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Is what I think I want what I need?

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Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 16:53
5x


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - November/23/2009 at 17:02

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 16:58

"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:09
By the way, it appears the reticle does have a clear, plastic post supporting the triangle.  The way light from my laser designator reflects and refracts, it is definitely a solid post.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:15
10931 Zeiss 3-12x56 Tactical Hensoldt 3302989001, Matte finish, Illuminated Mil Dot reticle, 2nd focal plane, 34mm tube, fast focus eye piece, side focus, 0.1 MRAD adjustments, light ring marks, close to new condition $3,580.00 $2,699.95
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opeagle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:18
 I have looked through Trijicon glass before and I though it looked real good, however I do not have a good frame of reference beyond Leupold.  I have TA 47-2 and TA 47-6 on a couple of AR's and I really like them.

 Are all Trijicon Accupoints MOA knobs?  I think they are.

 Great suggestions.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:19
Originally posted by Rancid Coolaid Rancid Coolaid wrote:

By the way, it appears the reticle does have a clear, plastic post supporting the triangle.  The way light from my laser designator reflects and refracts, it is definitely a solid post.
There is something going on there that makes its post look odd at times but at night oh my God its awesome---- it's very cool at night under existing urban lighting and still useable even at 20x.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:21
they are all 1/4 moa clicks and I ripped the Trijicon LE guys for not putting more internal adjustment into it had a long review of it that I went over with them and they actually have those changes on the drawing board but takes about 3 yrs to get them to the field.
 
Aparently the mildot and crosshair versions do not suffer the odd look of the reticle where the post lines do not appear straight and equal width under all conditions.  I would suggest the mil dot but the illuminated post is the fastest of gunfight scope reticles as it will work with the bindon aiming concept where the mil dot wont.


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - November/23/2009 at 17:23

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:32
I have to tell you though that I am extremely happy with my two  3-9x42 Super Sniper scopes and my 10x HD Super Sniper.  If your shooting was not likely to be under 100 yds I would suggest the 10x as it has adjustable parallax but 6x seems about right to me and in fact I put a Leupold heavy duplex  FX3  6x42 on a 300 WM  R5 Mil Spec untill I can afford another true tactical scope.  One could order a FX3 6x42 with M1 tactical knobs from Leupold Custom but for what it would cost the SS 3-9 is a better choice.  If you have not ever had a 1/10 mil scope it is a huge improvement to zero or correct fire as you measure in mils with the reticle and dial correction in mils with no conversion errors.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opeagle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:40
Originally posted by Dale Clifford Dale Clifford wrote:

Why set up a 1,000 yard gun that will shoot 500-yards weekly and 1,000 yards only once or twice a year?
right on the mark-- lot of difference between a "patrol rifle" and a full set up tactical rifle. patrol rifle doesn't vary much from a hunting rifle. after taking the class you will have better handle on what you really need. One question that may guide your direction, will you be needing to make head shots at 500 yds?

 Excellent question.  500 yard head shots, not likely.       I should clarify this rifle will not replace the AR or the Shotgun in the cruiser, rather supplement them.

 If only the 3-9 SS was illuminated.....  Wonder what the price point would be?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 17:51
As far as long range shooting goes, I will definitely defer to the guys who already posted on this thread.  They have more experience.

Still, I'll add a few comments.

1) Optical quality: RC got it right, I think.  USO occasionally makes great glass and occasionally makes duds.  Their glass is inconsistent.  Variable SS 3-9x42 gets pretty close to IOR glass quality and has nice and wide field of view.

2) IOR: IOR is very good in making well established designs and seems to make occasional mishaps on the newer and more complicated stuff.  They have been making 2.5-10x42FFP for a long time and I would not worry about is durability.

