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Topic ClosedParallax-letting the genie out of the bottle again

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pyro6999 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 12:56
damn good shooting wouter ole boy.
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

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God Bless Chris Ledoux
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 12:59
He does pretty good for an old guy don't he Hunter.
God save the Empire!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 13:01
id say craig, he would kick my butt all day long! i dont think i could shoot that good at 300yds
They call me "Boots"
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Jon A View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 13:43
Originally posted by 8shots 8shots wrote:

For longer distances a lot of other factors come into play, such as type of rest available (rock, tree etc), wind etc. Parallax is not one of them.


If you really don't mind missing, I guess it isn't.  I do mind missing.  Haven't done it in a very long time.

Quote Was that you in the video clip!!!!! Gee, did not know that. Man, I would have stopped this thread a long time ago!!


Darn.  I should have made sure you understood that.  Think of all the fun we could have avoided!

Quote I cannot do that because the scope focus will be out. I will be unable to see a target 350yds out.


Just turn the power down, it'll come into focus.  You don't need 25X for 400 yds either.
Quote Match Results


I see, asking to see my target was just a ploy to give you an excuse to post those.      Excellent      Nice shooting.      Thunbs Up     But of course, unless you shot all those matches on 25X with the parallax set at 100...they mean what to this discussion?   Thought so.        Loco

And just so you know, 8" plates at a max of 400 yds ≠ Long Range Precision which is how the subject originally came up.  In fact, the way you describe the matches you do I'd probably like to use my 4X ACOG with the JP reticle.  That thing is fast...and plenty precise for a 8" plate at 400 yds.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 16:09
So let me get this right......a 3X15X42 scope w/out an AO whose parallax adjustment comes from the factory at 100m, would be just fine for shooting up to 400 yrds?  Scope in question is the new Minox Za5.

Now I am completely confused.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 16:14
Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

id say craig, he would kick my butt all day long! i dont think i could shoot that good at 300yds
 
We definitely want him on OUR side!  Dead-eye Le Roux!  Excellent
"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
--Thomas Jefferson



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 16:15
Originally posted by budperm budperm wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

id say craig, he would kick my butt all day long! i dont think i could shoot that good at 300yds
 
We definitely want him on OUR side!  Dead-eye Le Roux!  Excellent
 
Second that
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 20:30
Yes, I do.  This discussion began in the context of hunting.  If you aren't about that sure of hitting the vital zone with your first shot, you should not take it.   And that's the first shot cold.  After a few shots to dope the wind, unless the conditions are really terrible there's really no excuse for missing with a rifle you think is good enough to take a game animal with at that range.
Couldn't agree more -- as far as it goes. when does not be sure actually stop taking the shot? This is such an open ended statement its not even addressable.
skywalker -- it depends on the size of the target and the rig, the parallax error must be within the cone of fire, or dispersion of the rig.
Alot of 3 gun shooters, have a hash mark on their aos about 300 yds, and dial mag, back for movers and closer targets, it depends on how much overlap the ao has on the scope your using.
Jon -- the first thing one learns about doping wind in other peoples zip codes, is that its never constant, doping wind in this area means you have it down to between 10 and 20 mph.
Part of the problem I had , was the wind actually moving the pickup. Given a prone, on a fairly good day, there is no doubt I could do it cold bore, 500-600 yds isn't that hard of a shot, mostly because you haven't given any time constraints in your discussion.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 20:45
Boy, I've read through this thread and all I can say is some of you guys are killing the spirit of hunting as I know it.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/19/2010 at 22:59
Deer, mulies, elk........would be the target...
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 00:50
Originally posted by SVT_Tactical SVT_Tactical wrote:

Originally posted by budperm budperm wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

id say craig, he would kick my butt all day long! i dont think i could shoot that good at 300yds
 
We definitely want him on OUR side!  Dead-eye Le Roux!  Excellent
 
Second that
 
Thanks for the kind words. I must say that I posted that with reservation. Unfortunately the thread kinda overrode my better judgement.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 00:52
Round 15.....I am outa here.
 
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 06:30
Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

doping wind in this area means you have it down to between 10 and 20 mph.  Part of the problem I had , was the wind actually moving the pickup.

