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Zen-ray vs. Meopta vs Zeiss Conquest

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atomiclab View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/21/2011 at 20:15
Thanks MeoptaSuruja,
So can you tell me, do the HD lenses in address the CA issues well?  The CA thing seems to be the most common complaint I here from optics guys.  I guess thats the whole point of going to HD lenses isn't it.

I sure would like something in the 8x40 range though.
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Klamath View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/21/2011 at 22:21
Originally posted by atomiclab atomiclab wrote:

Thanks MeoptaSuruja,
So can you tell me, do the HD lenses in address the CA issues well?  The CA thing seems to be the most common complaint I here from optics guys.  I guess thats the whole point of going to HD lenses isn't it.

I sure would like something in the 8x40 range though.
I might toss out a caution flag here.  Smile  As a general rule High Density Extra low Dispersion glass used in the objective does serve the purpose of reduction of color fringing and/or chromatic abberration.  Things have to be right for this to do any good.  The glass has to be of the right type (Abbe number greater than 90) and the focal lengts in the binocular have to be correct.  Marketers are clever folk and their goal in life is to make you think that buying their stuff is your idea.  There are a lot of monikers used to draw purchasers into thinking they are getting the latest ,greatest glass, XD, HD, LD, ED and others.  Often as not that tells you precisely nothing.  For instance there is also a type of High Density glass sometimes used in the eye piece design to flatten the field.  This is also designated HD, and has nothing to do with CA.  So when you see HD you have no clue as to what it means, maybe don't know, or for that matter care a whole lot.  If you like the image and it has the moniker, you're good to go. 
 
Now for the flag.  Chromatic abberration is demonstrably present in just about any binocular.  The thing is, you never know how two different sets of eyes will react to the CA.  For example, I typically am not at all bothered by CA.  On the other hand, Bitterroot Bulls (Matt) has stated he is.  So when you se a comment on a particular binocular from Matt that he sees it and a comment  from me that says I don't, the question you might ask is ..."which one of those guys do I believe?"  Fact is we are both right.  Whether ot not the CA bothers you is up to how your eyes react to the optical design.  The thing is... IF IT BOTHERS YOU, you won't have to look very hard to see it.  If you don't see bluish, purplish, or greenish color fringes at the edge of high definition objects, then my serious, heartfelt advice is ..DON'T GO LOOKING FOR IT Smile.  If you sensitize yourself to see the stuff because you heard that it is a problem with a particular design, you run the risk of winding up able to see it everywhere.  So the old adage of ..."be careful what you chase, you might catch it"...may come into play.
 
There are lots of things that people really get into as to what bothers them.  Edge sharpness, CA, focus direction, how hard the focus wheel turns...lots of stuff.  Some of that, especially things like CA and edge sharpness are self inflicted, and some are real live chacteristics of that person's vision.  So my advice is to look for the strong points in a binocular as you evaluate it and don't go looking for imperfections.  Anything has imperfections.  Look hard enough  and you will find something.  In short if the curent Meopta (non HD) does not show fringing for you, then don't worry much if it does not have HD glass.
Steve
"Everything that can be counted does not necessarily count; everything that counts cannot necessarily be counted". William Bruce Cameron

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atomiclab View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/22/2011 at 21:44
you know Klamath, you are really right.  I shouldn't get carried away.  I do very much respect you guys and I appreciate all of you and what you have to say and your reviews.  You are right though.  different peoples eyes are different (ie. so many people love nikon.  I have never seen any  nikon that worked well for me. none) .

But point still made.  
1.   your post helped me stay grounded in reality for my optics search.
but 
2.  I am still looking forward to reading reviews of the new products coming out.  

still building up my savings, so I have some time still
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/22/2011 at 22:04
Originally posted by Klamath Klamath wrote:

If you don't see bluish, purplish, or greenish color fringes at the edge of high definition objects, then my serious, heartfelt advice is ..DON'T GO LOOKING FOR IT Smile.  If you sensitize yourself to see the stuff because you heard that it is a problem with a particular design, you run the risk of winding up able to see it everywhere. 
 
Well said Steve.  I curse the day I taught myself to see CA.  Now it is the first thing I see.
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2011 at 16:39
Originally posted by Bitterroot Bulls Bitterroot Bulls wrote:

I curse the day I taught myself to see CA.  Now it is the first thing I see.
That is something I hope not to bring on myself doing binocular reviews.  One of the first things anybody seems to ask is some question about CA.  So, I just about have to look for it for review purposes.  However I do it in very specific ways, ways I hope will not eventually make me see it everywhere.
Steve
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atomiclab View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/25/2011 at 14:30
the only reason I ask about CA is it seems that it would be an issue in getting the sharpest image you can.  Would that assumption not be right?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2011 at 20:06
would it be worth wile to ask how Kowa Genesis or Vortex Razor HD would compare here?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote motts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2011 at 20:57
I don't have personal experience with either the Kowa Genesis or Razor HD, but from what I've read, the Kowa Genesis offers a superb view. Supposedly it has just about the lowest CA of any bino, thanks to the use of Kowa's Prominar XD glass...the same used in their spotting scopes. However, it is rather heavy and some thought the focus was not as smooth as it should be. The Genesis resembles the Leupold Golden Ring HD, Alpen Optics Rainier (non HD ED), and Bynolyt Albatross SHR DCF binoculars. All have gotten great reviews, but are noted as being heavy.