3) If you are new to long range shooting, get a Super Sniper 3-9x42. Until you start shooting very far and get very good at it, the scope is not going to be your limiting factor.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 18:02
  I'm running a leupold FX3 6x42 heavy duplex on my 300 WM R5 mil spec the reticle is heavy enough to not need illumination at night and its 7mm exit eye pupil is as bright as it gets and I can still dial in correction with the knobs but not as easily as with covered target or open M1 knobs .  The problem is the only perfect scopes are the Heinsoldt and the Premier.
Leupold 6x42 FX-3 Riflescope Heavy Duplex Leupold 6x42 FX-3 Riflescope
Stock # - LEU66810
  • Matte
  • Heavy Duplex
  • 1"
  • Xtended Twilight Lens System
$379.95 
Add Leupold 6x42 FX-3 Riflescope to Cart 


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - November/23/2009 at 18:04

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RONK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 18:25
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

IOR is having a new version of the 2.5-10x FFP out any day now to.  It is suppose to upgrade all the old unwanted features from the current version.  
 
 Unwanted features?
 Such as what?
 I'm asking seriously because I have one, and and LOVE it.  It was the only 2.5-10-class, Mil/Mil, illumminated reticle scope of excellent glass quality and covered turrets under 2 grand that know of.
 The new Super Sniper3-9x is probably a competitor (and at a lower price), but not if you want/need covered turrets and illumination...
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 338LAPUASLAP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 18:30
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 20:22
Originally posted by RONK RONK wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

IOR is having a new version of the 2.5-10x FFP out any day now to.  It is suppose to upgrade all the old unwanted features from the current version.  
 
 Unwanted features?
 Such as what?
 I'm asking seriously because I have one, and and LOVE it.  It was the only 2.5-10-class, Mil/Mil, illumminated reticle scope of excellent glass quality and covered turrets under 2 grand that know of.
 The new Super Sniper3-9x is probably a competitor (and at a lower price), but not if you want/need covered turrets and illumination...
 


The knobs leave a lot to be desired as they only turn .5 something per turn instead of an even 5.  I think it was 4.5 per turn, that is one of the reasons I did not care for my FFP IOR.  Once you go past one turn it is hard to keep track of where you are.  Plus the knobs are very small and hard to grab  a hold of with gloves.  Also when you grab them many times you can cover up the numbers unless you just use your finger tips.

The illumination is horrible and worthless in that scope. way to bright even in the lowest setting. 

The new one has exposed (which you won't like, but most tac shooters will) 5 mil per turn which will be larger and easier to get a hold of.  The illumination is suppose to be improved and work better. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RONK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 20:54
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

Originally posted by RONK RONK wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

IOR is having a new version of the 2.5-10x FFP out any day now to.  It is suppose to upgrade all the old unwanted features from the current version.  
 
 Unwanted features?
 Such as what?
 I'm asking seriously because I have one, and and LOVE it.  It was the only 2.5-10-class, Mil/Mil, illumminated reticle scope of excellent glass quality and covered turrets under 2 grand that know of.
 The new Super Sniper3-9x is probably a competitor (and at a lower price), but not if you want/need covered turrets and illumination...
 


The knobs leave a lot to be desired as they only turn .5 something per turn instead of an even 5.  I think it was 4.5 per turn, that is one of the reasons I did not care for my FFP IOR.  Once you go past one turn it is hard to keep track of where you are.  Plus the knobs are very small and hard to grab  a hold of with gloves.  Also when you grab them many times you can cover up the numbers unless you just use your finger tips.

The illumination is horrible and worthless in that scope. way to bright even in the lowest setting. 

The new one has exposed (which you won't like, but most tac shooters will) 5 mil per turn which will be larger and easier to get a hold of.  The illumination is suppose to be improved and work better. 
 Okay, I'll agree about the 4.5 mil/turn thing probably being annoying to someone who counts turns instead of clicks, but everything else you mentioned isin my opinion rather subjective and very debatable. The illumination is too bright on the highest settings with a new battery, but there are eleven settings and the lower ones are very usable, at least to my eyes.
 I haven't found the knobs on mine to be anything but very easy to grasp and turn with cold hands or gloves on. Solid and crisp clicks, too.
 The glass is exceptional, the build is rock-solid. Fast-focus eyepiece very simple and easy to adjust. MP-8 is one of the better ranging reticles, by many accounts, (and THE best by some.)
 
