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Help me pick a scope.

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Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 18:36
I dont think you will be happy trying to get to 1K with a Weaver it only has 50 moa of internal adjustment that is not enough.  The up side of the Super Sniper scopes - ALL of them is they have a huge amount of internal adjustment typically about 120 moa of adjustment.  I have no idea who told you you cant shoot 1000 with a 3-9 Here is a fixed 6x at 700.


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - February/16/2012 at 19:00

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 18:38

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 18:45

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:04
I think you would probably be well served by the 5-20 SS and if you are really going to work as long range most of the time that is the least expensive scope that you will likely be happy with most of the other stuff that is less money simply does not have enough internal adjustment to get past about 600 yds.
SWFA SS 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope SWFA SS 5-20x50 Tactical 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - SSHD520X50MQ
  • Patented First Focal Plane Mil-Quad Reticle
  • 30mm
  • HD Model
  • Locking Ocular Adjustment
  • 0.1 Mrad Elevation & Windage
  • 10 Mils Per Revolution
  • 30 Mils Of Total Travel
  • Side Focus
$1,299.95 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:06

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 33shooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:14
Not sure how the Weaver couldn't make reliable hits at 1k. The rifle has a 20MOA built in top rail, and the scope should have enough to get me there. I like the idea of the 3x9 for most of the shooting I would like to do, but I still want more magnification on the top end.

The SS is a fine scope with great features. But I think that for my intended purpose I would prefer less on the bottom end and more on the top than a 3-9.

Maybe I don't understand. How much internal adjustment do I need to shoot to a grand?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 33shooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:20
Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:



Koshkins rifle scope reviews


He recommends the weaver for scopes under $1000
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:28
  • M118 = M118 Special Ball - 173gr FMJ-BT (2550fps)
  • M118LR = M118LR Special Ball - 175gr HPBT (2580fps)
  • HSM 155gr = HSM 308-37 .308 Win 155gr HPBT (2860fps)

Bullet Drop (Inches)
100y 91m 200y 183m 300y 275m 400y 366m 500y 458m 600y 549m 700y 641m 800y 732m 900y 824m 1000y 915m
M118 +16.5 +30.0 +36.0 +34.0 +22.5 Zero -35.0 -80.0 -144.0 -230.0
M118LR +17.4 +30.4 +36.3 +34.2 +22.6 Zero -35.7 -86.8 -156.1 -246.7
HSM 155gr +13.8 +24.3 +29.2 +27.5 +18.2 Zero -28.8 -70.3 -127.2 -202.9


Energy (Muzzle - M118 - 2605Ft-Lbs., M118LR - 2586, HSM 155gr - 2815)
M118 2265 1940 1678 1400 1195 1035 865 735 635 545
M118LR 2247 1944 1675 1436 1225 1037 877 743 634 547
HSM 155gr 2464 2131 1834 1571 1339 1135 944 783 635 522


Wind Drift (Inches) 10 mph Crosswind
M118 1.0 3.0 7.0 13.0 22.0 32.0 46.0 64.0 84.0 108.0
M118LR 0.6 3.0 7.0 12.8 20.8 31.4 44.4 60.5 79.8

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:37
http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmtraj_drift-5.1.cgi
 
