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First ever Optic selection, new SCAR 17 |
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Blaster3094
Optics GrassHopper Joined: December/06/2012 Location: CT Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Posted: December/06/2012 at 10:12 |
Other than a cheep scope on tube fed .22 cal rifle I purchased when I turned 18 I have never used any Red Dot Sight or Scope. I have always had good results with Iron Sights. Now at 50 plus a few, I am starting to feel like I should get with the times and purchase an Optic of some sort.
I just picked up a SCAR 17 (.308) and think that I would like to put something on it for sighting. I'm torn between an Aimpoint Red Dot, ACOG or a more typical long tube scope. I guess I am looking for the Jack of all Trades device, good for close and fast and able to make those longer shots with precision. Not knowing much at all about optics I really don't know where to start looking or what to consider. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
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jonoMT
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: November/13/2008 Location: Montana Status: Offline Points: 4853 |
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I'd take a good look at what's available in the 1-4, 1-6 or similar ranges (there are less expensive, lighter options starting in 1.5 or 2). I chose to go with the pending SS 1-6 for my .308 AR build.
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Reaction time is a factor...
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SVT_Tactical
MODERATOR Chief Sackscratch Joined: December/17/2009 Location: NorthCackalacky Status: Offline Points: 31233 |
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Have to agree. The SS 1-4 is a great scope it is a true 1X and can be used just like a red dot but you also can dial up to 4X to make precise shots if needed.
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"Most folks are about as happy as they make their minds up to be" - Abraham Lincoln
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BeltFed
Optics Retard Joined: February/12/2008 Location: Ky Status: Offline Points: 22287 |
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Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.
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Blaster3094
Optics GrassHopper Joined: December/06/2012 Location: CT Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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I am not adverse to paying for a good quality scope. Thank you for the suggestions.
More than anything else I want to and need to understand what the difference is between, for example one of the scopes linked above and something like this http://swfa.com/Leupold-125-4x20-VX-R-Patrol-Tactical-30mm-Riflescope-P49444.aspx I just don't know anything about scopes and I don't want to just think that if I spend more I will get something good. I am trying to learn. |
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20nickels
Optics GrassHopper Joined: January/26/2012 Location: Nebraska Status: Offline Points: 42 |
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SWFA 1-4 or 1-6X FTW. 4 oz differance.
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supertool73
Optics God Superstool Joined: January/03/2008 Status: Offline Points: 11814 |
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Leupold Patrol's are good scopes. They are not the best by far, but they are a good quality mid range scope. I think one of those would serve you well.
I am a big fan of the SS 1-4x. It think that is my favorite scope I own. |
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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own." |
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BeltFed
Optics Retard Joined: February/12/2008 Location: Ky Status: Offline Points: 22287 |
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I almost linked some Leupolds, but there were just so many options I didn't know where to start.
I also knew somebody would recommend one eventually.
I also think the scopes I linked are better values, but thats a different discussion.
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Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.
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stickbow46
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: January/07/2009 Location: Benton, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4678 |
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I've owned both ACOG & Aimpoint,the ACOG is the better of the two espcially if you want to shoot out past 100yds.My eyes are to old for red dots so I switched over to IOR Valdada 1.5-8x26.It is a great jack of all trade scope.
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Pearls of Wisdom are Heard not Spoken
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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Blaster, please define "longer shots" from your original post. Also, at what are you shooting and from what position(s)?
With the information presented thus far, I'd have to agree that a good 1-4 or 1-6X would be a solid choice. I've spent a little time behind a Scar-H and liked it, nice gun.
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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn. Equality is something you whine about not being given. |
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gulf1263
Optics Apprentice Joined: June/15/2011 Location: Alaska Status: Offline Points: 212 |
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IMHO you are going to have problems with many scopes on the SCAR 17.
I know this because mine has done in several, look at Leupold's and Nightforce..haven't killed those yet. Zeiss and Swaro have died as has a Weaver Tactical. The ACOG will die also and so can the Aimpoint. The SCAR 17 has a odd recoil impulse, moves forward first then back like a air rifle but much harder. Leupold and Nightforce both seem to hold up fairly well, nothing is perfect but anything else seems to die within 250+ rounds. I will be sending my Swaro in for repair and my Zeiss and have learned a valuable lesson that I am passing on to you. The SCAR 17 is a great gun, just hard on anything optical that isn't built in a certain manner. I am using a Nightforce 2.5x10 in Nightforce mounts and am thinking of switching to LaRue...along with the scope you will need a quality mount. Best of luck. Art |
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Good day.
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Mactrev
Optics GrassHopper Joined: October/31/2012 Location: MD Status: Offline Points: 13 |
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Blaster3094 - I just went through the same thing as you. At 44yrs I purchased my 1st rifle -Rainier Arms RUC- after much research. After shooting irons for a year decided to research an optic. At 1st i was going to buy a Zeiss 3-9x SFP, then an ACOG , then an EOTECH , then an AIMPOINT - but decided that a 1-4x or 1-6x FFP would fit my needs much better. I am currently on the list for the SWFA 1-6x which I can use for target shooting , 3 gun & hunting .