To each his own , I guess.
 
 Not knocking on you,either. I know you do a lot more serious tactical training than I do, Jason, and I respect your insights.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/23/2009 at 20:59
Originally posted by 338LAPUASLAP 338LAPUASLAP wrote:

TRIJICONx2
   Cool  Your right that the ticket up close.
 
He's already there: one dot one amber triangle:
     "I have TA 47-2 and TA 47-6 on a couple of AR's and I really like them."
 
I'm there too:  TA442  1.5x amber triangle & TA50R4  3x red crosshair.
 
Now he wants LOOONG RANGE.Sharp Shooter
10931 Zeiss 3-12x56 Tactical Hensoldt 3302989001, Matte finish, Illuminated Mil Dot reticle, 2nd focal plane, 34mm tube, fast focus eye piece, side focus, 0.1 MRAD adjustments, light ring marks, close to new condition $3,580.00 $2,699.95

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/24/2009 at 09:26
Your right, a lot of this is subjective, and based on personal use.  But all these are complaints I have and have heard over and over again about that scope and other IOR scopes.  And obviously since IOR keeps changing all their scopes this way a lot people must be requesting these changes.  IOR scope have changed a lot in the last 2 or 3 years.

In low light or dark on the lowest setting the ill fills the whole scope with a red haze and makes it harder to see the target.  I have had 6 different IOR .ill scopes and every one of them did that, so for me it just never worked.  That is a big complaint from a lot of people about IOR is the ill.  I think a lot of ill scopes miss the mark on that aspect as well though. 

Some probably like the knobs as you do.  I thought they were okay til I got a couple IORs with the newer knobs.  At that point I no longer cared for the old knobs, the newer bigger ones are much easier to use IMO.  Esepcially the big knob they have on some of the scopes now.  You can reach over 900 yards with a single turn with the .308.  Really sitting there counting clicks would just take way to long for tactical shooting or in many cases hunting.  That is what the numbers are for, if you need to go up 6.5 mils then just turn it to that number.  Counting 65 clicks is just not how knobs like that are meant to be used, you could get lost really easy doing that.

I will agree with the glass I love it and that is one of the biggest reasons I like IORs.  The new 2.5-10x has new coatings which I believe is brand new for IOR, that should make it even better.  And the MP8 dot reticle I love as well. 

I don't care for any of these stupid fast focus eye pieces on most scopes these days.  I don't see the point at all.  You are suppose to set it for your eye and leave it a lone.  So why make them turn so easy?  All mine are always getting turned and moved around.  Thank goodness I use butler creek caps so I can see when it has moved.  Leupold got theirs correct IMO.  You adjust it quickly and it locks in place, that cannot beat that IMO.

Well anyway, I guess I hijacked the thread enough.  Wink
   

Edited by supertool73 - November/24/2009 at 10:34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote opeagle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/24/2009 at 10:02
 Not a hijack IMO.

 It's posts like this concerning IOR that help people make choices.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/24/2009 at 10:42
Here are some pics of the new IOR 2.5-10x. Looks pretty nice, a lot of my issues appear to have been resolved.  They still did not put a parallax adjustment on it though.  I always wanted one.  

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1456406&gonew=1#UNREAD


Edited by supertool73 - November/24/2009 at 10:42
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/24/2009 at 10:45
It looks like that IOR might have everything you want except the zero stop.  The illuminated center dot looks very nice, and should resolve the to much ill issue. 

I still think the SS 3-9x will be just as good of a scope though for a lot less money.  But if you really need ill the IOR might be the ticket.  
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