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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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I have one of these and I like the scope a lot but it is also a bit large for most AR rifles.
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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You made some good points and I'll try the SS After looking through a few Trijicon's and having Trituim sights (bead/iron) on several guns, I've gotta have a Trijicon so it looks like I'll be in the dogs house with the wife since I'm buying two scope, but my arguement will be that I have a learning curb
The Trijicon's will be used for 300yds or less in the woods in low light conditions. It's will be used on different rifles and the AR as well. so IYO, which one might be best suited for this.
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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It seems you posted while I was typing and already answered my questions. Thanks,
EAGLE
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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If I were to have two scopes I would go with one that was tactical knobs in a 5-20x50 if I could afford that and the second would be an illuminated lower power probably the 3x compact ACOG but the 1-4 accupoint is also a fine choice. I have had several of the Accupoints and for some reason I really like the other models better than the 3-9 in fact about the only 3-9 scope made by any company that I really like is the Super Sniper and that is due to the options that it has that most scopes do not have since it is FFP first focal plane the mil based reticle remains the same at all powers so one can use it for range finding or holdover or can input correction like 3.4 mils by dialing four clicks and holding on the 3rd mil mark down from center rather than dialing 34 clicks to get 3.4 mils. Having the reticle and the clicks both be mil based makes it very easy to make corrections. You aim center of target shoot a hole measure using the reticle how high or low and how far left or right and then dial in correction in the same incremental units with the knobs - it's a wonderful system. I also very much like the accupoint scopes as the illumination system is the best bar none. The 5-20 Accupoint is limited in that it only has 50 moa of internal adjustment so half up is 25 inches up at 100 yds. The 5-20 Accupoint is also mil dot or post reticle and I rather prefer the post having had both. The clicks are 1/4moa per click so one click at 100 yds will move point of impact 1/4 inch. Important to know that 1 moa is 1 inch at 100 but 1moa is 2 inches at 200 and 1moa is 3 inches at 300 so on 1moa is 10 inches at 1000 so !/4 moa click at 1000 yds moves the point of impact 1/4 of 10 inches or 2.5 inches per click.
With a mil based system one mil at 100 yds is 3.6 inches and one mil at 1000 yds is 36 inches and one mil at 1000 meters is one meter so at 1000 meters 1/10 mil click moves point of impact 1/10 of one meter or ten centimeters. 500 meters of course would be half of that so one click at 500 meters would move point of impact 5 centimeters. Once you get your head wrapped around the idea that both systems work but 1/4 moa moves about 1/4 inch at 100 and 1/10 mil ( 1/10 of 3.6 in) moves point of impact about 1/3 inch (.36 inches) per click the systems make more sense and you can dicide which you prefer.
Good Luck
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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Since I’ve never used a scope in the first focal plane, I have another question Since the reticle is not illuminated, and if I decided to hunt in a wooded area with brush and had to set the magnification on 3 would I still be able to see the reticle without straining. Basically will I lose the reticle in the contrast in low light conditions even with good glass and 95% light transmission? |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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The mil quad has very heavy posts that will guide you even at 3x it should be quite workable where the 3-9 mil dot FFP is really very fine at 3x and much more useable as you get to 4 or 5x and quite useable at 6x even in very low light. Honestly on an AR I tend to run a compact ACOG more than any other optic and I have all of the ones we have discussed. There are times when it is nice to have a higher power optic and the scope above is a fixed 6x42 Super Sniper which is a bargain not as nice of knobs as the 3-9 though as the 3-9 uses a single screw on top and gear tooth inside the knob where the old style fixed 6, 10, 16, & 20 the knob is held on by three oposing hex screws. Still they are a way to put a scope with knobs on a rifle cheap and all of the SS line has a huge amount of internal adjustment about 120 moa or 120 inches at 100 yds more than most scopes.
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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Using the compact acog I can be sub moa at 300 yds and closer they are really a very nice choice small light compact great glass tough as nails and the best illumination tritium + fiber optic.