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Blaster3094
Optics GrassHopper Joined: December/06/2012 Location: CT Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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I think I left my initial description ambiguous because I really don't know myself. Living in Connecticut has its limitations when it comes to the distance one can shoot. Without joining a club with a 400 yard range on the other side of the state I will be limited to 200 yards. I realize I have not purchased an ultra accurate bolt gun but I'm sure that with some magnification I can do better at 100 or 200. I purchased the SCAR 17 because I like the design and for a long time now I've wanted something bigger than 5.56x45. About a year ago Connecticut was trying to pass a magazine ban and the legislature was looking to outlaw anything greater than 10 rounds with no grandfather clause. At the time I was thinking about another AR15 type weapon, then the idea hit me that if I was going to be limited to ten they were going to be ten Hard Hitting rounds. The attempted ban got squelched by an overwhelming turnout at the public hearings but the thought always stuck with me. So as I alluded to (the hard hitting part) above I have some underlying SHTF motivation behind the SCAR acquisition. I'm a bit of a training junkie, but my focus has primarily been pistol. I could see myself taking the SCAR to a carbine class and using it part of the time. Use like that would preclude installing a high power optic unless I added offset irons or Red Dot. Realistically I believe my 99+% of my needs will fall with in 200 yards but none including me wants to be limited. I have friends with Aimpoints and Eotechs and I've tried them and haven't been impressed. Maybe if I got used to one it would make me faster but I suffered no deficit in a number of carbine classes with my iron sighted AR. At 53 I have experienced a long run of good eyesight. Over the last two years Presbyopia has slowly crept up on me. I'm still doing fine at pistol sight distances but recently spending some time behind the irons on a Ruger 10/22 teaching my 11-year old I can tell that I'm not the eagle eye I once was. Still I will learn and zero the SCAR with the irons for the time being. I have to say the SS 1-4x does sound intriguing and I'm wondering about the 1-6x. |
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supertool73
Optics God Superstool Joined: January/03/2008 Status: Offline Points: 11814 |
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I have a SS 1-4x on an ar-15 and think it is perfect. If i were in your shoes i would get a 1-6x. With a 308 round that extra 2x could be very handy. The ior 1.5-8x would be a good choice as well. However having owned 7 or so IORs overall i think the SS line are better scopes.
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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own." |
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gulf1263
Optics Apprentice Joined: June/15/2011 Location: Alaska Status: Offline Points: 212 |
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As an actual SCAR 17 user, again I want you to be aware of the problems the US military has had and others have had when it comes to putting optics on the weapon.
The Leupold military/police scopes work and the Nightforce work, everything else so far seems to crap out. I have a Swaro Z6, a Zeiss Victory and a Weaver Tactical that have died, my Nightforce 2.5x10 just keeps working and others that I have talked to have been able to run their Nightforce optics. Reports are that US gov operators have broken ACOG's, Aimpoints and S&B's, French have broken Hensoldt, Kahles, Swaro and Zeiss. The gun is great, smooth and accurate but it eats anything but the Leupold military/police and Nightforce. I know that people have their favorite optics but so far they have failed or are unproven. This is called a "clue". Art |
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Good day.
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SVT_Tactical
MODERATOR Chief Sackscratch Joined: December/17/2009 Location: NorthCackalacky Status: Offline Points: 31233 |
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Any links to these reports of them breaking?
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"Most folks are about as happy as they make their minds up to be" - Abraham Lincoln
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gulf1263
Optics Apprentice Joined: June/15/2011 Location: Alaska Status: Offline Points: 212 |
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Check Lightfighter or even better talk to someone who runs one.
I run one and know others who do, I have also talked to an individual in the French Army (an officer in their "Marine" which is their overseas intervention force). The US gov is/was attempting to field not only the SCAR 17 but also the SCAR 20 and the problems have been reported. If you don't believe me, take your own SCAR 17 and shot it with various optics and see how they work...that would make YOU an expert...especially when you had to send them in for repair. I know this is a new concept for the internet...someone with actual experience reporting on a problem. My LaRue PredtAR doesn't break glass nor does my brothers AR-10 or a friends LMT. I am trying to help others in not making the same mistakes I did, my intent is not to rustle feathers or gore ox's but to report on my experience and the experiences of others. Having two high end scopes and one mid value scope break is not coincidence. Like I said, if you don't believe me, get your own SCAR 17, shot it with your chosen glass and then report back on the results. Thanks Art |
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Good day.
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BeltFed
Optics Retard Joined: February/12/2008 Location: Ky Status: Offline Points: 22287 |
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Thanks for the input Art.
I know when the SCAR was designed, it was supposed to be one of those all things to all missions, and one of those weapons you could change a few parts out and make it do everything.The adjustable comb on the stock was included so an optic could be used if called for.
I wonder what optics if any, were tested on the SCAR when it was developed.
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Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.
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Laserrs
Optics GrassHopper Joined: November/13/2012 Status: Offline Points: 13 |
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What's breaking on the scope? I thought zeiss etched the reticle.
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shagster
Optics GrassHopper Joined: April/24/2012 Location: FL Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Perhaps these will help: http://fnforum.net/forums/scar-accessories-scopes-mods/28894-optics-just-didnt-work-out.html and in regard to optics breaking on the SCAR 17: http://fnforum.net/forums/fn-scar-17s/31290-scar-heavy-eats-optics.html
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