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out of elevation at 50 yards |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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Posted: September/17/2010 at 19:47 |
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Mounted a viper 2-7x32 in Talley lows on a Marlin 308mx. I am 2 inches low at 50 yards with only 4 clicks remaining of elevation. Scope is consistent and has tracked well up the paper. I have always mounted a scope myself and been on paper 1st shot and zeroed with less than 10 shots at 100 yards. I am lost here.... good news is the scope feels solid and glass looks great. Help please
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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Pictures of the mounts would help.
These are usually issues associated with the mounting rather than the optic. Edited by Rancid Coolaid - September/17/2010 at 19:55 |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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WestOfPecos
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/08/2010 Status: Offline Points: 240 |
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hmmm. The Viper 2-7x32 has 110 moa, so it really cannot be a scope issue. Just in case - how many moas do you have total in elevation? Since you have already done your other rifles, you would not have put the rings in the wrong order in this one.
What kind of a mount is it under the rings? Is it the XS rail? |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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These are Talley one piece that mount right to gun without a seperate base. First time using these Talley LW aluminums. I just ran from top down and had 433 clicks and crosshairs moved up the wall about 6 inches at 20ft. That is 108 moa at 100 yards. Rings are not marked differently to signify front/rear. Loosing my mind here.
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WestOfPecos
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/08/2010 Status: Offline Points: 240 |
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I am grasping at straws now:-) Did you try reversing each ring 180 degrees, in their present position? How is the fit between rings and scope?
I don't have Talleys, but their one-piece rings (the ones you have) have very good reputation. [edit] I am not sure I totally understand what you are saying about the front/ back rings. Did you try swapping the front and back rings? Edited by WestOfPecos - September/17/2010 at 22:11 |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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I wasnt sure what to try. The picture of the rings shows a rounded bottom but these are flat. Someone suggested shims in the front but I feel like I would be putting a bandaid on the problem.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Nice gun and scope choice combo there. I have to say that considering the fact that the rifle receiver is a flat top, and the scope has 108 moa adjustment. This is perplexing. The lone thing I can come up with would be that the mounts are not of the same height, and they should be. You should shoot the gun at 100 yards and see where she hits. Hopefully she hits high, and you can adjust accordingly, and not worry about the 50 yard zero.
If this is still a problem out at 100 yards, then take the mount down, and compare the scope rings for identical height. Unless they were built with moa in them (which I doubt) they should be the same. If they are not then you have the culprit. Incidently this would not be the first time rings of different heights were sold as a matching pair. It has happened to me. I caught it before mounting, but if I hadn't I would have been scratching my watch and winding my ass too.
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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Cyborg....I was thinking outloud to my wife and said hopefully they are two different sizes/heights rings. I must admitt that my first shot at 25 yards could have been 3 or 4 feet low. I thought I missed real high so next shot was aimed towards the bottom of the target and the round hit 3 feet infront in the dirt. I will take the off and try to do some measurements.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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The rings are both identical in size. Each marked LS44 on bottom.... what ever that means. I ran scope back to center of elevation and I might switch bases/rings front to rear and give it another try. This could get expensive at $1.25 a round. If I shimmed the rear and Im hitting low, doesnt shimming the rear point the scope even lower?
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stickbow46
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: January/07/2009 Location: Benton, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4678 |
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I have 9 pairs of Talley rings on 6 different rifles & have never had a problem!Have you tried calling Talley,they have tremendous customer care?Also have you checked to see if your rifle mount is truly squared?
What was the amount of toque you applied to the ring screws,I hope it wasn't more than 18-20ft lbs. as that is what Talley reccommends,also 25 ft lbs on the base screws!
Good luck.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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To raise the muzzle, you have to raise the rear of the tube. Raising the muzzle raises the poi of the round. Think of it like this. If you are looking at something and want to shoot over it do you not raise the muzzle above the line of sight? Is this also the same as raising the distance between yourself and the rear of the receiver? In both cases the answer to the question is yes.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Scope
____________ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ line of sight_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
_______________________________________ _ _ _ _bullet trajectory _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Receiver Muzzle
Raising the back of the scope here shows that it causes the line of sight to intersect the bullet trajectory. This is raising the elevation of the bullets trajectory to or above the line of sight.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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stickbow46
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: January/07/2009 Location: Benton, Pa Status: Offline Points: 4678 |
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Very good explination William!
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Pearls of Wisdom are Heard not Spoken
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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Thanks bro.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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rightwingnut
Optics GrassHopper Joined: August/30/2010 Location: MI Status: Offline Points: 30 |
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I just ran a square over the receiver and barrel. The top of the end of the barrel is a good 3/4 of inch lower than the receiver. I would think this could be the problem. Its a very noticeable slope once you lay a square/flat edge along top of reveiver.
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cyborg
Optics God Gaseous Clay Joined: August/24/2007 Location: North Georgia Status: Offline Points: 12288 |
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That is probably due to the wall thickness of the receiver and barrel area. Compounded by the barrels contour/taper. The only thing would be to check the bore alignment with the receiver, which will be difficult without the right tools. If you have a laser bore sight, you could essentially set the scope at dead zero and check to see what the difference is on paper. This may help us in getting an answer for the problem. Right now we're all kinda grasping at straws.
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With Freedom comes great responsibility, you cannot have one without the other
An armed public are citizens. A disarmed public are subjects. OATH KEEPER #8233 Support us, and join our cause. Cyborg |
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WestOfPecos
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/08/2010 Status: Offline Points: 240 |
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RWN - It's quite normal for the end of the barrel to be lower than the receiver top. You are not mounting your rings on the barrel, just the receiver. Do you have a set of calipers? Can you measure the rings and find out if they are exactly identical? You don't need to to dismount the rings for that.
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