BC .496  for 175 SMK
 
Trajectory
Input Data
Ballistic Coefficient: 0.496 G1 Caliber: 0.308 in
Bullet Weight: 175.0 gr Bullet Length: 1.500 in
Muzzle Velocity: 2600.0 ft/s Distance to Chronograph: 10.0 ft
Sight Height: 1.50 in Sight Offset: 0.00 in
Zero Height: 0.00 in Zero Offset: 0.00 in
Windage: 0.000 MOA Elevation: 0.000 MOA
Line Of Sight Angle: 0.0 deg Cant Angle: 0.0 deg
Barrel Twist: 10.0 in Twist Direction: Right
Wind Speed: 10.0 mph Wind Angle: 90.0 deg
Target Speed: 10.0 mph Target Angle: 90.0 deg
Target Height: 12.0 in
Temperature: 59.0 °F Pressure: 29.92 in Hg
Humidity: 0.0 % Altitude: 1000.0 ft
Vital Zone Radius: 5.0 in
Std. Atmosphere at Altitude: No Pressure is Corrected: Yes
Zero at Max. Point Blank Range: No Target Relative Drops: Yes
Mark Sound Barrier Crossing: No Include Extra Rows: No
Column 1 Units: 1.00 mil Column 2 Units: 1.00 MOA
Round Output to Whole Numbers: No
Output Data
Elevation: 3.990 MOA Windage: 0.000 MOA
Atmospheric Density: 0.07375 lb/ft³ Speed of Sound: 1116.4 ft/s
Maximum PBR: 319 yd Maximum PBR Zero: 271 yd
Range of Maximum Height: 149 yd Energy at Maximum PBR: 1679.1 ft•lbs
Sectional Density: 0.264 lb/in² Stability at Muzzle: 1.381
Calculated Table
Range Drop Drop Windage Windage Velocity Mach Energy Time Lead Lead
(yd) (mil) (MOA) (mil) (MOA) (ft/s) (none) (ft•lbs) (s) (mil) (MOA)
0 *** *** *** *** 2605.9 2.334 2638.2 0.000 *** ***
100 -0.0 -0.0 0.2 0.7 2433.5 2.180 2300.8 0.119 5.8 20.0
200 -0.6 -2.1 0.4 1.5 2267.8 2.031 1998.1 0.247 6.0 20.7
300 -1.4 -4.9 0.7 2.3 2108.4 1.889 1727.1 0.384 6.3 21.5
400 -2.4 -8.2 0.9 3.2 1955.7 1.752 1486.0 0.532 6.5 22.3
500 -3.5 -12.0 1.2 4.2 1810.0 1.621 1272.8 0.691 6.8 23.2
600 -4.7 -16.1 1.5 5.2 1672.1 1.498 1086.3 0.864 7.0 24.2
700 -6.1 -20.8 1.8 6.4 1543.1 1.382 925.1 1.051 7.3 25.2
800

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:44
You have to allow a little for the unknown because with an 18 in barrel you will have lost about 150 ft per second per inch in difference from a longer barrel.  Scopes on a flat rail dont always have an equal ammount of adjustment above and below.  When you have a built in plus 20moa rail  if you have less than 50 moa of internal adjustment you are for sure screwed. At 50 moa you are hopeing you have 25 up and 25 down which never happens. When you change that number by plus 20 moa you are trying for 45 up and 5 down which is cutting it way too close.  Scopes do not tend to do well over a long period of time at their extreme limits of travel.  Think of it like a magazine that is left loaded forever - eventually it will fail.
The 4.5-14x50 Mk4 has 100 moa of internal adjustment. The NF scopes like 3.5-15x50 has 110 moa of internal adjustment. These scopes are well able to not only get to 1000 but well past that same as the Super Sniper 5-20x50.  I suggested the 3-9x42 SS to keep the cost down but still  have a scope you could trade to upgrade to a better scope like a U.S. Optics or a Premier or Heinsoldt which are a ton of money but really are the best. If you are going to do this one time and one time only buy a U.S. Optics and buy once cry once and be done with it.
US Optics 3.2-17x44 SN-3 30mm Riflescope US Optics 3.2-17x44 SN-3 30mm Riflescope
Stock # - USOSN3G
  • Matte Black Type III hard Anodizing
  • Illuminated Mil-Scale GAP Reticle
  • 30mm
  • Low Profile - Rapid Focus Eyepiece
  • 11 Pos Rheostat (Red) Illumination
  • EREK 1/10 MIL Elevation Knob
  • US#1 M40 Style 1/10 MIL Windage Knob
  • ERGO Parallax Control
$2,424.95


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - February/16/2012 at 20:03

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 19:50
According to the info that SWFA has the Weaver listed on the first page of this post has 27.7 MRAD of adjustment.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 20:07
I clicked on the link that SVT provided.

