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Outdoor Life 2010 Optics Test |
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snakeman48
Optics Apprentice Joined: March/29/2010 Location: SW Lower Mich Status: Offline Points: 129 |
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Not much love for Leupold on this sight................Just saying
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NRA Benefactor Member. Veteran; US Army 5th Corps 1970-1972
The only time in my life when I got to Rock-N-Roll, and the ammo was free!! |
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Sapper524
Optics Apprentice Joined: January/25/2010 Status: Offline Points: 218 |
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This is my opinion of Leupold currently, They are joining the ranks of once great optics makers now selling their Name with cheap Asian parts and quality is modest. Simmons, Redfield, BSA, Millet, etc. I now trust in US Optics
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Randall45
Optics Apprentice Joined: June/25/2009 Status: Offline Points: 284 |
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At least they put Vortex and Alpen on the list.Meopro is a nice scope which got good mention.I wonder how that list would appear if some of the forum members were doing the Test.And the winner is L%$*&#@!!!
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3_tens
Optics Jedi Master Joined: January/08/2007 Location: Oklahoma Status: Offline Points: 7853 |
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Most of the issues with Leupold is from VX-III before they brought out the VX-3 last year. Leupold finally upgraded the quality of there glass. Problem is they waited so long before doing it they lost a lot of their following and acquired a unfavorable reputation. They were not the best for several years. It hurt them. Only time will tell if they are willing to learn second best is not the best only competitive.
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Folks ain't got a sense of humor no more. They don't laugh they just get sore.
Need to follow the rules. Just hard to determine which set of rules to follow Now the rules have changed again. |
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Longhunter
Optics Journeyman Joined: February/02/2006 Status: Offline Points: 466 |
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Objective test results should usually be presented separately from subjective opinions. When the two are intermixed, the results are less useful for obvious reasons. Your tastes and needs may differ considerably from mine. You will notice that Burris is not included in this test, and has been missing for a number of years. I don't blame them. They received some scathingly unfair reviews in prior years based primarily on subjective opinions.
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Kickboxer
MODERATOR Moderator Joined: February/13/2008 Status: Offline Points: 23679 |
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A review is an evaluation, which generally in the case of rifle scopes, is a study designed to assist an audience in the assessment of the value of an object in as objective a manner as possible. Everyone carries prejudices of some sort into an evaluation of this sort and a rifle scope's "merit" cannot be completely determined in a sterile, purely objective environment because the criteria required in such an assessment would have no meaning for a general audience. Faith in the objectivity of the reviewer is key. If the reviewer carries some bias toward one aspect or another, one product or another, it will surface within the review.
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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.
There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living |
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billyburl2
Optics Master Extraordinaire Joined: January/08/2009 Location: Cottonwood, AZ Status: Offline Points: 4015 |
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If it is tourist season, why can't we shoot them?
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snakeman48
Optics Apprentice Joined: March/29/2010 Location: SW Lower Mich Status: Offline Points: 129 |
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I looked on the newsstand for it yesterday. Didn't see any issues with the review mentioned.
What month is it in? |
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NRA Benefactor Member. Veteran; US Army 5th Corps 1970-1972
The only time in my life when I got to Rock-N-Roll, and the ammo was free!! |
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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No love for Leupold from me, I've broken 2 of the best scopes they ever made, so my money buys other optics: always better, sometimes cheaper.
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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn. Equality is something you whine about not being given. |
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JGRaider
Optics Master Joined: February/06/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1540 |
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I understand and can agree with the apples vs oranges argument, but I still always find some useful information when reading things like this. I'm hard pressed to say they do these tests with any kind of bias, as it cannot be proven to me that they do. I can believe the VX3 earning an A+, as Mule Deer (JB) has done the testing himself and is very, very impressed with the new glass in that model. I can also believe that the Leupold Kenai spotter has fantastic glass, as the Chinese inarguably do make world class glass today. I believe I read somewhere the main thing they disliked about the Zeiss riflescope was the illuminated reticle situation. The only Leupold product I currently own is the GR HD binos, BTW so no bias here.
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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"No bias" is not possible, given the the circumstances, for anyone. There is a "pride in ownership" aspect to things that prevents any product owner from complete objectivity. There are mechanisms by which bias can be eliminated, but most testers choose to avoid those mechanisms BECAUSE they do take bias out. People are inherently stupid, point them toward a shiny object and they fail to notice the rest of the world around them. The trick to testing things is to be honest with yourself and about the product. "No bias" is possible, but people only think they want that. Edited by Rancid Coolaid - June/09/2010 at 19:51 |
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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn. Equality is something you whine about not being given. |
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JGRaider
Optics Master Joined: February/06/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1540 |
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Whatever.
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RifleDude
MODERATOR EVIL OPPRESSOR Joined: October/13/2006 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 16337 |
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For argument's sake, let's say the OL tests are entirely objective, with no bias involved whatsoever. We have no way of knowing for certain, either way.
Still, what I absolutely hate about those annual OL equipment "reviews" is they don't give the reader much information at all, so I find them to be almost useless. They sum up their results with a few scores and a couple of very brief, generalized comments. I haven't read this particular issue, but in past issues, they gave the reader little or no information on how the scores were arrived at, what specific qualities elevated or subtracted from the product's scores, and how the categories are weighted to arrive at their final results. Their rankings seem to frequently contradict their scores with no explanation of why. I don't necessarily think they are letting their biases get in the way of objectivity, I just think they do a crappy job of reviewing products. I would even be o.k. with all subjective evaluations of product performance, if they would at least explain in detail how they came to their conclusions. Maybe their approach appeals to a general audience, but not to a gearaholic like me.
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Ted
Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle. |
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JGRaider
Optics Master Joined: February/06/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1540 |
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You'll be pleasantly surprised to find out the criteria for testing, scoring, and methods for the testing this time.
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300S&W
Optics God Joined: January/27/2008 Location: Burlington,WV Status: Offline Points: 10592 |
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I sure hope so. I'm waiting for the mag in the mail.
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"I ain't got time to bleed!"
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KrazeLegs
Optics Apprentice Joined: May/17/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 92 |
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Past OL reviews always seem to highly rate Weaver and Pentax optics for some reason. The Minox products seem to be rated lower than they should be.
I think the Dark Lord of Optics is truly humbled by the OL optical staff and their expertise!! Just kidding. OL seems to somehow rate the products in a without regards to the true optical quality. That said, at least you can get an idea of what is new to the market.
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300S&W
Optics God Joined: January/27/2008 Location: Burlington,WV Status: Offline Points: 10592 |
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"at least you can get an idea of what is new to the market."
Yea that's how I look at it to.
I'm really hoping that OL stepped up to the plate with a more hi-tech approach this time. I've read quite a few of JG's posts over the years and if he's saying we'll be "pleasantly surprised" then I'm looking forward to reading the article.
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"I ain't got time to bleed!"
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SVT_Tactical
MODERATOR Chief Sackscratch Joined: December/17/2009 Location: NorthCackalacky Status: Offline Points: 31233 |
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E, you should have it today. I would hope |
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"Most folks are about as happy as they make their minds up to be" - Abraham Lincoln
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300S&W
Optics God Joined: January/27/2008 Location: Burlington,WV Status: Offline Points: 10592 |
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"I ain't got time to bleed!"
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JGRaider
Optics Master Joined: February/06/2008 Status: Offline Points: 1540 |
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At least I was pleasantly surprised to find they spelled out exactly how things were tested and scored. |
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