I haven't seen much on the Vortex Razor HD. From what I've seen on the Vortex Viper HD, it has gotten great reviews, and it's supposedly a step below the Razor HD. Makes me wonder if it's really worth twice the cost. Can't wait for someone to compare those two.
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atomiclab View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/01/2011 at 23:53
very interesting.
so, the Kowa Genesis is a good option (though they are more expensive)

I should ask Bitterroot how the Vortex Viper HD compares to the meostar and zen ED3.

What about swift audubon ED porros.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bird_hunter66 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/02/2011 at 07:51
+1 Meopta  Best built and best glass for under $1000 in the new binocular market.
D. Holmes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyote95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/02/2011 at 08:16
"Life is like riding a bicycle . To keep balance you must keep moving" Albert Einstein
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atomiclab View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/02/2011 at 09:58
Coyote, yes I saw the Kowa Genesis you linked to.  it is part of what peaked my interest about Kowa.  these used Kowa puts them in a close price range as a new pair of Meostars (which for the most part has been at the top of my list)  

but +1 Meopta again.  I don't really ever see meostar binos for sale, not since I have been looking.
there must be something to that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/02/2011 at 10:44
Save some  $$ and get the Cabelas Euro bino.......it and the Meostar are the exact same thing.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2011 at 19:44
yeah I would totally go for the cabelas euro, but they don't have 8x42 anymore. 
they have 10x42 and that would be ok. but I kinda had my mind set on an 8x
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NDhunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2011 at 21:20
Check out the Sample List.  SWFA has the demo. 8x42 Nikon LXL, for $799.  A quality choice, and
a nice value.  I would rate these above the others mentioned here, ZR, Meopta, and the Conquest.  
These guys are great to deal with. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2011 at 16:00
thanks for the tip NDhunter.

I know Im not going to make any friends for this one. but, I have never liked any Nikon bino or scope optically.  NEVER.  Nikon has a very depressed view to me,  dark and dreary,  hard to see detail,  

I even compared Nikon EDG next to the Meopta Meostar and I thought the meostar blew away the EDG.

I had to stare at the tag hanging from the EDG for a long time because I knew $2000.00 (ish) it HAD to be a typo.  I tried to make sense of it like they accidently hit too many zeros. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NDhunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2011 at 17:47
Originally posted by atomiclab atomiclab wrote:

thanks for the tip NDhunter.

I know Im not going to make any friends for this one. but, I have never liked any Nikon bino or scope optically.  NEVER.  Nikon has a very depressed view to me,  dark and dreary,  hard to see detail,  

I even compared Nikon EDG next to the Meopta Meostar and I thought the meostar blew away the EDG.

I had to stare at the tag hanging from the EDG for a long time because I knew $2000.00 (ish) it HAD to be a typo.  I tried to make sense of it like they accidently hit too many zeros. 
 
Interesting your take on the Nikons, it seems opinions do vary, and I am thinking you need to
do a little more testing.
 
You have been asking for advice, go to the Allbinos website, and check out the 10x42 model rankings,
Nikon has the EDG at #1, and the LXL, and SE in the top 6.  The Meopta Meostar comes in at 29th.
 
Who blew away who?  Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote atomiclab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2011 at 20:35
I understand, and I was expecting that.  

I am willing to continue to evaluate and look through different optics (even after I buy some I can keep looking)

But my personal experience with nikon has been unimpressive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NDhunter Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2011 at 20:48
Originally posted by atomiclab atomiclab wrote:

I understand, and I was expecting that.  

I am willing to continue to evaluate and look through different optics (even after I buy some I can keep looking)

But my personal experience with nikon has been unimpressive.
 
Wanting to give you some leeway, but I can tell, you don't know sh*te from shinola.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/06/2011 at 21:26
Originally posted by atomiclab atomiclab wrote:

very interesting.
so, the Kowa Genesis is a good option (though they are more expensive)

I should ask Bitterroot how the Vortex Viper HD compares to the meostar and zen ED3.

What about swift audubon ED porros.  
 
I have seen the Viper HD, meostar, and Zen ED2 (not 3).  I like the Meostar the best of these, but the ED2 is still the best value by far.  The VIper HD is actually really nice, IMO, but it is a little narrower on FOV.
 
The Audobon ED is a porro I would like to see myself, but haven't.
 
NDhunter,
 
Take it easy.  atomiclab is entitled to his opinion.  Allbinos is certainly not the absolute end-all authority in binoculars.
 
FWIW, I really like the Nikon EDG binoculars.  I don't see many weaknesses in that binocular.  But I also think others might see it differently.
-Matt
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