Stock # - WEA800363
  • Matte
  • Illuminated EMDR
  • 30mm
  • Side Focus
  • First Focal Plane Reticle
• Fully multi-coated lenses w/ extra hard coating on exterior lenses
• Waterproof / fogproof / shockproof
• Reset-to-zero turrets (no caps to lose)
• Argon purged tubes to eliminate internal fogging
• One-piece construction
Specifications
Weight (oz):27.33


Illuminated EMDR

Length (in):13.5
Eye Relief (in):3.98
Field of View @ 100yds (ft):33.9 - 6.8
Exit Pupil (mm):10.52 - 3.34
 Adjustment Value:  0.1 MRAD
Adjustment Range: 27.7 MRAD
  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 20:08
http://swfa.com/Weaver-3-15x50-Tactical-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P49448.aspx
Sparky I found where you got it.  When I called Weaver the tech told me 50 moa.  If it has 27.7 Mil it will work.   I would sure call Weaver and confirm this though.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 20:23
Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:

http://swfa.com/Weaver-3-15x50-Tactical-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P49448.aspx
Sparky I found where you got it.  When I called Weaver the tech told me 50 moa.  If it has 27.7 Mil it will work.   I would sure call Weaver and confirm this though.


That is why I said according to SWFA's info. And yes I would check with Weaver to confirm the specs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 21:09
What can I say I pulled it up on Weaver and on the other models on SWFA and nothing shows. I had called Weaver and talked to a tech several months ago and was told 50moa but its often hard to get that information because most of these scope companies think - since the average police tactical rifle is shot at about 80 yds  why would they need the type of elevation the military needs.  
Thanks Sparky good catch. Thunbs Up

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 22:43
You are welcome.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 33shooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/16/2012 at 23:11
I have read that the 27 is closer to 32 in reality. I've read a considerable amount on scopes lately and everything points to the weaver being a good optic in its price range. You may be able to afford the USO, but after buying an OBR I cannot. This will get me started and tell me what I want next, and what I need.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/17/2012 at 00:09
Originally posted by Sparky Sparky wrote:

Originally posted by Urimaginaryfrnd Urimaginaryfrnd wrote:

http://swfa.com/Weaver-3-15x50-Tactical-30mm-Rifle-Scope-P49448.aspx
Sparky I found where you got it.  When I called Weaver the tech told me 50 moa.  If it has 27.7 Mil it will work.   I would sure call Weaver and confirm this though.


That is why I said according to SWFA's info. And yes I would check with Weaver to confirm the specs.
Weaver has the specs on their website, it is just difficult to find.
 
Go here:
 
 
There are three little boxes just above the model list at the bottom of the page.  If you click the middle box it gives adjustment range for each model in inches at 100 yards and meters at 100 meters.  Loco  The specs listed for the mildot model is 70 inches (MOA) / 1.94 meters (19.4 mils) and the specs for the EMDR reticle model is 100 inches (MOA)/ 2.78 meters (27.8 mils)
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/17/2012 at 15:22
Certainly helpful having the click link be an unmarked square.Loco  Turely odd that same power with different reticle is a different amount of internal adjustment, not sure what going on with that. 
 
ModelExit Pupil (mm) Field of View
ft@100 yds/
m@100m
Eye Relief
(in./mm)
Length
(in./mm)
Click Value
in.@100yds/ m@100m
Adjustment Range
in.@100yds/ m@100m
Weight
(oz./g)
8003809.52-2.4425.1-5/
8.37-1.7
3.94/10014.88/3780.1 MIL5528.0/795
80038210.52-3.3433.9-6.8/
11.3-2.3
3.98/10113.50/3430.1 MIL7027.5/780
80036411.4-4.9100-19.9/
33.3-6.6
4.25-10810.31/262¼/7.395/2.6414.46/410
80036210.52-3.3433.9-6.8/
11.3-2.3
3.98/10113.50/343¼/7.370/1.9427.5/780
80036310.52-3.3433.9-6.8/
11.3-2.3
3.98/10113.50/343.36/9.1100/2.7827.33/775
8003609.52-2.4425.1-5/
8.37-1.7
3.94/10014.88/378¼/7.355/1.5328.0/795

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 33shooter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February/18/2012 at 15:54
Ordered the Weaver Tactical 3-15x50mm FFP mil/mil EDMR scope yesterday.  Should be here next week.  It will likely beat my OBR here since I'm 90+ days and counting on that.  I'll probably do a nice review.  I'll take open box pictures, and do a good long term review of it.


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