had no problems seeing him when he stepped out broad side. But go ahead and ignore my advice. Go on out and by yourself a Leupold, all I can say to you is good luck and I hope you are hunting unpressured private ranches during mid day and early afternoon like David Morris & Gary Swartz Tecomate ranch on their TV show. Where we hunt big wild free roaming deer are rarely seen at that time & they don't act like the deer you see on tv.

http://www.pix8.net/pro/pic.php?u=1660JoOUc&i=11591538




Edited by Obi Wan Kenobi - December/11/2014 at 03:19
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2014 at 06:30
Obi Wan, those deer are ALL magnificent.  Must have been some great hunting memories constructed getting those...
I agree with your comments.  I own a few cheap scopes, a few inexpensive scopes, a few moderately priced scopes and a some "alpha" scopes.  The alphas kick in at about the "85-90 percent" of my requirements.  In most cases, 90% is OK… but there are cases where it is not.  If one encounters bucks like the ones in your picture at a point in time where the 90%er fails… the opportunity remains only that… or one takes a "WAG" shot with, many times, failure.  
I spend a lot of time looking through my scopes at varying times of day under varying conditions.  My wife sometimes just shakes her head because I have a rifle and scope out just looking at things.  I know the limitations of all of them, know when they can/can't be used.  Sometimes, I don't intend to, and won't, shoot at the "last possible minute".  I don't really hunt trophies, though have taken a few really nice deer, so on days where I know I'm not "there" until the last possible minute it is OK to take a scope that only meets 90% of what I really want.  If I've invested time, effort and money in getting to a hunt, I'll take the best I've got because you generally don't get "do overs" (nor do I want to "do over"…).   
I enjoyed your comments and the photos.  Just awesome deer (those are trophies I would like to have).  
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OWK, those are some fantastic bucks, indeed bucks of several lifetimes.  I hear what you're saying about scopes, and this is nothing personal towards you, but I couldn't disagree more about the differences in "alpha" glass and Leupold, especially the VX3, VX6, and FX3 (substitue with Conquest, Elite, Meopta and you'd have the same result though).  I own or have owned scopes such as SwaroA, S&B, and many others. 

The handicap I have here is that I cannot remember how to post pics, BUT, my friends and I have taken 11 "bucks of a lifetime" (muley bucks, all but 2 from the same ranch unguided) since 2008.  They include:
Friend: 196" )VX3
Friend: 190" Vari XIIc
Big Al:  201", 190", 191", 201", 185" (all with VX3)
Myself 190", 190", 194", 212".  (all but one with VX3)

I won't even get into the numerous whitetails between 150"-167" (that's big for us!) taken with VX3's.

I'm not tooting my own horn, but I've hunted in most every conceivable condition regarding light, or the lack thereof in the last 41 yrs.  As I also mentioned, I've seen most every high end hunting scope made...Diavari's, S&B's. Z5, Z6....seen 'em all and they are fantastic, as you say, but the duplex reticles suck IMO..... thin wired way too thin.  

Every VX3/VX6/FX3 I've personally owned or used will easily get you past legal shooting light, at least where I go.   




Edited by JGRaider - December/11/2014 at 10:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote osprey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/11/2014 at 09:55
Originally posted by Obi Wan Kenobi Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

Originally posted by osprey osprey wrote:

No doubt, I can't imagine this brand of scope being useless junk with everything they make. Sure every brand has their lemons and models that are not all that great.
But according to Star Wars guy that this particular brand can not be successfully hunted with is reaching to say the least.

His advice to the op and anyone else reading is not at all helpful.

Not sure why you think someone's advice is not helpful. If you take hunting as serious as I do, I'm trying to help you avoid the wasted money and the frustration I've had. I have been fortunate enough to shoot 3 deer of a life time. Every deer you see on this wall I shot with a Zeiss Kahles or Swaro. The deer to the far right scores 135 inches 11 point. I hunted him for 2 seasons with a Leupold Vari X III scope and could barely make him out when he entered fields at dusk. He was shot the first time I saw him November 2007 on a miserable overcast afternoon right at dark with a Kahles I bought from SWFA. The deer to the far left was shot at dawn with a Z5 walking through a swamp heading back to bed down.

http://www.pix8.net/pro/pic.php?u=1660JoOUc&i=11591537

I've been lucky enough to shoot 3 bucks of a life time in 26 years of hunting. The buck on the right was shot at dawn on a logging road in Saskatchewan he scores 177 inches shot with the same Z5. The buck in the middle my favorite would have broken the holy grail of 200 inches but his tines on the back are broken off from fighting. He scores 194 inches shot with a Zeiss I bought from here. He was shot at twilight in a corn field about 6 minutes left while it was snowing. The double drop on the left was shot on a friends farm in the mid west working a scrape line right at day break at 160 yards before he was about to step in the woods, he stayed right on the edge of the woods until the sun was up enough and it was just legal to shoot before he left. I can ASSURE YOU SIR. If I had been using a Leupold none of these deer would be on my wall. They'd still be living or fallen to some bow hunters I know. BTW my brother in law 2 weeks ago just shot a 200 pound 8 point clean typical with a 21 inch spread, with a Zeiss HD on is Browning 30-06 after trading his Leupold. The deer was shot 45 minutes past sunset crossing a logging road in the woods at 75 yards. My bro in law said he had no problems seeing him when he stepped out broad side. But go ahead and ignore my advice. Go on out and by yourself a Leupold, all I can say to you is good luck and I hope you are hunting unpressured private ranches during mid day and early afternoon like David Morris & Gary Swartz Tecomate ranch on their TV show. Where we hunt big wild free roaming deer are rarely seen at that time & they don't act like the deer you see on tv.

http://www.pix8.net/pro/pic.php?u=1660JoOUc&i=11591538







First of all as Christopher Walken would say your tone is all wrong.
I only hunt on public land also, no food plots, no corn fields, no tree stands, no blinds, no road hunting, no calling/rattling or using of scents/baiting.
So no need for a low light and/or illuminated reticle scope. FYI I have been looking a few different brands all have been compact/lightweight I really like the z3 but, not the best for dialing. CDS is attractive because of multiple dials for more than just one rifle.
I am sure for your type of hunting your advice is just fine but, the OPs hunting etc. is at least much more similar to what I hunt like.
Those are some very fine trophys, much better than I have ever shot. Much larger than anything around my neck of the woods. That being said I like the journey as much as the result is some cases more so.

Again your know it all car salesmen tone is all wrong. Thanks
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