If the wind was that bad, why did you think the comparison would yield any useful information?
Quote mostly because you haven't given any time constraints in your discussion.

Dale, really, I luv you man.  But geeze, if you aren't going to read what is written the discussion becomes quite tiresome.  From this thread alone:
Originally posted by Jon A Jon A wrote:

If you need to shoot quickly,

Originally posted by Jon A Jon A wrote:

because you didn't take the time and go to the extreme effort required to center the reticle in the middle of the error zone as he described above,

Originally posted by Jon A Jon A wrote:

can take some time and deliberately apply specific additional techniques that will allow him to still make the shot (at 400 yds at least).  If he's in too big a hurry or forgets in the blur of pressure,

Originally posted by Jon A Jon A wrote:

With shots taken from odd field positions from uneven terrain when you only had a couple seconds to shoot?

Time constraints was one of the most important things I've been talking about.  If your scope has a significant amount of parallax error at the distance you're shooting, that's something else you need to spend time thinking about, something else you need to spend time ensuring you negate with your shooting technique.  This time is in addition to the time you need to think about everything else you need to do to make the shot.  Failure to do so risks increasing the size of your "cone of fire."

Guys, my goodness.  I can only ask you take a step back and ask yourselves why you're trying to argue whatever it is you're trying to argue.  Arguments for the sake of stubbornness beyond all reason abound all over the internet; I halfway expect somebody to interject here at any moment that all one needs to do is "focus a scope correctly" and parallax is never a problem...but hopefully people aren't that far off the deepend yet.

But arguing a scope condition which results in the reticle dancing up, down and all around on the target with every twitch of the eyeball is the ideal condition for accuracy?  That it makes absolutely no difference in any way and doesn't make it more difficult to place a shot quickly and accurately at all?  

Really, it's beyond silliness.  Please, take a step back and think about what you're saying.  I can only do so much.


Edited by Jon A - January/20/2010 at 06:32
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 06:34
............and we thank you for it Jon
God save the Empire!
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 06:43
No Jon A, you are being the ass.
It has been proven you can shoot well enough without an AO. 
No-one can  focus an AO in a couple of seconds and still pull the shot off,  so your "quickly" will also be impossible.
 
We have all made various statements, some correct, some wrong and some unproven. In a forum, make your point and let it go. A adult reader can sift the chaff from the wheat himself.
 
Hopefully you have said it all now.
 
PS, you are the Great Shot. Go and test a scope with and without parallax like we did and give us your honest feedback.
 


Edited by 8shots - January/20/2010 at 06:45
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 07:20
Not an asshole...but a whole ass!
Talk about beat a dead horse!  Szzzz.  Ed couldn't do better! Wink
"Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading".
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/20/2010 at 09:15
"I don't need no stinkin Badges"
Jon-- everybody would like the "perfect shot" it just doesn't happen. Thats what your talking about. Regardless of training and equipment there will be a random error to bite you in the butt. There isn't to time to think, in competition or fast hunting.  Even when cold bore first shots do come through, the good action shooter trains for the second shot. The post started out seated in the hunting situation, I brought in action shooting because the parallax problems, sighting systems problems, have been devleoped, known and used for 20 years in action shooting.
Anytime I can shoot 90% hits at 600 yds, in 20 degree weather off the hood of truck, with a 10-15 mph diagonal wind with out regard to the parallax setting tells me everything I need to know about your comments . Your idea of quick and mine vary by about 3 mins. (about enough time for your fingers to freeze from the chill factor in this case). I still suggest you put yourself on a Pact timer to see if your "seconds" agrees with the timer.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2010 at 06:26
Dont know if were on the same thread anymore, BUT in the old days when I was competeing in BR the scope I had would not perfectly correct for paralax in the vertical plane. And a 1/16" was important to score shooting.  The fix other than apprenticeing to Leupold and sendind it to myself to repair was to put a cap over the ocular and cutting a slit in it to limit the vertical range of eye movement. Thats the same thing as keeping your eye dead center on a non AO scope. If the eye remains centered then there is no parallax. Pretty simple -huh?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2010 at 10:49
l'explication simple est toujours la meilleure
Let me give you my two scents worth
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2010 at 11:04
Exactement!
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