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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It is possible to get onto coyotes with a higher power variable this is a 6-24 Bushnell 4200
But the lower end is important and 5 is better than 6 when they are close. I tend to not think it is worth loosing everything from 9x to 20x just to gain the 3x to 5x but I find a huge difference between 2.5x and 3x on the low end and I have one compact ACOG that is a 1.5x amber triangle TA442 that I just love for anything within three hundred yards. Working off the point of the triangle I can be very precise where some guys like Bill Wilson of Wilson Combat really prefers the #4 reticle in the 1-4x variable Accupoint.
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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These are both 5-20 Accupoints at about 150 yds on 20x
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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ccoker
Optics Master Joined: February/13/2008 Location: Austin, TX Status: Offline Points: 2041 |
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I think you would be very happy with a 3-9 accupoint mildot /green dot
I have one and it's a fantastic hunting scope |
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www.TacticalGunReview.com
Pro Staff - Silencer Shop http://tacticalgunreview.com |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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Agreed they are a fantastic scope however at 300 to 500 yds its a tad rough getting on target where if one spends a few hundred more to begin with and buys the 5-20 Accupoint they loose 3x and 4x but gain 10x through 20x plus they gain tactical knobs to dial in correction which makes is quite practical to shoot out to 500 or 600 yds with a .223 using 75 or 77 or 80 gr bullets which was an initial request.
Size wise the 3-9 is way more friendly but it really wont do what the 5-20 will as I have owned both.
In a 3-9 scope my first recomendation the Super Sniper with the new Mil Quad reticle would work well even though it lacks the illumination and parallax adjustment it does have great tactical knobs and a huge amount of internal adjustment more than double what the 5-20 Accupoint has so you can dial in correction well past 1000 yds but the bullets become less stable after they decrease speed to below the speed of sound. Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - August/15/2011 at 12:26 |
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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http://www.snipercentral.com/223.htm
Military Applications NOTE: I have chosen the new Federal 77gr Gold Medal Match ammo, which has decent 1000 yard ballistics, but they are still not as good as the other common sniping rounds, and arrive with very little energy. The sierra match king has been approved for combat duty as well (at least in the M118LR ammo. Also, be aware that the 77gr will require at LEAST a 1:7 twist. You will need to verify. This round was designed for the increased popularity of the .223 in 600 yard shooting competitions (Service Rifle) not for sniping or DMR work.
Federal Gold Medal match - 5.56x45mm NATO (.223) 77gr 2750fps Bullet Drop (Inches)
Energy - (Muzzle: 1295 ft-lbs.)
Wind Drift (Inches) - 10mph Crosswind
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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shooter25
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/26/2011 Location: SC Status: Offline Points: 4 |
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Jeti, you are great! I have a follow up on the 5.56/.223 round out of a LMT 2000 Defender. I'm looking at getting a 1-8x scope in the higher tier and was wondering if there is a better option for the zero to 800/1k meters. My goal is to use the full effective range of the gun. Is this 5.56/.223 round really effective past 600y? And my understanding is that a 1-8x scope should be good to 600/800y/m? is this correct? TIA!!!
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Have gun will travel...
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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I really like the glass in the Trijicon and I don't think anyone gives them enough credit (not known for good glass). Does any have a picture of the post or crosshairs taken at night ?
Local venders wont let me take it outside at night
I've always used crosshairs, but the post is unobstructed and interest me |
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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It's to bad Trijicon 3-9x40 doesn't have much adjustment. Leupold's VX-R models are starting to look good to me.
Eagle
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cheaptrick
MODERATOR Joined: September/27/2004 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 20844 |
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What the hell is going on around here?!?!?
This forum HATES Leupold! Anybody can tell you that! Lately The Big L has been getting some good press.
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If at first you don't secede...try..try again.
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EAGLE
Optics Journeyman Joined: August/08/2011 Status: Offline Points: 346 |
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How does the glass compare to the Conquest ?
EAGLE
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SVT_Tactical
MODERATOR Chief Sackscratch Joined: December/17/2009 Location: NorthCackalacky Status: Offline Points: 31233 |
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glass wise? Equal to my eyes. |
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338LAPUASLAP
Optics Master Scope Swapper Joined: October/17/2009 Status: Offline Points: 2596 |
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Ok I have been sleeping when did they get that reticle option???
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No one
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